Making my computer more game-worthy

[Tirian]

So my brother is moving across the country and we decided that we'd do some MMORPGing to keep in touch. So I want to pimp out my eMachines ET1331G a bit. I'm not out to be a powergamer, but I would like to see what there is to see. I have a PCI and PCIe slot available.

The FAQ for SWTOR is saying that they suggest an nVidia 7800 or better. PassMark seems to be telling me that a GeForce 8400GS does not count as better, despite my keen mathematical skills telling me that it's a bigger number. If not, then what is that is within the range of cheapskates? Also, I've seen people say both ways about whether I need a new power supply, from that it's not necessary all the way to it's so important that you can't trust a no-name PSU.

The one thing I haven't seen through all my searches is a chat about whether this is the sort of upgrade that is painless for ordinary folk. I'm used to swapping out cards and drives on hardware, but have never fiddled with power supplies before, and evidently I'm also going to need to convince the BIOS to ignore the on-board GPU. Is this the sort of installation that I'd be safer leaving to the pros?

[Ghostbear]

The FAQ for SWTOR is saying that they suggest an nVidia 7800 or better. PassMark seems to be telling me that a GeForce 8400GS does not count as better, despite my keen mathematical skills telling me that it's a bigger number.

The reason for that is that the first number in product names- especially with graphics cards- tends (there's some cheating and variations on this, but you don't really need to be confused with all of that) to denote the architecture generation of the technology used. So a 7800 is from the 7xxx generation of cards, while an 8400 is from the 8xxx generation of cards- the x800 cards are typically a "high performance" sub-category, while the x400 cards are typically a "budget" sub-category. So (one of) the fastest card(s) from a prior tech is faster than one of the slowest cards in a newer tech. That's all their really is to the 8400GS not being sufficient.

Is this the specifications of your current rig? If so, the quick summary would be:
CPU: Athlon II 235e x2
RAM: 6 GB DDR2
GPU: Integrated Nvidia 6150

It doesn't list the power supply, but unless it's trash it should be able to handle a low end GPU. I tend to be adverse to any computer upgrades that touch anything as fundamental as the motherboard or power supply- for me, I usually figure it's best to just start from scratch at that point. Not everyone agrees with me on that way of thinking though- if you know the wattage & manufacturer of the power supply, that would be useful.

Doing some searching around (haven't bought a graphics card in a while, so I'm a bit out of date), and most of the really low-end stuff wouldn't fit the bill of being as a good as an Nvidia ~7800 or better. Something like this Radeon 5670 is probably your best bet, at ~$70 + $5 shipping. This Radeon 6670 would be even better, for $70 with free shipping, but while searching there was some mention of issues with it dealing with PCIe 1.x lanes, and you haven't mentioned if you have PCIe 1.x or 2.x. Theoretically, all PCI express devices should be backwards compatible, but I wouldn't discount the probability that the issues are real either. Are you aware of which version of PCI express you have?

[Tirian]

Yeah, I'm aggravated that my System isn't giving me a suffix on the model number and I can't figure out where to find it, but that isn't quite it.

CPU: Athlon II 250u x2
RAM: 4 GB (I'll trust that it's DDR2 but can't say for certain)
GPU: integrated 6150SE nForce 430

I can't tell about the generation of the PCIe either from looking at the motherboard. I (literally) inherited this rig from my uncle and didn't get the documentation. I suspect that it's a WalMart special bought 12-18 months ago, which may or may not answer your question.

[Ghostbear]

If you're willing to run CPU-Z ID we can get the model # of the motherboard and try to determine the PCI express generation from there- not a guarantee, as some OEM boards can be hard to find information on. But worth a shot, I think.

Looking up the model for your CPU though, indicates it runs at 1.6 GHz- if that's true then it'd probably be a very significant bottleneck for running SWTOR as-is, graphics aside. Looking at the required specifications, it wouldn't meet them, sorry to say. Maybe CPU-Z will give contrary information though.

[Tirian]

It's 1.6 GHz for each of the two processors. When I checked PassMark I was convinced that it was at least within shouting distance of the spec, although like the graphic card specs it frightens and confuses me. (Aha, just re-checked Can You Run It and found that they have added SWTOR in the past few days, and they do verify that I pass everything except that graphics support.)

I can put my whole CPU-Z report if anyone is fascinated with all of the minutiae, but my motherboard is MCP61PM-GM. A quick Googling revealed a discussion thread where someone said that my PCIe is v1.

Thanks for all your help, BTW! If Santa calls me to check up on you, I'll be sure to mention how nice you've been.

[Ghostbear]

Glad to offer what help I can! I'm just sorry that I can't give any definitive "yes, this will work guaranteed" answers . People always commented on that when they roped me into being their computer repair bitch though.

It looks like I was off with the CPU bit- for some reason I thought the Athlon 64 4000+ was faster than 2 GHz, so an Athlon II (not actually that huge a change architecturally, but still an improvement) at 1.6 GHz will probably be sufficient to get by. They only offered one spec online, and I can't tell if it's meant to be closer to "recommended" (aka this game will run "ok") or "minimum" (aka, the game will run.. usually), so I'd be wary without more information. Not that you'd be doomed if it was minimum, but I'm a cautious person overall. Do you know anyone else with a lower end computer that plays SWTOR? You could ask them how it runs overall, give you an idea for the flexibility.

Also, looking back at the two cards- the 5670 is also a PCIe 2 card, so if you're going to go down that route, it'd probably be best to bet on the 6670. I don't expect that the compatibility issues are common, and officially there should be no issue. It's just hard to find out how potentially wide-spread (or just outright existent) reports of that nature are.

[PhoenixEnigma]

Some of the newer (Juniper and onwards, IIRC) AMD cards did seem to have trouble with older nVidia chipsets (or vice versa, take your pick), but I believe the 6150 should be okay. My 590SLI board did not work with them, my 6150 board works just fine.

Power supply shouldn't be an issue - the 6670 doesn't draw that much more power than an 8400GS (66W vs 40W), and while my faith in eMachines PSUs is pretty limited, with a 25W (!) CPU, as long as your power supply is more than a couple nails in a lemon you should be okay (well, assuming it's a 100W or so lemon). Google suggests it's probably a 300W power supply, which ought to be plenty.

In terms of difficulty in replacing, it shouldn't be too hard - you'll want to uninstall the current video card drivers if you're going from nVidia -> AMD, shut down the PC and unplug, swap out the physical card (usually just a single screw, then pop it out. Remember to take anti-static precautions), turn it back on, and install the new drivers.

[Endless Mike]

Frankly, I think drivers should be uninstalled any time you swap cards, even within a manufacturer, but that might just me being overly concerned.

[asye288]

Both Radeon 5670 and 6670 are obsoleting. Your best bet will be something like hd 6790 which may cost you $120 but it does require a psu with 500w output. Please check you psu before you buy the new card.

[mosc]

Realize I'm a week or two late here but:

1) Do not assume this PC has a PCIe 16x slot.
2) Do not assume anything about the power supply. 300 watts may be an over-statement.
3) There is nothing you can run at a software level to tell you anything about 1 and 2. You have to open the case. Even then, PCIe 16x slots are sometimes only 4 lanes and power supplies are often not marked at all.

If you own a discount machine like an emachine, most dells, etc, you should not count on any measure of upgradability.

[jimbates]

I dont know if you got an answer to this. so here's a general guideline for nvidia cards
to a large degree
the first number is the cards series series, the second is a speed rating. followed by 2 0's.

so an 8400 will perform similarly to a 7400 in dx9 mode

to use dx10 you would need the 8 series card, but wont need it for dx9.

the dx version you want depends on the OS youre using, xp= dx9, vista= dx10,win7=dx10 or dx11.
Use the os to determine which series , then a larger speed rating =higher fps. Either card would work, but you would get a higher fps in xp with the 7 series, and more detail in vista or win7 with the 8 series.