xkcd

by **Swivelguy** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:32 pm UTC

So, I was inspired to try embarking on a glacier with caverns turned off. This means:

- You can't bring booze on embark
- There's no surface water to drink
- You can't farm underground
- There are no plants to gather
- There's no wood to chop
- It might be possible to farm above ground, if you remove a lot of ice and muddy some dirt, then get seeds from the human or elven caravans. I'm not sure, and I'm not gonna try it.

So, the plan is to get water from ice, eventually get booze from the humans/elves, and raise cattle. I embarked with a bull, 3 cows, ~80 food, ~40 wood, the ore to make 4 bronze picks, and a few other things. Then a Yeti killed all my dwarves, so I embarked again. Early in the 2nd month I was able to collapse some ice underground and make a well (dwarves start passing out from dehydration in the middle of the 2nd month), and now I'm about 3 months in, and just got 7 migrants. Food is starting to get a little scarce, and now I have twice the mouths to feed, so I'll have to slaughter the random horse I started with soon, and if it gets really dire, start slaughtering dogs.

by **Vieto** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 7:37 pm UTC

I'm pretty certain that you can bring booze with you to a glacier.

by **icanus** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 8:30 pm UTC

Vieto wrote:I'm pretty certain that you can bring booze with you to a glacier.

If you switch of caverns at worldgen then none of the underground plants exist in the world, and neither do their products.

While you can brew using surface plants after embarking (though not on a glacier), the only types of booze you can take with you on embark require your civ to have access to undeground plants.

by **Larry** » Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:23 am UTC

That is hardcore!

Bravo

by **mrbaggins** » Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:19 am UTC

I really want to try the "livestock" food technique instead of the "farming" technique for self sustainability...

by **Levi** » Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:31 am UTC

It works out awesome if you bring enough pets (and that number is astonishingly small). The only problem is booze.

by **Meteorswarm** » Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:53 am UTC

Levi wrote:It works out awesome if you bring enough pets (and that number is astonishingly small). The only problem is booze.

Given that milking is likely to work on livestock soon, do you think something like kumis or kefir will satisfy the dwarves?

by **Rippy** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 4:46 pm UTC

Levi wrote:I am happy to report that there has only been one death as a result of hospitalization, and that was due to a tantruming dwarf starting a fist fight with one of the sleeping patients so is arguably not the hospital staff's fault.

It's reading things like this that make me want to start up dwarf fortress again.

Actually I need to see if I still have my last game save. I had just started excavating a fortress whose entrance was through a natural waterfall. The entrance bridge passed out through the waterfall, then immediately turned 90 degrees to the side. The idea was to get an excessive amount of pumps and literally be able to flush enemies out of the entrance tunnel and into the 10-tile-high crevasse beyond the waterfall.

by **Vaniver** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 7:42 pm UTC

Meteorswarm wrote:Given that milking is likely to work on livestock soon, do you think something like kumis or kefir will satisfy the dwarves?

Once it does, you can have nomad dwarves- simply redefine meeting areas and stockpiles to get everyone to move from one section to another.

by **Larry** » Fri Dec 17, 2010 5:42 am UTC

Meteorswarm wrote:
Levi wrote:It works out awesome if you bring enough pets (and that number is astonishingly small). The only problem is booze.

Given that milking is likely to work on livestock soon, do you think something like kumis or kefir will satisfy the dwarves?

I'm pretty sure horses and camels are already milkable. Cows definitely are.
Edit: from the raws:

Spoiler:

Modding other animals to be milkable, and maybe a custom workshop/reaction to turn milk into other things, looks pretty easy. Though I'm not that much of a modder...
Shearing, eggs, and vegetable oil are what's exciting me.

EDIT: Just saw the word "fermented", and the penny dropped. Still, should be possible to mod in...

by **Menacing Spike** » Fri Dec 17, 2010 11:37 am UTC

Can you milk dwarves?

by **Vaniver** » Fri Dec 17, 2010 1:47 pm UTC

Menacing Spike wrote:Can you milk dwarves?

Well, where do you think dwarven cheese comes from?

by **Josephine** » Fri Dec 17, 2010 3:33 pm UTC

The actual answer is no less weird. It comes from purring maggots.

by **Meteorswarm** » Fri Dec 17, 2010 6:22 pm UTC

Larry wrote:
Meteorswarm wrote:
Levi wrote:It works out awesome if you bring enough pets (and that number is astonishingly small). The only problem is booze.

Given that milking is likely to work on livestock soon, do you think something like kumis or kefir will satisfy the dwarves?

I'm pretty sure horses and camels are already milkable. Cows definitely are.
Edit: from the raws:
Spoiler:
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:MILK:MILK_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME:ALL_SOLID:frozen cow's milk]
[STATE_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:frozen cow's milk]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:cow's milk]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:cow's milk]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling cow's milk]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling cow's milk]
[PREFIX:NONE]
[MILKABLE:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:MILK:20000]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:CHEESE:CREATURE_CHEESE_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME:SOLID:cow cheese]
[STATE_ADJ:SOLID:cow cheese]
[STATE_NAME:SOLID_POWDER:cow cheese powder]
[STATE_ADJ:SOLID_POWDER:cow cheese powder]
[STATE_NAME:LIQUID:melted cow cheese]
[STATE_ADJ:LIQUID:melted cow cheese]
[STATE_NAME:GAS:boiling cow cheese]
[STATE_ADJ:GAS:boiling cow cheese]
[PREFIX:NONE]

Modding other animals to be milkable, and maybe a custom workshop/reaction to turn milk into other things, looks pretty easy. Though I'm not that much of a modder...
Shearing, eggs, and vegetable oil are what's exciting me.

EDIT: Just saw the word "fermented", and the penny dropped. Still, should be possible to mod in...

I thought there wasn't a way to milk the animals right now, despite it being in the raws. Is there?

by **Vaniver** » Fri Dec 17, 2010 7:40 pm UTC

Meteorswarm wrote:I thought there wasn't a way to milk the animals right now, despite it being in the raws. Is there?

The dwarf needs to be able to hold an animal to milk it (back when I played last, I suspect this is still current). Toady is finally getting around to fixing that.

by **Gopher of Pern** » Fri Dec 17, 2010 8:47 pm UTC

It should be possible to milk cows and maybe goats. I did it on a version awhile back (3-6 months IIRC). I had a nice system going, 6 cows, 1 bull, milk the cows, slaughter the offspring.

by **Larry** » Sun Dec 19, 2010 6:17 am UTC

Meteorswarm wrote:I thought there wasn't a way to milk the animals right now, despite it being in the raws. Is there?

I have definitely been milking cows and horses in 31.xx

One of the big changes in 31 was making milking work with large creatures as well as vermin.

Just tried it then: Like most new features in 31 it's buggy, as soon as the milker removes the animal from its cage, another dwarf comes along to put it back in.
Horse tug-of-war!

by **Technical Ben** » Sun Dec 19, 2010 2:42 pm UTC

With Vermin?
I'm unable to do anything with them except cage. Oh, and the occasional pet from random tamings.

by **Larry** » Mon Dec 20, 2010 10:44 am UTC

Sorry, I forget that many people started playing this game relatively recently :oops:

In the old, old days, the only milk-able creatures were purring maggots, a type of vermin you had to capture from the chasm
(another old feature, now removed). They made Dwarven Cheese.

When the 3d version came along (culminating in 40d), chasms were no longer appropriate and the purring maggot became kind of a rarity.

With DF2010, large creatures (cows) became milk-able. Which appeared to require quite a bit of code shuffling to get working
as the game handles large creatures very different to vermin creatures.

Most other vermin creatures (except fish) can only have obscure extracts made from them, all of which (AFAIK)
are useless except as trade goods. You can tame them and keep them as pets, or some dwarves will eat them
straight out of the animal trap if they have a preference.
"Live fluffy wambler? Don't mind if I do!"
OM NOM NOM NOM NOM

by **Turnpikelad** » Mon Dec 20, 2010 2:22 pm UTC

I don't like milking animals though as I'd rather be using those barrels for brewing drinks.

by **Meteorswarm** » Mon Dec 20, 2010 7:18 pm UTC

Turnpikelad wrote:I don't like milking animals though as I'd rather be using those barrels for brewing drinks.

Hence my desire for fermenting milk.

by **Wnderer** » Wed Dec 22, 2010 1:32 am UTC

I have trees growing on top of my statues.

by **uncivlengr** » Wed Dec 22, 2010 7:00 pm UTC

How are the bugs in the new version these days? I haven't picked up this game in a few months, and I'm wondering if I do, if I should start learning the new one.

by **Josephine** » Wed Dec 22, 2010 7:14 pm UTC

The military and healthcare are pretty much fixed. I haven't noticed any bugs in the last few versions.

by **Technical Ben** » Wed Dec 22, 2010 9:30 pm UTC

nbonaparte wrote:The military and healthcare are pretty much fixed. I haven't noticed any bugs in the last few versions.

Lol. I have. I would really like them to be fixed.

by **SecondTalon** » Wed Dec 22, 2010 9:31 pm UTC

........ such as?

by **mrbaggins** » Fri Dec 24, 2010 10:30 am UTC

Apparently:
Plaster doesn't work properly
Doctors really struggle to work out how to get water from a well
If a hospital stockpile is 49,999 out of 50,000, it will claim and start moving a ridiculously large number of those items, instead of one.
Soap is buggy as hell.
Military members that are also either hunters, miners or woodcutters are usually bugged out in some way.
Crutches are useless, as dwarves will never use them.

There's more, but these are the ones that have bugged me lately.

by **Thadlerian** » Wed Dec 29, 2010 10:52 am UTC

Anyone else here using the instant magma pump? http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=59894.0
I've used it successfully once, but trying to find a place where magma can be pumped straight up without any intervening caverns is a pain.

by **Levi** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:42 am UTC

I downloaded the latest update to try out the new adventurer stuff. Your character is significantly stronger and quests are a lot easier in the beginning, but I was a bit unlucky. The very first shot that the bandit I was to kill shot me through the heart. I lay on the ground, bleeding to death, but I fought to my last breath, throwing everything in my inventory at the boss while my peasant companion, after killing the boss's partner in crime, sat retching. All in all, today was not a good day for Conan the Baker. May Teshil Oiledmurder have better luck.

And he did! One quest already completed. The luck was more in choice of companion than combat, though. I found a pikeman to bring.

And, wow--after completing just that one quest suddenly the people who refuse to go with me are saying "I am not worthy".

Damn. I had only just gotten away from finishing my second quest (All my compatriots died) I was attacked by bogeymen only a few squares away from town.

My next character's first quest is to avenge Conan the Baker! This is so exciting. Conan, your death shall not be in vain!

Om Adealoc: I am Om Nestshaken! Murderer of Egesh Pleatedtricks, whom I buried alive under a mountain of hatred! Strangler of Conan Lakesteels the Baker, whose insignificant name I struggle to recall!" Oh, it's on now.

Victory! Glorious victory! Now to figure out how to desecrate his corpse.

Aaaaaand I just realized this is my 1001st post. Dammit. Now I have to go find my 1000th so I can celebrate.

by **Vaniver** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:14 pm UTC

Levi wrote:Strangler of Conan Lakesteels the Baker, whose insignificant name I struggle to recall!

I hope that is the standard line for player characters, because that is awesome.

by **spupy** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 11:53 pm UTC

How playable is Adventure mode at the moment? Doing quests and exploring and stuff? Items, NPCs, towns, is this stuff there?
I've always wanted a roguelike with a huge world and lots of stuff to do, then I remembered that my beloved DF has an adventure mode.

by **Menacing Spike** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 12:14 am UTC

spupy wrote:How playable is Adventure mode at the moment? Doing quests and exploring and stuff? Items, NPCs, towns, is this stuff there?
I've always wanted a roguelike with a huge world and lots of stuff to do, then I remembered that my beloved DF has an adventure mode.

Followers are a lot more interesting now.

by **BurningLed** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:02 pm UTC

A fun thing to do in Adventurer is start up a fortress, dig a shaft to the caverns/HFS, kill your dwarves off, and get an adventurer down there. You can also create a labyrinth and get it filled with forgotten beasts and goblins, but that takes much more time.

by **Levi** » Wed Feb 09, 2011 4:31 am UTC

spupy wrote:How playable is Adventure mode at the moment? Doing quests and exploring and stuff? Items, NPCs, towns, is this stuff there?
I've always wanted a roguelike with a huge world and lots of stuff to do, then I remembered that my beloved DF has an adventure mode.

Yeah, it works. Getting gear upgrades is nearly impossible and death is really easy, though. You have to be sure to bring along several allies.

by **Vaniver** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:23 pm UTC

So, new version out today. It's been quite a while since I played- I decided to wait until all medical / military changes got sorted out, and it seems like that's mostly happened now. Also, there are bees and honey now. Not sure if I'll get to the new version today, though; several things I ought to knock out first.

by **Levi** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:45 pm UTC

GIRAFFES! RHINOS! I'm totally starting a safari-zoo.

And apparently trolls have enough hair that you can shear it and use it for stuff?

toady wrote:The evil grasses are probably a little extreme and seizure-inducing.

...

by **Menacing Spike** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:21 pm UTC

I can't play DF at the moment, so please, calm my tormented mind by answering this question: bee traps, feasible?

by **Levi** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:45 pm UTC

I don't think so. I haven't seen anything about bees being able to fight. However, it might be, seeing as there's the new venom thing.

by **Technical Ben** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:53 pm UTC

Menacing Spike wrote:I can't play DF at the moment, so please, calm my tormented mind by answering this question: bee traps, feasible?

The next update is getting hives. Either in a weeks time or the one after that!

Last.fm · by **korora** » Mon Feb 21, 2011 8:13 pm UTC

I went to embark in the new version, only to find that the embark details have been mostly obscured: rather than seeing all the layers, you just see indicators of how much soil there is (deep/some/little/no soil) and whether there's clay, flux, "deep metal", or "shallow metal". Which makes sense, from a realism standpoint. Not sure whether the deep/shallow metals imply type or just location, and the wiki is no help on the matter.

Unfortunately there's also a crash in world-gen/embark (appears to be the same error with a NSCFDictionary) on OS X.

Who is online