xkcd

by **roband** » Wed Dec 14, 2011 3:37 pm UTC

Plus webby. Plus Angua.

Wow, that was a really well thought out idea infina...

by **Angua** » Wed Dec 14, 2011 11:26 pm UTC

My avatar has blue and purple in it? I would count the 'fez' on the cactus to be red (maroon really, but closer to red than purple).

Sorry I haven't been posting a lot recently - I've come home for the holidays and am getting work experience in a clinic with a very enthusiastic doctor who's been working me late as she's getting me to collect data for a paper she is writing (I'll get to be an author, hurray!!!!).

Anyway, weekends mainly for me unfortunately. I see the colour theme that people are mentioning - it definitely seems pretty likely. Personally, I'm not really trusting Roband (i'm not sure where he's seeing these colours in my avatar). Roband also didn't consider the possibility that you might need both colours or something. Who knows with bio though - the apple juice thing sounds really bizarre.

by **ForAllOfThis** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:10 am UTC

Adam H wrote:
_infina_ wrote:Krong, Misnomer and FOAT should bother him if it is just the avatar colors blue and purple. I think it may be a subtle cop result.
Really. You really think that bio is a cop, and he copped me, and I'm scum. REEEEEAAAAALLY.
_infina_ wrote:I think everyone has become too focused on b.i.o, not noticing any other good candidates.
Quite right.

Unvote

Vote: infina

A little bit of an overreaction to infinas speculation? Is it just because of the colour cop conspiracy theory or any other reasons as well? I could understand if infina had used it as the only reason to justify voting for you (which would then cross the line to scummy), but he didn't?

by **b.i.o** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:10 am UTC

So I just went back through posts from today, and something like two-thirds of them are about me. In some ways that's understandable--I've been intentionally drawing a lot of attention. However, since you've all decided you should (rightfully) talk about people other than me, you've all basically been silent--which is because you're all being lazy, and is not okay.

So here's a real claim, which I expect very few of you to believe: I am town.

I voted EH on D1 because I thought we had a problem with very few people doing anything, and I wanted to shake things up a bit to get people talking. I have no idea why EH died suddenly. Almost all of you seem to think that's a byproduct of my role. It's not. I don't know why it happened.

I continued acting crazy on D2 because I hadn't yet generated any of the discussion I wanted, and also because not acting crazy would've required fielding a lot of stupid, repetitive questions about what happened, when I really had no idea.

To head off the obvious responses, if I were scum, I'd have to be a complete idiot to be playing the way I am. Those of you who have played with me before should know that I'm not a complete idiot. I could, of course, be a jester still, but it doesn't really matter from the town's perspective.

My vote in Tim is there because I found him suspicious. I think gigantic roundup posts are useless and/or a scumtell, and when people pointed out its many problems, he got defensive and didn't really answer their questions. I have other suspicions, of course (your collective response to me acting crazy generated quite a lot of useful responses, if you care to pay attention), but I'd prefer to not show my whole hand at once.

If you don't want to believe me and decide to lynch me, then go ahead and do it. But at least have some actually productive discussion first, because there's been depressingly little of that this game. (Also, some of you are taking the colored avatar thing seriously, really!?)

by **BoomFrog** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:23 am UTC

There might be some merit the the color speculation but I doubt it has to do with avatars. I agree that me should move the focus away from b.i.o. We should find someone else to lynch today.

Ninja'd by b.i.o. I somewhat belive him, probably because I tried a similar tactic in Back to Basics. Although I still think he's a double voter. I'm going back to do a real analysis on others. I'll ponder if I think a vig should kill him or not, though.

by **BoomFrog** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:30 am UTC

b.i.o wrote:My vote in Tim is there because I found him suspicious. I think gigantic roundup posts are useless and/or a scumtell, and when people pointed out its many problems, he got defensive and didn't really answer their questions. I have other suspicions, of course (your collective response to me acting crazy generated quite a lot of useful responses, if you care to pay attention), but I'd prefer to not show my whole hand at once.

I think "showing your whole hand at once" could do a lot to both help prove your towniyness if you have good points, and get all your info out there in case you die tonight.

b.i.o wrote:But at least have some actually productive discussion first, because there's been depressingly little of that this game. (Also, some of you are taking the colored avatar thing seriously, really!?)

From what I've seen, lack of meaty discussion often happens in games with a high percentage of scum and indies, which I suspect this is. Also I'm pretty suspicious of anyone who took the colored avatar or the apple juice thing too seriously. Only Infinia sticks out but I'll have a look back to see who else.

by **BoomFrog** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:29 am UTC

I only skimmed back about two pages, the rest is from memory.

Spoiler:

Townish
GoP
Angua
AdamH
Wei
FAOT
Greenlover

Neutral/Lurker
Webby
RR
Misnomer
Krong
B.i.o

Scummy
t1mm01994
Roband
Mav
Infinia
Mpolo

I did a reread of all of mpolo's post to make sure before voting. He's really focused mostly on mechanic speculation. Also I'd forgoten that he was 2nd on my scum list yesterday.

Unvote
Vote Mpolo

by **t1mm01994** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:58 am UTC

b.i.o wrote:My vote in Tim is there because I found him suspicious. I think gigantic roundup posts are useless and/or a scumtell, and when people pointed out its many problems, he got defensive and didn't really answer their questions.

Just out of curiosity: what questions didn't I answer? I'll set that straight asap, I kind of have nothing to hide... I just don't know that much at this point of the game, since I haven't got much to go on recently. As for the classic 3 to kill question:
Misnomer because I still think he has something to do with animalitis and he dodged the post because there was 1 error in it, and ignored the rest from it.
If wei wasn't confirmed town, I'd be on his neck by now.. But he is, so I'm gonna sit this one out.
Going on all things posted so far, infina would be next on the lynchlist, for doing some weird stuff here and there, and not seeming to have added something yet.
Last up on the list of 3, Krong, for reasons I have said before. Lurky and not seeming to do much.

by **Adam H** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:28 pm UTC

ForAllOfThis wrote:
Adam H wrote:Vote: infina

A little bit of an overreaction to infinas speculation? Is it just because of the colour cop conspiracy theory or any other reasons as well? I could understand if infina had used it as the only reason to justify voting for you (which would then cross the line to scummy), but he didn't?

My vote was maybe an overreaction, but if you look back at infina's posts* he has been saying weird things. I just thought I should get my vote on who I thought was the most scummy person in case the day ends suddenly again. I would encourage the same from most everyone, as yesterday's votals are pretty worthless other than the whole bio thing.

*Um, how do you search through threads by author? I've seen it done but can't figure it out. This is as close as I've come, which is good enough. Just be careful not to look at his spoilers, cause it shows his posts in the discussion thread as well.

I'm also a little suspicious of krong and mav, who have stayed under the radar.

by **ForAllOfThis** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:18 pm UTC

It's a little meta but infina always looks scummy for varying reasons. I felt like the posts he has made in this game have been far more townie and straight forward than those in other games (where he has been town). I'm not too sure if thats something to be worried about though.

I just thought I should get my vote on who I thought was the most scummy person in case the day ends suddenly again. I would encourage the same from most everyone, as yesterday's votals are pretty worthless other than the whole bio thing.

Another "day might suddenly end" scare tactic. It's not townie and is a bad reason to be putting a vote down on someone (as it essentially lets you put a vote down without any measurable reasons).

Mod: How long till deadline?

by **b.i.o** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:59 pm UTC

She said she'd be offline for 10 days on the 9th, and it's now the 15th. So I think we have ~4 days to go at this point, at least.

by **Sungura** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:43 pm UTC

If someone wants to do a votal that's cool. I have a hard time doing that from spotty internet on my phone. Ill end day when i Get back on the 19th.

by **weiyaoli** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:44 pm UTC

Sorry for just dropping out for a while, my workload suddenly built up but should be much better now it's the holidays again.

My concern with the colour speculation was that I agreed with Mav that what she had was worth noting, but I don't think we could have taken it much further beyond that with what information we have now. I just feel role sensitive based on avatar colour seems a bit far-fetched. I don't really understand roband's comment to infina though:

roband wrote:Plus webby. Plus Angua.

Wow, that was a really well thought out idea infina...

Doesn't that just prove infinia point that bio being sensitive to AdamH makes no sense because many other people have blue/purple avatars?

As for Angua, I don't really think there has been anything scummy from her. Your point about drawing attention away from Misnomer, I didn't really read that post in that light.

More to come later.

by **Sungura** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:47 pm UTC

Oh I did read the thread I am keeping up on on things.

by **Adam H** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:50 pm UTC

ForAllOfThis wrote:
I just thought I should get my vote on who I thought was the most scummy person in case the day ends suddenly again. I would encourage the same from most everyone, as yesterday's votals are pretty worthless other than the whole bio thing.
Another "day might suddenly end" scare tactic. It's not townie and is a bad reason to be putting a vote down on someone (as it essentially lets you put a vote down without any measurable reasons).

First, I believe that voting and encouraging votes is generally townie. What is NOT townie is when in a game of 12 players, a player who has a single vote is lynched. And only half of us had votes down at all. That's just a bad town play, and we should take care not to let that happen again. Scum would love to go the entire game without needing to vote...

Second, are you so sure Amy's not going to come back in the next few days(surprise!) and end the day without warning? There is a GOOD chance that the day will end before we are told of a deadline. Do with that whatever you think will benefit town. Ninja'd... So yeah that's good to know.

I assume we can take her word for it.

Third, other than supposedly me, who else has been using the "day might suddenly end scare tactic"? This is the first time I've heard that it's a scare tactic. ~~Does anyone actually agree with FAOT that we're better off ignoring the possibility that the day might suddenly end?~~ Yes, I suppose we can ignore that possibility... :oops:

Fourth (so many points!), I voted infina for damn good reasons (he suggested bio is a cop, after voting FAOT for a reason that I cannot understand, after admitting that he looks like the scummiest player in the game), though if he always looks scummy as town than I might change my vote to someone else.

I think FAOT and infina might be scum buddies. Infina voted FAOT for a reason that he surely knew wouldn't start a bandwagon. He misinterpreted FAOT's post or something. So that looks like distancing to me. And then FAOT defends infina because apparently infina always seems scummy.

by **_infina_** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:00 pm UTC

Vote: Adam H

You seem to be grasping at anything and everything you can to try and attack as many people as you can when it has only been suggested by me that b.i.o may have been mentioning a cop result, and then b.i.o states that it is nothing. You have become even scummier looking than I was day one with my gigantic mistake of a post.

by **Adam H** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:01 pm UTC

_infina_ wrote:You seem to be grasping at anything and everything you can to try and attack as many people as you can

That's laughable. Right? My list of probable scum goes: bio, infina, faot, t1mm (sort of)... so that's like 12 people that have managed to avoid my desperate rage.

Adam H wrote:What is NOT townie is when in a game of 18 players, a player who has a single vote is lynched. And only 1/3 of us had votes down at all.

Um, fixed that from my last post. I mixed up the games I'm in.

Votals:
2 - bio (roband, t1mm)
2 - t1mm (bio, misnomer)
1 - mpolo (Boomfrog)
1 - infina (adam)
1 - adam (infina)

Wow I'm glad I did that - t1mm and bio both at 2 votes took me by surprise. Feel free to double check me...

by **t1mm01994** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:25 pm UTC

As enddaysuddenly crisis is averted, I think now is the time to
Unvote
so that I can spend my vote in a more useful way. So, I'm currently at 2 (or 3, depending on bio) votes... That doesn't seem too good, considering that mostly what I had "done wrong" so far was not knowing a rule, misreading a post, and having my memory fail me once, all of which I have tried to correct as soon as they were pointed out.
And Adam, as one of the persons with spikes aimed at them: you ARE rather spiky. You don't really feel safe around here, do you? As far as I'm aware, being spiky is a scumtell.. So you get a free trip to my suspicionlist.
FoS: Adam H

by **ForAllOfThis** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:14 pm UTC

@Adam: I'm not intentionally defending infina, I'm intentionally pressuring you for any inconsistencies & I mislike all votes that don't have sound reasoning behind them. In response to your question, Boomfrog used a similar "scare tactic" to encourage people to vote for bio, despite a few people thinking bio is a jester.

_infina_ wrote:You seem to be grasping at anything and everything you can to try and attack as many people as you can when it has only been suggested by me that b.i.o may have been mentioning a cop result, and then b.i.o states that it is nothing. You have become even scummier looking than I was day one with my gigantic mistake of a post.

This is as bad as Adams vote. Why do you think Adam is scum? I see no specifics or reasoning in the post, just a poor explanation of what happened.

t1mm01994 wrote:And Adam, as one of the persons with spikes aimed at them: you ARE rather spiky. You don't really feel safe around here, do you? As far as I'm aware, being spiky is a scumtell.. So you get a free trip to my suspicionlist.
FoS: Adam H

Can you elaborate on what you mean? I don't understand what you mean by spiky or see any evidence to back up those accusations. I can say "you are rather scummy" but its meaningless and useless ,unless I show evidence to support that statement.

by **t1mm01994** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:35 pm UTC

Reading baack, its actually quite near OMGUS because I've had my fair share of posts attacking me, including quite some from adam. That, and him being somewhat aggressive towards everyone that appears to attack him, made him move up my scumlist. More importantly: Misnomer, I still think you're the polymorpher, and while I'm fiddling around with other stuff, you nearly seemed to get away with not replying. Let's at least make my strong suspicion official:
Vote: Misnomer
And to those who undoubtedly chime in shouting: 'but you just FoSsed Adam!' yes I did, he's on my list somewhere, but way below our ~~Misno~~farmer.

by **BoomFrog** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 2:34 am UTC

@AdamH: You can go to the bottom of the page and select the option that says, "Sort by" and change it from post time to author. That will sort only the current thread so you can avoid spoilers.

by **webby** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 3:29 am UTC

Ok, it's Friday afternoon, I've done all the work I'm going to for the year, I actually have time to make a post.

infina vs Adam H - If I had to pick two players who act the scummiest in all games, it would be them. If I recall correctly, Adam H's record is that he's been lynched day 1 in all the games except the fun ones and there he looked pretty scummy as well. infina also often looks scummy too. Because of this, I would not be surprised if they were both townies. I'll have a closer look at them if there's nobody else I find scummy.

The other players that are drawing attention:

tim - One of the most active players. Tries to divide camps into FAOT + Adam H vs b.i.o + GoP, I'm not really seeing that. Calls Mav + greenlover scummy without very good justification. Suggests that mpolo or Misnomer might be a farmer, possible independent. Suspicious of a 'confirmed' townie (weiyaoli), which isn't necessarily bad in iteself, but I would think that while town might be suspicious of a 'confirmed' townie, scum definitely has a reason to.

His long analysis post is ok, I like making them myself both as town and scum. There is some weirdness, as there will always be in a post that long, regardless of alignment. I like lynching people I find reasonably suspicious who make such a post (especially if they make it before people think they're suspicious), because they might be scum and even if they're not then at least you can look over their links with everyone. Based on his post, I reckon mpolo is probably town, or if not town, at least not on the same faction as tim.

Overall, his votes are going everywhere, he's explained very much how he feels about everyone, yet he's still done plenty to be suspicious about. I think that makes him possibly scum and at the least a good candidate for an information gathering lynch if we don't find anyone more scummy.

Misnomer - (because I want to know why tim thinks he was the farmer) - expresses suspicion of rosheep. Focus on confirmed townies, which I find slightly suspicious (as with tim above). If scum knows they're not on their team, chances are from their perspective that they're townie. This gives them a motive to find them suspicious. Has been absent recently
Not really seeing the farmerness apart from the posting coincidences. Makes me more supsicious of tim to be honest - the above is the best I could do as to finding Misnomer scummy and it's not very much.

They're my thoughts for the moment.

by **Gopher of Pern** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 7:28 am UTC

Apologies for not posting more. Been busy all week. Still havent had a chance to relax at home, but I'm just waiting at the airport, so I have some time to post!

As I stated in my last post, I do not think bio is scummy. Not helping town very much, but not scummy.

Looking at who I thought was scummy: tim and adam:

Tim: Since my last post, is convinced that the numbers mean something. Sure, they might, but even if they do, I doubt we'll be able to puzzle it out before the endgame. Just took a look through their long post which i skimmed through the first time, due to the formatting being atrocious; spotted several other mistakes in there, such as:

RoadieRich: Number 32. Non-active, no replacement.. I somewhat expect a modkill soon.

What, did you forget Mav had replaced RR? You must have, as Mav isn't in the list anywhere.

Moving on from that post, His most suspicious person is Misnomer, due to them being likely to be the person who polymorphed Mav and Roband. The only evidence for this is the fact that Misnomer posted inbetween thier issues. Which is flimsy at best. Also dislikes Weiy for some pretty spurious reasons. Then reckons infina and krong would be next on their list, simply for not saying much. I can name a few other people who haven't said much recently (including myself) so I'm not sure why they get top of the list.

Goes after Adam for being 'spiky'. I'm assuming this means under fire? under suspicion? This bit just rubs me the wrong way. Then a vote for Misnomer for being the polymorpher, which I still haven't seen a good reason for.

Vote: tim

Now for Adam:

Is going on about conspiracies and colours, and generally not looking at other things, and votes infina for proposing that bio might have a cop result. Now, I don't agree with infina about the cop result, but I do suspect bio is trying to tell us something subtly. After being questioned about that vote, he claims it's not the only thing that is suspicious about infina, but doesnt elaborate on them, until much later. The elaboration (didn't like the vote on FAOT, and admitting a flaw.) Sounds like ad-hoc justification. Remember that was a day 1 vote, and they tend to be for flimsy reasons. You had extremely flimsy reasons for voting for infina.

Would vote for Adam, but I already have my vote, so FOS: Adam

I think tim is scummier, but would be happy with either of them.

by **Angua** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 11:10 am UTC

Just checking in to say that I'll definitely do a good post tomorrow after we do the presentation for a project proposal today.

by **roband** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 2:13 pm UTC

bio, you've kinda made me think you could be town, but you've definitely made me think you played this in a pretty stupid manner.

weiy, maybe I misunderstood infina's point.

Adam and infina both look scummy to me, but they're fighting each other. I'm not ruling out distancing as a tactic here. They're both clever enough to suggest this, especially as a D2 tactic after N1 discussions.
FAOT seems townie to me, in this exchange. Tim, I'm not sure on, but seems like eager town right now.

I feel like we're all missing something here, but I don't know what it is.

Unvote

for now.

by **Adam H** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 3:40 pm UTC

I had more important things to talk about before, but now that people are unvoting bio, I gotta go back to this.

b.i.o wrote:I voted EH on D1 because I thought we had a problem with very few people doing anything, and I wanted to shake things up a bit to get people talking.
...
I continued acting crazy on D2 because I hadn't yet generated any of the discussion I wanted, and also because not acting crazy would've required fielding a lot of stupid, repetitive questions about what happened, when I really had no idea.

What kind of discussion were you looking for?!? And to appease me D2, all you had to say was "um, not sure why EH was lynched and I didn't cause the day to end! Weird!" That's what I assumed happened until you started acting like a jackass.

b.i.o wrote:To head off the obvious responses, if I were scum, I'd have to be a complete idiot to be playing the way I am. Those of you who have played with me before should know that I'm not a complete idiot.

I have a HUGE problem with this defense. Why is it dumber to play the way you are for scum rather than town?!? What about being town makes it so that you can force the most absurd wine down our throats and then laugh it off, saying "if I were scum I wouldn't have done that!" (more wine, hmmm... YES YOU ARE CLEARLY TOWN :roll:

)

And considering that you seem to have convinced everyone else that you're not worth a lynch, tell me again why it was so stupid for you as scum to act that way?

My vote's coming your way if this infina thing doesn't pan out.

by **t1mm01994** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 6:25 pm UTC

Given the current bandwagon rolling at me at the moment, I think now would be the best time to defend myself.

My vote for Misnomer isn't only because of my suspicion of him as being the polymorpher - he pointed at a master-minion setup in one of his first posts, which afaik is quite uncommon in mafiagames, and then he's 1 of the 2 posters between one person being freed and another being animalised - he also imho seems to be lacking motivation to scumhunt.
He attacked bio when he was at his crazy stage, which is trying to hit a shark thats eating someone at that time; everybody already knows they're not doing the right thing. Apart from that, he really hasnt done much, except for an OMGUS vote because I miscontributed one thing; to rightly contribute it: It came from Angua and was taken over by FAOT.

Gopher of Pern wrote:
Goes after Adam for being 'spiky'. I'm assuming this means under fire? under suspicion? This bit just rubs me the wrong way. Then a vote for Misnomer for being the polymorpher, which I still haven't seen a good reason for.

[

That means firing, but was already explained by me 3 posts above yours. My idiom of the English language isn't perfect as I am Dutch and this is pretty much the only time of the day I get to speak English... Same goes out to the red herring theorem, if anyone is actually believing that: I just don't know any synonyms for red herring, so I used it multiple times, yeah.

On the change of heart on the numbers: I've merely changed in what I would find in them. I don't think there is a simple pattern like 1-25 town, 26-30 scum, 31-40 indie, or any simple division like that. I DO think that picking numbers did something; else I doubt she'd let us pick numbers. Going on the fact that mpolo has the same number as I do, I guessed he'd have the same role as me, as well...
So, to at least clear that up: mpolo, does the echo-well-thingy I claimed a couple pages ago sound familiar at all? If not, I'm going to let the numbers go.

To defend myself in a general way: I'm very active here, as I got a LOT of spare time on my hands. I post quite a bit as well, and I'm not taking notes yet (think I should though, will start doing that if I'm still alive the 20th), so I logically have the tendency to make errors. On my FoSes and votes going everywhere: I'm just trying to get stuff done. Surely, we could fiddle around here, but I'm not the guy that can silently sit around, waiting for stuff to happen. I'm one of those guys that, if they see injustice - or think they see injustice - they want to do something.

To the typewriters out there, yes, this is a large post. Read it through, I actually had quite some stuff to react to. I used whitelines. I tried to make it as readable as possible. If there are any errors in here: Point them out, I'll EBWOP it asap.
I'm just thinking that killing a townie wouldn't really get you anywhere... So I try to defend myself.

by **t1mm01994** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 6:29 pm UTC

Votals: (counted from Adam's post, didn't check his work)
3 - t1mm (bio, misnomer, GoP)
1 - mpolo (Boomfrog)
1 - infina (adam)
1 - adam (infina)
1 - Misnomer ( t1mm01994)
So, bio has disappeared from the votings after what might be the single biggest houdini-act in the history of mankind.

by **b.i.o** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 9:47 pm UTC

t1mm01994 wrote:So, bio has disappeared from the votings after what might be the single biggest houdini-act in the history of mankind.

And now you'd like to do the same, right?

You're right though--the votes on me *have* gone away very quickly. At this point I'm somewhat suspicious of everyone who voted for me, just because doing so was a fairly safe way to get votes in the game. I'm actually most suspicious of someone who didn't vote for me, though: BoomFrog. He was the one to suggest getting me to 3 votes...but he didn't vote for me, for some reason. Then, when I explain myself, he says that he basically believes me almost immediately. His vote is for mpolo, who's basically been lurking, and is therefore a pretty safe vote.

So while I do find Tim scummy, my vote now goes to BF.

unvote
vote: BoomFrog

by **t1mm01994** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 10:47 pm UTC

I think that apart from an odd jester noone really _likes_ being lynched.. At least I don't.
Mod, could you replace RR in the OP with Mavketl? Tyvm.
@GoP: I used the list from there, and did a per-user analysis, not a read-through, and missed that lil' detail.
If I'm missing any questions, please repose them if you still feel like they matter.

by **ForAllOfThis** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 11:19 pm UTC

b.i.o wrote:I'm actually most suspicious of someone who didn't vote for me, though: BoomFrog. He was the one to suggest getting me to 3 votes...but he didn't vote for me, for some reason.

Actually he did. He had the first vote on you, then when I asked him to change it so that he was last in line (incase you were a jester and this was a trap), and he did. I can't be bothered to quote, but it's on page 7 making the above accusation false. Since then he has changed lynch targets Is that the only reason your voting for him?

Right now the scummiest thing I've seen is Adams over-reaction to infinas "theory". I would expect a town player to have a better response than a OMGUS vote. I see no clear reasoning for the vote and am not satisfied with Adams overall response, which doesn't sit well with me. So..

Vote: Adam H

by **BoomFrog** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 4:23 am UTC

As FAOT said, I did vote for b.i.o. but I always maintained it'd be better lynch someone else and let a vig kill him. In my last post I said I'm reconsidering about the vig, but I am now leaning towards yes, the vig should kill him. Still not 100% of course. But I think there's plenty of scum in this game.

by **b.i.o** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 8:17 am UTC

Right. I misread and was confused. Sorry about that. Going to replace my Tim vote (which I still think is an okay idea) until I get a chance to read things over again, because my last read-through was done under the influence of a lot of sake, and doesn't seem to have worked too well.

unvote
vote: Tim

by **weiyaoli** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 1:18 pm UTC

t1mm01994 wrote:On the change of heart on the numbers: I've merely changed in what I would find in them. I don't think there is a simple pattern like 1-25 town, 26-30 scum, 31-40 indie, or any simple division like that. I DO think that picking numbers did something; else I doubt she'd let us pick numbers. Going on the fact that mpolo has the same number as I do, I guessed he'd have the same role as me, as well...
So, to at least clear that up: mpolo, does the echo-well-thingy I claimed a couple pages ago sound familiar at all? If not, I'm going to let the numbers go.

The thing is, I don't think anyone ever thought it be as simple as 1-X scum/town etc..., the obvious inference is that it is role related. So your comments don't make sense in changing your mind on this regard, at least not enough to say that they are a red herring and then not. I can sort of see where AdamH is seeing a disconnect. You only mention the numbers maybe being interesting in your first post, but then you go on to say they are probably a red herring. Later on, you suddenly say:

t1mm01994 wrote:@mpolo: you didnt give hints, but our numbers are the same, and I still think the numbers are highly relevant to the game.

I'm not really following your Misnomer suspicion either. Why was mentioning a master and minion set-up just because it is rare a scummy thing to do? Also the farmer theory. I don't follow how being the farmer would equate to scum. I still believe the farmer is probably independent that wins if X people are hit with the post restriction. I can understand the bit about not really scum-hunting, but I think that's more just down to lurking (probably not active lurking due to his essay crisis which fits with his inactivity lately due to uni), I had to go back quite a few posts to find his last post and then more before a proper content post.

What do you mean by the bolded?:

t1mm01994 wrote:He attacked bio when he was at his crazy stage, which is trying to hit a shark thats eating someone at that time; everybody already knows they're not doing the right thing. Apart from that, he really hasnt done much, except for an OMGUS vote because I miscontributed one thing; to rightly contribute it: It came from Angua and was taken over by FAOT.

I'm not sure what you are referring to.

FoS: tim

Adam H wrote:I also think it's possible that 3 votes on bio won't be enough to save boomfrog, and I see no harm in putting him at 4. We're at 9 to lynch.

Do you mean roband?

GoP wrote:Is going on about conspiracies and colours, and generally not looking at other things, and votes infina for proposing that bio might have a cop result. Now, I don't agree with infina about the cop result, but I do suspect bio is trying to tell us something subtly. After being questioned about that vote, he claims it's not the only thing that is suspicious about infina, but doesnt elaborate on them, until much later. The elaboration (didn't like the vote on FAOT, and admitting a flaw.) Sounds like ad-hoc justification. Remember that was a day 1 vote, and they tend to be for flimsy reasons. You had extremely flimsy reasons for voting for infina.

I pretty much agree with this about Adam, barring the bit about bio telling stuff subtly.

FoS: Adam

I think I will vote for who I find more suspicious at this stage:

Vote: tim

by **Misnomer** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 2:34 pm UTC

Back.

Ok, so T1mm's still pushing for a lynch against me. I think most of the points have already been addressed by others, but for what it's worth, here's a summary of why the case against me sucks:

1. I am accused of being the polymorpher/farmer on the grounds that I posted between Roband's cure and the first sign of Mav's infection. Leaving aside the question of whether there was actually a role that was giving out these restrictions, the 'who was online' approach to scumhunting has been thoroughly discredited, with past games having shown it to be completely unreliable.

2. Even if I was the polymorpher though, the question remains - 'so what?'. There is nothing inherently anti-town about such a role. The only obvious anti-town connotation would be a non-standard cult, and that can effectively be ruled out because multiple recruits in a day would make a cult nigh-unstoppable. I know T1mm is now saying that this isn't the basis of his suspicions of me, but looking at his earlier posts it did seem to be his main argument (once his imaginary fakery accusation had been dismissed).

3. The whole master/minion thing - from what I gather, under T1mm's logic the only reason why anybody would ever speculate about a non-standard role is if they were that role themselves. Presumably I am therefore also a recruiting mason and an innocent child. In addition to being a polymorpher.

4. The lack of content thing - this last week, I've sadly been unable to have the time for this game, due to an explosion in course and work commitments. But its nonsense to say I wasn't producing any content before, and I am really quite suspicious that each one of T1mm's summaries of my posting conveniantly ignores whole sections of my posts (such as my contribution to the confirmed townies debate).

In short, T1mm's case against me is utterly groundless. I don't know if he's scum who's badly mishandled an attempt to lynch a largely inactive townie, or whether he's a lyncher for me. Either way, I want him dead - my vote stays.

In other thoughts - could EH have been our polymorpher? We don't seem to have had any farmyard restrictions today, and his has been the only death.

I have absolutely no idea of what to make of b.i.o's return to sanity, although I'm glad his posts are at the very least understandable again.

by **mpolo** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 9:15 pm UTC

Not a lot of time right now… Tim, I know nothing about an "echo well".

by **Angua** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 9:40 pm UTC

I know that I promised to write a post once I had time off, but I've come down with an abdominal migraine (or possibly gallstones the doctor I'm working with has decided I could have), so I'm too tired and energy-less to be useful.

I'm really sorry. Hopefully by tomorrow I'll be feeling a bit more perky.

by **BoomFrog** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 10:34 pm UTC

I'm usually on a crusade to defend the noobs, but Tim is making it pretty hard to understand his actions. I think lyncher for misnomer is very possible. He has enough votes on him for now though. No need to end the day early.

@b.I.o. you have once again found an excuse to vote the same person twice. You are clearly a double voter and you did vote for EH twice. Why did you put two votes on EH if your reason for voting was to spur discussion?

by **BoomFrog** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 10:37 pm UTC

Ebwop: if Tim is a lyncher he's probably indie. And if so then the best way to deal with him is to ignore him for now. We want to lynch real scum.

His conviction that he and mpolo share a role sounds genuine, and if Tim was scum he would know mpolo didn't have the same role. So I think Tim is either indie or town.

by **t1mm01994** » Sun Dec 18, 2011 12:19 am UTC

And with that post from mpolo, we can completely drop the numbers, I have nothing to deduce from that for the moment.
But yeah, in here you're not supposed to lynch indies? If so, I can stop my lynchplan, and
Unvote
Reacting to all suspicions of me in order, as deadline is reaching and I'm currently at 3 more votes than the number 2:

weiyaoli wrote:The thing is, I don't think anyone ever thought it be as simple as 1-X scum/town etc..., the obvious inference is that it is role related. So your comments don't make sense in changing your mind on this regard, at least not enough to say that they are a red herring and then not. I can sort of see where AdamH is seeing a disconnect. You only mention the numbers maybe being interesting in your first post, but then you go on to say they are probably a red herring. Later on, you suddenly say:
t1mm01994 wrote:@mpolo: you didnt give hints, but our numbers are the same, and I still think the numbers are highly relevant to the game.

As a matter of fact, I thought that. You can accuse me of thinking too simple, but not much more than that.

weiyaoli wrote:I'm not really following your Misnomer suspicion either. Why was mentioning a master and minion set-up just because it is rare a scummy thing to do? Also the farmer theory. I don't follow how being the farmer would equate to scum. I still believe the farmer is probably independent that wins if X people are hit with the post restriction. I can understand the bit about not really scum-hunting, but I think that's more just down to lurking (probably not active lurking due to his essay crisis which fits with his inactivity lately due to uni), I had to go back quite a few posts to find his last post and then more before a proper content post.

This should be cleared up by the top of this post.

weiyaoli wrote:What do you mean by the bolded?:
t1mm01994 wrote:He attacked bio when he was at his crazy stage, which is trying to hit a shark thats eating someone at that time; everybody already knows they're not doing the right thing. Apart from that, he really hasnt done much, except for an OMGUS vote because I miscontributed one thing; to rightly contribute it: It came from Angua and was taken over by FAOT.

I'm not sure what you are referring to.

Surely, searching through the thread you must have found the post in which Misnomer voted for me, after I said that Misnomer accused Roband and Mavketl of faking. The truth was that Angua first implied Roband and Mav might be faking, and FAOT was the one that stated it. Not Misnomer.

@Misnomer, sounds reasonable, hence the top of the post. Apart from that, referring to "past games" has very little value to me, as I am new here. At your 3rd point though, recruiting masons and innocent child are, according to the wikis I read, not entirely uncommon role.. Unlike a master-minion setup. Correct me if wrong, of course..
@BF: Thanks. Appreciate the effort, despite it not being a full power defense.. It seems I'm too suspicious for that.

Then again, what is the main suspicion of me at the moment?
Weiy votes because I turn on the numbers and try to kill Misnomer. Doesnt sound like that much of a reason.
Misnomer votes for me because of something very near OMGUS.
Bio votes for me because I make a huge post, and I allegedly dont answer questions; I have been answering questions since the first moment they were asked to me, I'd dare to say that I am the person that has answered the single most questions. And I figured adding content would be appreciated, but appearantly it isn't.. Posting twice in the entire thread is a better strategy. (Greenlover is out of the fireline)
GoP votes for me because I switch opinions on the numbers thing, and because I used the list in the OP for a summary. This is probably not the strongest reason one can imagine.

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