xkcd

by **rheakith** » Sun Apr 03, 2011 5:57 am UTC

I had some Dogfish Head 90 Minute IPA today. 3 to be exact. Unfortunately, I left the fourth at the house I was at and wasn't paying quite enough attention to the beer itself to be able to judge it other than it being dang tasty. Maybe if I can get that last one back I can give an accurate rating. My first experience with an IPA though, but I was quite pleased.

by **netcrusher88** » Sun Apr 03, 2011 6:59 am UTC

That is one hell of a first IPA. You have quite the beer drinker's palate.

by **Belial** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:29 pm UTC

mercutio_stencil wrote:every beer they make is exactly the beer they want it to be.

Oh. My. Gods. We're caring about authorial intent in beer now?

I quit.

by **Garm** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:35 pm UTC

Belial wrote:
mercutio_stencil wrote:every beer they make is exactly the beer they want it to be.

Oh. My. Gods. We're caring about authorial intent in beer now?

I quit.

10 minutes later and I'm still laughing.

I suppose producing a small ocean of homogeneous beer is a feat of chemical engineering but the variance over six packs of Fat Tire (or the variance from my former band teacher's 20 gallon batch artisan microbrewery) isn't really noticeable either so who cares? Look! ABI has achieved something that's almost pointless. I think the bigger story is that they get so many people to drink their shit.

by **Dark567** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:51 pm UTC

Garm wrote:I suppose producing a small ocean of homogeneous beer is a feat of chemical engineering but the variance over six packs of Fat Tire (or the variance from my former band teacher's 20 gallon batch artisan microbrewery) isn't really noticeable either so who cares? .

For what its worth, I have had brews from microbreweries(although smaller than New Belgium) that have had noticeably high variance.

I once had to take a training course at college internship about creating consistent products and how important it was, more so even than creating a quality product to having a large business. It's easy to see that by looking at things like McDonald's, AB, and Walmart. The marketing people than explained how apparently people really like know what a product is and what to expect from it. People don't like surprises.

That said, I don't drink AB products, because I like a quality brew even if it is inconsistent.

by **uncivlengr** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:57 pm UTC

Those values apply to making laptops and SUVs, but not beer. The properties of a quality beer didn't change when corporations decided to turn production into exercises in manufacturing and marketing.

by **bigglesworth** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:01 pm UTC

Thing is, a low-complexity lager can be just the thing to hit the spot, expecially when drinking with spicy food.

by **Dark567** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:03 pm UTC

uncivlengr wrote:Those values apply to making laptops and SUVs, but not beer. The properties of a quality beer didn't change when corporations decided to turn production into exercises in manufacturing and marketing.

I am not saying it did, but the trait people often look for most is consistency of a product not the quality of a product. See McDonald's, Walmart etc.

by **uncivlengr** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:21 pm UTC

Sure, but another trait people often look for in a beer is how easily it gets them drunk, and that is also an issue apart from discussing the quality.

Nobody doubts the fact that mass-produced beer is popular, or that it's what most people are familiar with, or that it's production is more standardized - those are all well-established attributes of mass-produced beer, and for those people that primarily appreciate the quality of their beer, those attributes aren't particularly compelling.

by **Azrael** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:43 pm UTC

uncivlengr wrote:... mass-produced ... is popular, or that it's what most people are familiar with, or that it's production is more standardized ...

Or, to be less generous, those attributes have absolutely nothing to do with the product whatsoever. Those are business attributes which are required to succeed in any mass-market segment. Those are the same core traits that are common to my running shoes, and I don't pat Nike on the back for cranking out ridiculous quantities of shoes that all look the same.

Congrats, AB! You're the most thoroughly commercialized brand of beer!

by **TheAmazingRando** » Wed Apr 06, 2011 5:01 am UTC

Finally tried some Bourbon County Stout.
Holy shit. Definitely up there with Deschutes Abyss and Oak Aged Yeti as my favorite stout. Shame about ABI, I'm not planning on boycotting or anything but I certainly hope they manage to keep the same level of quality that they have now.

by **SurgicalSteel** » Wed Apr 06, 2011 5:27 am UTC

I had a bottle of Sam Smith Nut Brown Ale. 10 minutes later, I didn't. I has a sad now.

by **lewismd** » Thu Apr 07, 2011 12:30 am UTC

On a different note, I had a chance to try Stone Brewing's 2008 Imperial Russian Stout aged in bourbon barrels. Holy. Fucking. Shit. Wow. Bourbon county is good, and this blew it away. That's one impressive beer.

by **Dark567** » Thu Apr 07, 2011 12:41 am UTC

lewismd wrote:On a different note, I had a chance to try Stone Brewing's 2008 Imperial Russian Stout aged in bourbon barrels. Holy. Fucking. Shit. Wow. Bourbon county is good, and this blew it away. That's one impressive beer.

Stone's Russian Imperial Stout is very good. I imagine a version aged in bourbon barrels would be excellent. Do they still do that? Looking at BA it looks like they only released it in growlers and kegs. Probably only available in the San Diego area.

by **ExplodingHat** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:29 am UTC

Stone Imperial Stout. <3

by **KallistiEngel** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:41 pm UTC

bigglesworth wrote:Thing is, a low-complexity lager can be just the thing to hit the spot, expecially when drinking with spicy food.

See also: Asian beers. They try for beer that's refreshing, not complex.

At least in the ones I've tried there's not a lot of "flavor", but it's something you could drink all day because it is refreshing and doesn't have that "cheap beer taste" associated with low-quality beers from other countries either.

by **bigglesworth** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:52 pm UTC

Not an enormous fan of Asahi, but Tsing Tao is a great beer, on the East Asian side.

But Cobra and Kingfisher are essentially British, and are tasty in a similar manner, and Grolsh and Tuborg are continental ones that fill that niche.

Also I like the taste of Carlsberg, despite having its own variety of cheap beer taste...

by **SlyReaper** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:36 pm UTC

I have been discovering the delights of Peroni. It's a bog-standard imported lager, but I've never had it before. It's actually quite good, bottled. I like to have a single bottle before starting on the ales.

by **bigglesworth** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:48 pm UTC

Not a huge fan of Peroni, but for Italian beer, I do like Birra Moretti with a pizza.

by **SurgicalSteel** » Sat Apr 09, 2011 4:09 am UTC

Nastro Azzuro is my favorite if I want something light and refreshing, especially to drink with heavy foods like pasta and the like.

Also: I found a bottle of Delerium Tremens in my house that I must have bought sometime last year and forgotten about. It's completely sealed, the stopper is still in it. Hell, the foil is still on it. Think it's still good?

by **netcrusher88** » Sat Apr 09, 2011 4:14 am UTC

I suggest trying it. If it tastes good, it's fine.

Sorry, that's just kinda what it comes down to. I would guess Tremens can survive for quite a while in a bottle though.

by **SurgicalSteel** » Sat Apr 09, 2011 7:01 am UTC

That's kinda what I figured too, what with the completely opaque bottles. Not being incredibly knowledgeable about beer, I didn't if it was like milk or something where if you find a bottle from last year the answer is absolutely do not drink it, lol.

by **Amarantha** » Sat Apr 09, 2011 8:22 am UTC

Most beers should keep for a few years if they're not being subjected to extremes of heat etc. Some bottle-conditioned ales improve with age like a fine wine. DT should be totally drinkable.

Does it not have a use-by date?

by **Azrael** » Sat Apr 09, 2011 12:34 pm UTC

As long as it wasn't stored somewhere that gets really hot, or really damp, it should be fine. High ABV things from good breweries age very well.

by **lewismd** » Sat Apr 09, 2011 3:48 pm UTC

Dark567 wrote:
lewismd wrote:On a different note, I had a chance to try Stone Brewing's 2008 Imperial Russian Stout aged in bourbon barrels. Holy. Fucking. Shit. Wow. Bourbon county is good, and this blew it away. That's one impressive beer.
Stone's Russian Imperial Stout is very good. I imagine a version aged in bourbon barrels would be excellent. Do they still do that? Looking at BA it looks like they only released it in growlers and kegs. Probably only available in the San Diego area.

From what I was told, they haven't been really selling it even in their home market. They brought a keg or two up to Minneapolis just for the release parties (which pissed off some Stone fans back home, I'm told). So yeah, guessing it's going to be pretty damn tough to find.

by **Belial** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 2:52 am UTC

Azrael wrote:As long as it wasn't stored somewhere that gets really hot, or really damp, it should be fine. High ABV things from good breweries age very well.

The fact that it has a cork rather than a metal cap also helps a lot

by **lewismd** » Sun Apr 10, 2011 5:56 am UTC

bigglesworth wrote:Not an enormous fan of Asahi, but Tsing Tao is a great beer, on the East Asian side.

But Cobra and Kingfisher are essentially British, and are tasty in a similar manner, and Grolsh and Tuborg are continental ones that fill that niche.

Also I like the taste of Carlsberg, despite having its own variety of cheap beer taste...

I hadn't had a Kingfisher in a long time and I had one at an Asian restaurant recently. Holy crap it was terrible. Would rather have had a Miller Lite, honestly.

Yeah, a Carlsberg can be a damn refreshing beer. Great in its simplicity. Last time I had one was at a pub watching Premier League on a Saturday morning. Perfect for that occasion.

by **Garm** » Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:26 pm UTC

I have a beer that I made aging in my basement. It's a Fruit-Cake Old Ale, it's supposed to age for about 9 months before it's ready drink but can be kept in the bottle for several years after that. I also have a commercial beer, O'Dell's Peche, that I'm aging for a year or more. I bought two bottles during a brewery tour on suggestion from the guide. TBH I was a little disappointed with the lack of flavor from the beer. Point being that the bigger beers (like Delerium Tremens) can age beautifully if left in a cool place for a few months.

I've heard the adage for home brew is that your beer is ready after you've drunk the last bottle.

by **AvatarIII** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 9:02 am UTC

i drink Guinness, pretty much exclusively, that is all.

by **Ulc** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 9:26 am UTC

Ulc wrote:So, Flying dog and De Molen made a collaboration stout - basically the malty darkness from the Hell and Damnation with the hops from Gonzo - I have no idea how it tastes, but here's the important thing, I just got gifted a bottle from the distributor as a "thanks for good working relationship now that you're pulling out of the position as purchaser"

It's sitting right there - just waiting for me to hand in this damn assignment and the guy that I'm grooming for my position and I are going to drink it.

It's going to be glorious unless I know my brewers totally wrong.

And glorious feelings upon the tastebuds were indeed had.

A real shame that I'm exceedingly unlikely to ever taste that again

by **uncivlengr** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 11:06 am UTC

Speaking of storing, I've only just learned that RIS requires much longer conditioning than regular beers - Something like six months instead of a few weeks.

It's been about 2.5 weeks since I bottled mine, and it's still pretty flat, and the sweetness of the unfermented bottling sugar doesn't help. Apparently you can stir up a bit of the yeast cake before bottling to speed things up, but thankfully it'll still work otherwise.

I'm going to need to find some more swingtop bottles and start another one in the meantime... this is how it starts, isn't it?

by **Garm** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 2:27 pm UTC

uncivlengr wrote:Speaking of storing, I've only just learned that RIS requires much longer conditioning than regular beers - Something like six months instead of a few weeks.

It's been about 2.5 weeks since I bottled mine, and it's still pretty flat, and the sweetness of the unfermented bottling sugar doesn't help. Apparently you can stir up a bit of the yeast cake before bottling to speed things up, but thankfully it'll still work otherwise.

I'm going to need to find some more swingtop bottles and start another one in the meantime... this is how it starts, isn't it?

Yes.

If any of you have access to Oskar Blues beer this will make sense, otherwise you can ignore my musings.

I went out to dinner last night and ordered Oskar Blues' "Mamma's Little Yella Pils." It sounded better than the double IPA that was the other beer they had on tap. I've had this beer... 5-10 times and never really been a fan of it but never could figure out why. It hit me last night that for a Pilsner, the beer is unsuitably dense. It's a heavy beer when it really shouldn't be. I think they put too much malt in it and it's masking the hop bite that one expects with a pilsner. Anyway... it was interesting and now I never need to drink that again.

In a plug for Oskar Blues, their "Ten Fiddy" is truly a great beer (tho' pretty much everything else is forgettable), if you can find it absolutely buy some.

by **Belial** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 2:53 pm UTC

I just tried Ten-Fiddy for the first time a couple weeks back. It is one of the only beers I've tasted where the metallic taste of a can actually seemed to add something to it. It was a totally respectable stout. My only problem with it is that it's a bit overpriced for what it is. All the same, would drink again. Especially if I were going somewhere to drink where hauling bottles around was unfeasible.

by **netcrusher88** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:16 pm UTC

If there was metallic flavor from the can it was a bad can - the canning process that micros use has a thin nonreactive plastic coating on the inside. Ten Fidy ages well because it won't react with the can and it won't get any light.

It is really something special on nitro though. Takes on a whole new character and depth.

by **Azrael** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:22 pm UTC

Yeah, I've only ever had it on nitro, and it was pretty stellar.

That being said, lots of people have opined that Oskar's success with Ten has made them seem a bit of a one-hit wonder. I think that will change with more exposure of their other brews, though.

by **Belial** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:35 pm UTC

netcrusher88 wrote:If there was metallic flavor from the can it was a bad can - the canning process that micros use has a thin nonreactive plastic coating on the inside. Ten Fidy ages well because it won't react with the can and it won't get any light.

I'm not saying the beer tasted like can. I'm saying I tasted the can. Because the can was in fact in my mouth. Because in order to drink the beer, I had to place the lip of the can on my face.

by **Telchar** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:06 pm UTC

Belial wrote:
netcrusher88 wrote:If there was metallic flavor from the can it was a bad can - the canning process that micros use has a thin nonreactive plastic coating on the inside. Ten Fidy ages well because it won't react with the can and it won't get any light.

I'm not saying the beer tasted like can. I'm saying I tasted the can. Because the can was in fact in my mouth. Because in order to drink the beer, I had to place the lip of the can on my face.

Apparently glassware hasn't made it that far east yet....

Had Deschutes Black Butte Porter recently. Generally not a fan of porter but it was lighter than I expected and was less weighty than I expected. Definitely worth drinking again.

by **Belial** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:09 pm UTC

Telchar wrote:
Belial wrote:
netcrusher88 wrote:If there was metallic flavor from the can it was a bad can - the canning process that micros use has a thin nonreactive plastic coating on the inside. Ten Fidy ages well because it won't react with the can and it won't get any light.

I'm not saying the beer tasted like can. I'm saying I tasted the can. Because the can was in fact in my mouth. Because in order to drink the beer, I had to place the lip of the can on my face.

Apparently glassware hasn't made it that far east yet....

Why would I use glassware when I just said that the metal taste was a feature?

by **Whizzkid1024** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:10 pm UTC

If you can, get your hands on belgian Trappist-Beers, which are traditionally brewn beers by cistercienser monks (?)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trappist_beer

Hmm Rochefort 10 is fantastic... Malheur 12 is awesome too, these two are the best beers I've drunk up till now (and somehow I thinks it'll stay that way )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOfGgJNhMec

Greetz from Belgium, Beer capitol of the world xD

by **Azrael** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:28 pm UTC

Whizzkid1024 wrote:Hmm Rochefort 10 is fantastic... Malheur 12 is awesome too...

So you like the quads? Make sure you try St. Bernardus 12, De Struise's Pannepot (especially the vintage, aged or special reserve), Gulden Draak (technically a dark triple) and Gouden Carolus' Cuvée Van De Keizer Blauw (a strong dark).

They aren't trappist, but they're all local to you and ... even better.

And be sure to watch De Struise. Those guys do an amazing job mixing superb tradition with new and interesting things. Mikkeller too, although they're Dutch and even more esoteric. Same for the Norwegians at Nogne-0!

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