[SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

[Zohar]

I'm glad to hear you're OK.

You're pretty brave for going through all the things you have, and you're strong for willing to indulge your family. Realize that it will take them time to accept who you are, to understand that you're not that much different where it really matters. And therapy could very well help you, and if the don't instruct you to go to some quack, the therapist will probably be supportive of you and help you deal with your family.

Oh, and happy belated birthday.

[Sandry]

hefty stuff

*hugs* if you want them. I hope you're still able to get support, regardless of the "embargo", and that your family comes to accept your decisions.

Thinking positive thoughts for you, anyhow, and I agree with what Zohar said. You do seem very brave to me.

[Jessica]

*hugs* if you want them. And happy 18th!

[Aaeriele]

Okay, embargo is over. That’s it. I’m posting. Wall of text ahead.

~snip~

tl:dr; I’m selling the rights to my auto-biography to any takers trying to get new ideas for soaps.

Oh, wow. @_@ *huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge hugs*

It seems wrong of them to tell you that you aren't allowed to communicate with people. And sadly, I hear that line about "you were depressed when you made this choice, so that's probably why you made it" far too often. :/ All of that sounds more like they don't want to admit that it could possibly be true, and are looking for excuses to dismiss it.

Sorry you're having to go through all this, but you've shown incredible strength so far. <3

Happy belated birthday as well.

[joshz]

*tight hugs*
...testosterone therapy? Gaaaah. That's so...wrong and backwards and blehhhh. I really hope youer (made-up feminine 2nd person pronoun, for the curious) family adjusts to the idea as soon as possible.

(and, of course, in addition to the ones I tried to send via text on the correct day, have some more (now belated) birthday wishes!)

[Monika]

*megahugs* Emi.

Your parents seem to be confusing cause and effect . I sure hope they wisen up some time soon.

If they don't fast ... well, you are in college in a couple of months where they don't have to see you wearing the clothes you like.

Happy belated 18th birthday!

As you are an adult now, nobody can give you T against your will.

[Kewangji]

*hugs* times a million for Emi.

[Sarr]

*All of the hugs*
I hope that your folks come around fairly soon. I think that you're right in that probably feel ashamed by it, which is a really depressing commentary on today's society.

But that aside, *hugs*, I'm glad you're ok, and happy birthday.

[Brace]

Don't take testosterone. Even if it means your parents/family etc don't think you're "trying". It's not your job to satisfy them, and odds are you can't anyways. Don't damage your body for the sake of trying to satisfy stubborn, insatiable people. You're 18 now. Get a job and/or student loans, move out, go to college, find a specialized, sympathetic therapist and if you can't, self-medicate. For serious. But FFS don't get caught up in other people's games.

[Aaeriele]

Also, I actually just came across this a few days ago, perhaps it might be useful to you Emi?

http://www.hrc.org/documents/transgende ... _guide.pdf

Edit: +1: http://community.pflag.org/Document.Doc?id=202

[Bassoon]

Oh my god, Emi. *hugs*

[Wyvern]

stuff

[Vaniver]

NecklaceOfShadow:

Spoiler:

They want me to keep my mind “open.” Because I reached my decision in November, under the grasp of fairly serious depression and stuffs, they think that that’s affected my thought process and that it’s the reason I feel the way I feel. I don’t fit into the usual mold of transgendered people in that I don’t believe I’ve had thoughts about being misgendered my whole life and so they think that’s additional evidence in their favor.

This is an area where it's fairly easy to meet them halfway. You can try something like "Ok, I will keep my mind open and recalculate my decision. These are the factors I'm interested in, this is the evidence I have. What additional evidence do you think I need to come to a conclusion?" Hopefully you can push on the open mind thing in practice as well as principle, because I think if they understand what's behind your decision they'll be more supportive than just looking at your conclusion makes them.

One of the questions I got a few times was "if you're a virgin, how can you be sure you're gay?" I demurred, but those questions can be settled with a "well, arousal is pretty obvious, even without having sex." That sort of openness can be somewhat awkward, but the specificity is what helps it be convincing.

[NecklaceOfShadow]

I was slightly ticked off when I wrote that and I don't think that I've represented everything in a completely accurate way. Things are better in some ways than I've described.

Thanks for the hugs, though. *hug*

This is something I keep running into. I can't help but feel that I'm invalid as a trans person because I haven't felt this way forever. I read accounts of people who've realized this since they were really young and I think there must be something wrong with me, even though I try to deny it...

[SecondTalon]

And I know a gay dude who didn't realize he was gay until well after he'd gotten married. Some people come with their shit figured out. Some people take time. Some people never do. No shame in being in the second camp, so long as you don't end up being in the last.

[Aaeriele]

This is something I keep running into. I can't help but feel that I'm invalid as a trans person because I haven't felt this way forever. I read accounts of people who've realized this since they were really young and I think there must be something wrong with me, even though I try to deny it...

You are not invalid in the slightest. To adapt a cheesy cliche, the one thing that is certain for trans people is that nothing is certain. Some people figure out it earlier, some people figure it out later. Some people figure it out really late (I've heard of one person who didn't figure it out till they something like 60, and transitioned then). Gender is a complicated thing, and it's natural to have some doubts when you don't match up exactly to the stereotypical case, but really, the stereotype is a poor one. There's a lot more variation out there than it seems.

[joshz]

I was slightly ticked off when I wrote that and I don't think that I've represented everything in a completely accurate way. Things are better in some ways than I've described.

Thanks for the hugs, though. *hug*

This is something I keep running into. I can't help but feel that I'm invalid as a trans person because I haven't felt this way forever. I read accounts of people who've realized this since they were really young and I think there must be something wrong with me, even though I try to deny it...

*hug*. It doesn't matter, really, when youe found out. The fact that it took youe longer than some trans people to come to this conclusion (or even to start suspecting that conclusion) in no way invalidates that conclusion-it just means that youe're not exactly the same as them.

[Wyvern]

Not everyone has always known. All I knew was that I was different somehow. Sure, I had issues relating with people in general, but I was completely fine with being a little boy. It wasn't till people started expecting me to suddenly be a man that I got all "wtf eww no" at it all. Didn't stop me from being absolutely miserable ever since puberty, but yeah, I didn't know. Everyone is different.

Also try to remember about that, is that the "I've always known, ever since I was a little kid I knew it was wrong" thing is part of the script. The script that people have for ages, told and retold to therapists and such to convince them that they're trans enough to be allowed to transition. It's what therapists are generally looking for too, and expecting to hear. And knowing that, many many many many many people have simply lied, and said that it was that way anyway. Pretended that it was so in order to get what they wanted, what they needed. Because they had to.

That's all it is, really, a stereotype. And we all know how those work.

[NecklaceOfShadow]

But at least you found out by yourself. I found out because of a freaking manga. You felt that something was wrong by yourself. I read a stupid story and it made me think and in two weeks, I made my decision. That's asinine, isn't it?

[Aaeriele]

But at least you found out by yourself. I found out because of a freaking manga. You felt that something was wrong by yourself. I read a stupid story and it made me think and in two weeks, I made my decision. That's asinine, isn't it?

I'm not sure how that's really different? The manga didn't have anything written in it that said "oh, by the way, if your name is XYZ and you live at 123 ABC Lane, you're trans," did it? Most trans people had some kind of event or stimulus that pushed them over the edge of realization, that doesn't mean they didn't figure it out on their own. Self-realization is just that, no matter what kicks it off or how it happens.


Edit: In fact, I know one person who's part of the trans group over on the Escapist forums that also had a particular manga be the thing that turned on the lightbulb in their head. You're not alone in that regard.

[joshz]

*hugs*. It doesn't matter how youe arrived at youer realization. Youe did. The fact that youe realized so quickly, if anything, makes it more valid-it felt right to youe, so youe were able to identify with it in a seemingly short time.

[Sourire]

But at least you found out by yourself. I found out because of a freaking manga. You felt that something was wrong by yourself. I read a stupid story and it made me think and in two weeks, I made my decision. That's asinine, isn't it?

For such a great mathemagician, your proof skills are lacking.

First off, let's not refer to it as a decision. That seems to imply...choice. Popular consensus, especially around these parts, is that you didn't get one. I prefer the term realization. And now that I'm done being semantic, let's look at this for what it is. We tend to empathize with other people (or characterizations of people). It's the reason that so much of our present industry is structured the way it is. Khaos fills a rather...sparse space in contemporary society. It's not often that you get queer-positive images, and I find it no surprise that after such an image was introduced, you could react to that.

In a crude analogy, take clothing. Say you have a favorite shirt, because it fits just right and the seams are flattering in all the right places, and the fabric feels good against your skin. You brought it home from the store and were immediately happy with it. One day you see someone with the same shirt, but it's in a different color! A color that would bring out your eyes/complexion. When you went to the store, you didn't see this color-otherwise you surely would not have bought the one you did. It's not that there's anything wrong with your original choice, it just isn't as you. By being exposed to a new possibility in a positive light, you've had the chance to make a realization that I think very few would argue is "asinine".

And for the record, I'm not attempting to say that people choose gender identity. The store in my analogy relates to self-examination.

PS-For what it's worth, a lot of my current gender identity is based off of Chris Crocker. And that's arguably substantially more asinine than Khaos.

[NecklaceOfShadow]

As much as I love Khaos, it's not a manga. I referred to this.

[Sourire]

As much as I love Khaos, it's not a manga. I referred to this.

In all seriousness, does that in any way deter you from the rest of what I had said? I'm not as familiar with this series, but I will read through it if there's something specific to it that's relevant to the discussion at hand.

[Wyvern]

I can blame knowing something was wrong on various mental illnesses. There's always something to blame, if you're looking.

And nope, It's not asinine. There are no minimum requirements for self-identification. I get the feeling to need to justify it, because it is a rather huge life-changing thing, but,

If that is where your hopes and dreams lie
that's where you see your brightest future
that you've finally found something that gives you hope

If you can identify with even just one of those, do you really need any more justification than that?

[NecklaceOfShadow]

No, it doesn't. I commented on it because it was the only thing with which I could find issue.

[Aaeriele]

Also, let me mention something.

Having doubts about what you've figured out regarding your identity is completely expected. I have yet to a trans person who didn't worry that perhaps they were just delusional at some point. Gender identity is a complex enough topic that not having 100% certainties makes sense. I speak from experience when I say that it's going to be hard not to worry about whether you're "making the right choice" or whether you're just fumbling around in the dark. I've been there. I still wind up back there sometimes, because stress tends to induce worries, and worries often manifest themselves in the form of doubts.

So while I can't say anything to magically make the worries and doubts melt away, I can tell you that it's not something you're encountering alone. We understand, we don't think that you're nuts, and we're here if you need us.


If you want something more to hold onto, the link I posted before (this one) I had originally intended as something that you might be able to give to your parents to help them understand things. But it also has some messages that are aimed at people who are just figuring things out for themselves as well, like this:

There is no one moment when it’s “right” to be open with yourself. Some transgender people have long struggled to live the lives they think they’re supposed to live instead of the lives they know they were meant to live. And some come to question or recognize their gender identities and expressions suddenly.

So again... you are not alone. <3

[Carnildo]

But at least you found out by yourself. I found out because of a freaking manga. You felt that something was wrong by yourself. I read a stupid story and it made me think and in two weeks, I made my decision. That's asinine, isn't it?

One of my friends figured it out when someone asked "Have you considered you might actually be a guy?" Two weeks later: "Yes".

[Aaeriele]

One of my friends figured it out when someone asked "Have you considered you might actually be a guy?" Two weeks later: "Yes".

I'm picturing that in my mind and the thought is truly priceless. That's awesome.

[Monika]

Hi Emi,

"Bravo" is the largest German magazin for teenagers. It has mostly two topics: Music stars and sex.

This is an article on transsexuality: http://www.bravo.de/dr-sommer/seele-gef ... /ex/page/2
It says:
Women seek professional help for transitioning on average by age 26.
Men on average by the age of 37.
(I think with women and men they refer to the gender assigned at birth in this statistic, but it's not completely clear.)

You're not late.

Certainly, a lot of those who waited until 26, 37 or later already knew for a long time and were prevented from transitioning by the difficult legal, social or family situation. But you are most definitely not the only transgendered person who did not already discover their true gender when they were little kids.

On another note: I also read Hourou Musuko. And I was touched and I cried and I can identify with Yoshino Takatsuki and if our schools had school uniforms and required girls to wear skirts I would have worn the boys uniform no matter what trouble that would have meant. And I still feel as much that I am female as I did before reading the manga. Reading the stories and the comics and forums and information about LGBT does not make you trans, it just helps you realize what your feelings are and what they mean and what options you have to live according to your feelings.

*hugs*

[Jessica]

Trust me, my moment when I realized I was trans was much sillier than reading a manga. And I didn't even think about it until I was 16. In hindsight there are things which I could have realized, but I was completely oblivious.

I assume you probably won't just trust my word, so here's my embarrassing story. It was my 16th birthday party, and we were walking home to my place (I think it was my party... doesn't really matter). A friend of mine, who didn't have much money, went to value village, and bought a tacky gold purse. When she gave it to me, mostly as a joke, and she said that if I turn out to be trans, I can blame this on her. We joked about transitioning all the way home. Within a month I came out as trans to her.

Yeah. A tacky gold purse and a joke.

[Vaniver]

But at least you found out by yourself. I found out because of a freaking manga. You felt that something was wrong by yourself. I read a stupid story and it made me think and in two weeks, I made my decision. That's asinine, isn't it?

One of the catalysts for my realization was going on a movie date with a girl, being fixated by the movie the whole time, then later was reading a comic online about two gay guys who go on a movie date and keep glancing at each other rather than the movie. "Hm."

Most people don't come into contact with many LGBTQ folks when they're young, and so there's not much to learn from. I don't think I knew any gay couples besides myself and my ex before I moved to Austin. The internet may not seem like much of a substitute, but it's a pretty good one.

[The Mighty Thesaurus]

Do you ever wonder what would have happened if you went to a crappy movie instead?

[Vaniver]

Do you ever wonder what would have happened if you went to a crappy movie instead?

I tend to have very low standards when it comes to whether or not I'll watch a movie in front of me, which is why I put effort into screening movies beforehand. Even if it were really crappy, I probably would have gone with snarky comments issued without looking. That experience was also just a catalyst, so without it I would have formalized the decision later, but not much later.

I do sometimes wonder about if the internet didn't exist, or had no porn on it. Odds are I would be celebrating my first anniversary in a few months, probably with that girl, and then figure it out whenever middle-aged men do. (Is there a common time?)

[SecondTalon]

I think it's right as their first kid is about to come home from college for the first time. You know, just so everything at home will be totally different and weird. "So, wait.. my favorite store closed, dad's gay and MY ROOM IS AN OFFICE NOW!?!?"

[Aaeriele]

I think it's right as their first kid is about to come home from college for the first time. You know, just so everything at home will be totally different and weird. "So, wait.. my favorite store closed, dad's gay and MY ROOM IS AN OFFICE NOW!?!?"

The first two aren't all that big of a deal. The latter, though... now that's mindblowing.

[SecondTalon]

I know, right? Where the hell am I supposed to sleep?

[The Mighty Thesaurus]

The garage

[Monika]

After I returned from my one-year stay in the US during high school my family hadn't bothered to move all the stuff out of my room they had stored there while I was away .

[Sourire]

I think it's right as their first kid is about to come home from college for the first time. You know, just so everything at home will be totally different and weird. "So, wait.. my favorite store closed, dad's gay and MY ROOM IS AN OFFICE NOW!?!?"

The first two aren't all that big of a deal. The latter, though... now that's mindblowing.

It really depends on the store.

I'd be crushed if I came home and Forever 21 or H&M was gone.