League of Legends

Of the Tabletop, and other, lesser varieties.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby eeris » Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:18 pm UTC

Shen buff looks awesome. Must try.

Spoiler:
Shen

Ki Strike
Damage increased to 10-112 (+10% bonus Health) from 10-95 (+8% bonus Health)
Cooldown is now reduced by 1.5 seconds whenever Shen attacks instead of 2 seconds when being attacked
Now grants Shen 10/20/30 energy when he Ki Strikes
Damage now scale correctly with all sources of bonus Health (% health runes, Juggernaut mastery)
Added a buff timer for Ki Strike's cooldown (like Ziggs' Short Fuse)
Vorpal Blade
Energy cost adjusted to 60 from 70/65/60/55/50
Damage adjusted to 60/105/150/195/240 (+0.6 ability power) from 70/105/140/175/210 (+0.75 ability power)
Heal effect changed to 6/10/14/18/22 (+2% of Shen's maximum Health) from 18/26/34/42/50
If Vorpal Blade deals the killing blow, it will now trigger 33% of the heal effect for Shen
Allied damaging spells can now trigger the heal effect, in addition to attacks (Vorpal Blade cannot trigger itself)
Feint
Feint duration increased to 3 seconds from 2.5
Energy cost reduced to 40 from 45
Shield amount adjusted to 70/120/170/220/270 (+0.6 ability power) from 50/100/150/200/250 (+0.75 ability power)
While Feint is active, Ki Strike’s cooldown reduction on hit is increased to 3 seconds from 1.5
Shadow Dash
Cooldown reduced to 10/9.5/9/8.5/8 seconds from 10
Energy cost increased to 120 from 120/115/110/105/100
Restores 40 energy per champion affected (rather than a flat 50 energy if you affect one)
Now deals 50/85/120/155/190 damage (+0.5 ability power) to Champions
Taunt duration adjusted to 1.5 seconds from 1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2
Shadow Dash now grants Shen 50% physical damage reduction from taunted targets
Stand United
Channel time increased to 3 seconds from 2.5
Shield duration reduced to 5 seconds from 7.5
Shield amount increased to 250/550/850 from 200/475/750
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Re: League of Legends

Postby rigwarl » Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:26 pm UTC

Who needs taunt when u can pick newguy and no one can click on your teammates!
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Lostdreams » Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:07 pm UTC

Played against a jungle Shen yesterday, he's easily more lethal than Rammus. What he lacks in the speed from powerball he more than makes up in the range of his taunt and the burst that he outputs, especially early game. If you build him right he can easily turn a save into a gank also.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Windowlicker » Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:49 pm UTC

Played a bunch with our tournament team today, first time full 5v5 teams... holy shit, it's like a completely different game. Good fun, but christ it is difficult. It took us quite a lot of time just to get used to the coordination.. getting warding together, being in the right place at the right time, etc. Those silly pros making it look so easy.

Edit: On a slightly different note, I want to see Nautilus building attack speed, just 'cause I don't know how the animation would look sped up.
Last edited by Windowlicker on Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:54 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby setzer777 » Fri Feb 17, 2012 10:53 pm UTC

Yeah, I keep my casual ass in Dominion these days. Easier to fit in my schedule too.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby rigwarl » Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:22 am UTC

ARAM on Dominion is epic due to short respawns.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby eeris » Sat Feb 18, 2012 2:43 pm UTC

rigwarl wrote:ARAM on Dominion is epic due to short respawns.


It has some issues, ie its worth it to just let the enemy team kill you when your on low health, but can be damn fun. Full build Singed's make me cry.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Kolko » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:38 pm UTC

Full build Singed ALWAYS makes people cry :D
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Re: League of Legends

Postby elminster » Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:22 am UTC

I think shen got overbuffed a bit (A common sentiment on the forums). I played him twice in ranked, won both even though I've almost never played him. He can easily get hard countered top though.
I think soraka got made a bit more powerful, she doesn't need to mana herself really. With the new mana sustain, it's even more effective with some champs and potentially opens options for new duo bot combinations (Mana heavy champs w/ soraka).
Judging from high level play and what I seen, owning yorick is a must for people who want top often.

Gone up from 1521 to 1580 elo today. Had two games with trolls which we lost (One where they did ashe + AD ez bot vs gp + graves... with obvious results).

I'm confused as to why people think sion is bad. He carries solo q pretty well. Scored 12/1/12 and 9/3/13 in today's games with him.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Bakemaster » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:46 am UTC

Yeah I played Soraka today for the first time since patch and I like the change. I have never really worried about going OOM with her to begin with because I rarely use her Q at all and it's the only skill she has that doesn't have a substantial CD.

There was a Karthus on the enemy team; I very much enjoyed taking away most of the punch of his ult via careful use of Soraka's. He has to channel, hers is practically instantaneous, so if your team has low HP you can heal before he hits and if they have full HP you can wait and heal after. Plus in team fights he would always run in with his AOE blasting, making himself a big loud target to be silenced and destroyed. It was a fun game.

I have a strong urge to own more champs, but I really need a third rune page and runes to fill it with. Sigh. I want Ziggs... He's so damn fun!
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Windowlicker » Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:50 am UTC

Based on my last few games, I think my hidden normal ELO has somehow gone into negative values. Goddamnit I just want to win a fucking game.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:41 pm UTC

So....is it just me or is Graves kinda OP. I was in a game last night, where he got super fed, which in and of itself is a problem. We won our other lanes, but bot lost hard (Ez/Soroka) to (Graves/ Fiddle). Anyhow, Graves got really fed, and there was pretty much nothing we could do, even though me mid as Brand was 5/1, our jungle Mao was like 1/2/15 and our top Panth was doing decent like 5-3 or something. He was the only one on their team that had really any kills, but this point like 10-1. But we just couldnt kill him, he is really tanky and has great mobility for the damage he puts out.

So like I said the main problem was he got fed, now my question is, what other champs that when fed like that make a game, at this point he could almost 1v5 us he hit so hard? It just seems like most other champs that can hit that hard when fed, also die a lot faster.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby omgryebread » Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:07 pm UTC

Drumheller769 wrote:So....is it just me or is Graves kinda OP. I was in a game last night, where he got super fed, which in and of itself is a problem. We won our other lanes, but bot lost hard (Ez/Soroka) to (Graves/ Fiddle). Anyhow, Graves got really fed, and there was pretty much nothing we could do, even though me mid as Brand was 5/1, our jungle Mao was like 1/2/15 and our top Panth was doing decent like 5-3 or something. He was the only one on their team that had really any kills, but this point like 10-1. But we just couldnt kill him, he is really tanky and has great mobility for the damage he puts out.

So like I said the main problem was he got fed, now my question is, what other champs that when fed like that make a game, at this point he could almost 1v5 us he hit so hard? It just seems like most other champs that can hit that hard when fed, also die a lot faster.
Yeah, Graves is kind of on the OP side. I think he's the top AD at this point, a step above Vayne and Sivir. When anyone gets a score like 10/1 early though it ends up kind of stupid. It's definitely more noticeable on some champs. Graves, GP, Vayne, Riven, Rumble, and Kennen all come to mind. In low ELOs (like whatever my normal ELO is), stealth champs. It's to the point where I'm tempted to dodge any game that Shaco isn't banned. I'm usually the only one warding on my team, so every gank mid and top results in a kill for him. Eventually 2 shiv poison and backstab just murder everything.

I've been enjoying Leona lately. She's really fun in lane, though I always seem to drop off later, since I play her as a support and can't build as much tank gear as she needs to be relevant.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:57 pm UTC

Ok. Like you said, there are some heroes that even though they are fed, you can jump all over them and focus them down, but you can't do that with Graves..and I would agree, Kennen too.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby rigwarl » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:21 pm UTC

Mordekaiser is probably the best 1v5 champion when fed since dealing damage gives you shield, also if you gib their carry with ult/Ignite/Gunblade it's like 2v4! I have done so several times in my adventures in ELO Hell*. Master Yi, Katarina, and Akali all reset cooldowns on kill so they're great too.

But more practically dangerous game winning champions when fed are more along the lines of Kassadin, who can singlehandly kill anyone on your team except your tank within 15 seconds of leaving mid lane.

*Oh I realized I never actually posted this, but if anyone is interested in a followup to a couple months back when we had some discussion on whether being lower ELO can actually make it harder rather than easier to win and I believe Phrozt challenged me to actually try it, I dropped my ELO to about 700 doing the dodge strategy and my current W-L is 200-10 (I know some people here might hate me for it, but I mainly do this because it is fun). As you might guess, I still remain unconvinced that your winrate can actually decrease as your ELO decreases (and vice versa).
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:41 pm UTC

I think there is a specific range in lower ELO's where if there is anyone at all good, they will rolfstomp the other team, to one where the players are good enough that one team having a single person who is less good or 'feeds' makes quite a bit larger difference, being a 20-0 kassadin doesn't help when the enemy team as 5 people who are 8-0.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby eeris » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:09 pm UTC

rigwarl wrote:Mordekaiser is probably the best 1v5 champion when fed since dealing damage gives you shield, also if you gib their carry with ult/Ignite/Gunblade it's like 2v4! I have done so several times in my adventures in ELO Hell*. Master Yi, Katarina, and Akali all reset cooldowns on kill so they're great too.

But more practically dangerous game winning champions when fed are more along the lines of Kassadin, who can singlehandly kill anyone on your team except your tank within 15 seconds of leaving mid lane.

*Oh I realized I never actually posted this, but if anyone is interested in a followup to a couple months back when we had some discussion on whether being lower ELO can actually make it harder rather than easier to win and I believe Phrozt challenged me to actually try it, I dropped my ELO to about 700 doing the dodge strategy and my current W-L is 200-10 (I know some people here might hate me for it, but I mainly do this because it is fun). As you might guess, I still remain unconvinced that your winrate can actually decrease as your ELO decreases (and vice versa).


The problem I have with lower ELO games where you can't just carry yourself is that you tend to just go on long winning streaks and long losing streaks. I honestly don't mind losing 2 or 3 games on the trot but when you lose 4 in a row because of leavers / feeders / people who just can't play the game, it gets quite depressing. Of course I then go onto win my next 5 games on the trot before 25 minutes are up but it just doesn't even out your satisfaction level.

EDIT: And yeah, Graves is a bit of a bitch right now, especially when paired with soraka in lane and you can't even trade blows because you know he'll just get healed up whilst you wait for pot regen. To be honest, there isn't too much point in playing any other AD carry unless you want some CC or more range. In fact just check out his base stats and scaling vs Tristana. He has an absurdly higher base mana pool & regen as well as higher scaling. More movement speed, higher base AD with the same scaling. Quickdraw which gives great mobility and faster attack speed only costs 50 mana and only when his other skills are at level 5 do they cost less than what tristana's spells cost at level 1.

So yeah... buff tristana or nerf graves please.

EDIT EDIT: I'm also not above thinking that Riot deliberately release more expensive heroes to just be down right better than cheaper ones until everyone has bought the new one.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby rigwarl » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:24 pm UTC

Drumheller769 wrote:I think there is a specific range in lower ELO's where if there is anyone at all good, they will rolfstomp the other team, to one where the players are good enough that one team having a single person who is less good or 'feeds' makes quite a bit larger difference, being a 20-0 kassadin doesn't help when the enemy team as 5 people who are 8-0.


Well, if you are 20-0, everyone on average on the other team will be X-4 (AND, that's even assuming the rest of your team is 0-X!). Anyway this probably isn't the crux of what you are saying, but I'm not really sure I understand it.

To clarify, I'm not saying you shouldn't lose at lower ELO brackets. Simply that, for example, the probability of losing 4 times in a row at a lower ELO is lower than the probability of losing 4 times in a row at a higher ELO. But it is still certainly possible!
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:29 pm UTC

I would disagree. If you look back a while in this thread I was complaining about a 10+ game losing streak. Immediately after that I went on a 10+ game winning streak, although I did play Brand for all of those games and did very well (instead of playing whatever). It's very easy to streak I would say.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby rigwarl » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:30 pm UTC

Drumheller769 wrote:I would disagree. If you look back a while in this thread I was complaining about a 10+ game losing streak. Immediately after that I went on a 10+ game winning streak, although I did play Brand for all of those games and did very well (instead of playing whatever). It's very easy to streak I would say.


I'm not sure how this is a disagreement with anything I said. If anything, it's more of an agreement.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:31 pm UTC

Umm, maybe I read it wrong...I guess what I am trying to say is that in my experience, its easy to streak win or lose, at a lower elo. If that is not disagreement...then just disregard that part.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby rigwarl » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:36 pm UTC

OK I will try restating what I believe to be true 1 more time:

If you are at 1000 ELO, you are less likely to lose 10 games in a row than if you are at 1200 ELO (applies to player of any level of skill).
If you are at 1000 ELO, you are more likely to win 10 games in a row than if you are at 1200 ELO (applies to player of any level of skill).

In fact, loss streak followed by win streak OR VICE VERSA is pretty much to be expected assuming you are at your stable ELO and haven't made any drastic changes to your gameplay, since a loss streak puts you at lower ELO where you are more likely to win, and a win streak puts you at higher ELO where you are more likely to lose.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:43 pm UTC

Ohhhhhh, I see. Yea, sorry about that I totally read that wrong before.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:46 pm UTC

So, another question. I have been saving IP for a time. I'm looking for an AD bot that is a bit more complex than point and shoot. I was thinking Ezreal, but I'm not sure if he is worth it. Opinions?
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Re: League of Legends

Postby eeris » Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:29 pm UTC

Drumheller769 wrote:So, another question. I have been saving IP for a time. I'm looking for an AD bot that is a bit more complex than point and shoot. I was thinking Ezreal, but I'm not sure if he is worth it. Opinions?


Graves, vayne or kog'maw would be my bets. Probably in that order of preference too, although Kog'maw probably requires more team coordination... Ashe seems to be having a comeback but I'm not convinced that she's up to par with other options. I bought Ezreal on my smurf with my christmas RP but he wasn't really my cup of tea, I found it hard to really dominate with him like I could do if I was playing as say Tristana.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby rigwarl » Fri Feb 24, 2012 9:41 pm UTC

Here are some of the player-styles I associate with those guys, maybe this helps if you find one that fits you more than the others:

Kog'maw = excels with generally defensive play, solid mechanics (skill management, superior poking/last hitting fight), and yea due to no natural flash is more reliant on teammates
Ezrael = excels with "numbers" game knowledge since you often have to fully commit for a kill, and ability to predict movement for skillshots
Vayne = excels with creative play, and clear understanding of teamfights (since you basically hunt 1 target whereas the other 2 can throw tons of random AoE/skillshots into the fray)
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Re: League of Legends

Postby eeris » Sat Feb 25, 2012 5:59 pm UTC

Sivir would also be a good choice and is quite a bit cheaper than the others. A good pick if your opponents choose offensive laners, especially alongside soraka.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Bakemaster » Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:38 pm UTC

I second the recommendation of Sivir. She's definitely more complex than point and shoot. Knowing how and when to use her spell shield takes a ton of experience, and she's very strong late-game but can't play as all-out aggressively in lane as a lot of other top AD carries. I feel like playing her gives me better practice in the role than playing just about any other AD carry.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:39 pm UTC

So I had one of those games last night that I should have lost, but didnt. I was mid as Brand(who is my strongest champ) against a Cass. At first we were even in cs/kills as we traded twice 2/2, but then I started losing fights, each time she would live with under 50hp, it was rather frustrating, but b/c of that happening 3 times, she got fed. I didnt know this until after the game, but she was a full 200 elo above me and due Qing, so I dont feel as bad about losing since she didnt completely eat me alive. But even though I lost mid lane and they got Baron twice, my team was amazingly well coordinated and each time they got Baron we killed 3-4 of them when they pushed in. Because the other team couldnt finish us we eventually got them out of position and wiped them, but I was just amazed at how good my team was cooperating. It was nice to not get a lose even though I got out played.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby eeris » Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:36 pm UTC

So I'm pushing up to the 1600s and thought I'd give this thread a bump with some thoughts and try and get some more chat on the go.

Some thoughts:

    Relatively speaking I have found it easier getting from 1400 to 1576 than I did going from 1275 to 1400.
    I have yet to go on a losing streak like sometimes happened in the lower ranges
    I haven't had a winning streak like I had to get myself out of the lower ranges
    I do not know enough about jungling or top lane matches to play those roles competently at this ELO due to mainly play AD / support.

With that last point in mind I'm going to be leveling a smurf on EUW with which to practice these roles, if anyone wishes to queue with me with their own smurf I'll be playing under the summoner name Níl (currently level 9). Good times will be had.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Drumheller769 » Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:41 pm UTC

So I just bought riven and she feels amazingly OP, I usually have trouble against Irelia with most of the champs I play, and with riven I just ate her....it was ridiculous.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby eeris » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:42 pm UTC

Drumheller769 wrote:So I just bought riven and she feels amazingly OP, I usually have trouble against Irelia with most of the champs I play, and with riven I just ate her....it was ridiculous.


I... can't play Riven. Although on the anti-irelia note, I have had success with both Udyr and Shyvana against her.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Windowlicker » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:49 pm UTC

I tried Riven a couple of times whilst she's been free.. I couldn't really get her to work either. And from Irelia's perspective.. none of those champions are hard counters as such, you're just going to have to outplay her. Though I have more or less moved on to WW for top-laning, he feels ridiculously OP. Gangplank would probably be my hardest lane, but you can out-sustain him, and at a certain point in items he won't be able to trade anymore.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Jesse » Tue Mar 06, 2012 12:28 am UTC

Finally got around to trying out Cho'Gath today, liked him so much I bought him. Had to solo mid with him though, down to random PUG being terrible and everyone else just going where they felt like rather than what made sense, but despite that I managed to hold it decently well, and we had a classy Shyvana that helped me out when it turned into a 3 on 1 situation.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Bakemaster » Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:46 am UTC

Windowlicker wrote:I have more or less moved on to WW for top-laning, he feels ridiculously OP.

I would be curious to see MF vs WW top lane.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Windowlicker » Tue Mar 06, 2012 1:11 pm UTC

Methinks she might be a bit squishy. I'd probably change my build for it (going damage instead of Spirit Visage), but I think it could still go alright. What's the cooldown on her W?
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Re: League of Legends

Postby ProZac » Tue Mar 06, 2012 3:24 pm UTC

I played a ton of Jarvan this past week with the intention of learning him so I had a more CC capable jungler (outside of Rammus who is always banned). Things went ok, I enjoyed him, but wasn't doing too great. I decided to try Nautilus before he went away. I had been putting him off thinking I wouldn't enjoy him.... I was entirely wrong. I've played 4 games with him and won each, and screwed something up in the jungle in each one of those. Now I feel like I wasted all that time on Jarvan when I could have just been playing Nautilus.

I really need to start learning other roles though. I'm a respectable AD carry, I can't (and will never) play a mage. I've been doing top a support from time to time... but I'm a terrible support.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Bakemaster » Wed Mar 07, 2012 5:23 am UTC

If you like junglers with good CC, try Nunu and Amumu. They have slightly different roles and playstyles. Amumu is a better tank with generally stronger CC; he really shines in team fights. Nunu has arguably better gank potential because he depends less on R to secure a kill, and his Q is great for jungling. I find him more difficult to play well, personally.
Windowlicker wrote:Methinks she might be a bit squishy. I'd probably change my build for it (going damage instead of Spirit Visage), but I think it could still go alright. What's the cooldown on her W?

Wiki says 16 seconds. You're probably right that she's too squishy for the job, but maybe with the right build...? I dunno, I don't play her at all really.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby ProZac » Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:20 pm UTC

Bakemaster wrote:If you like junglers with good CC, try Nunu and Amumu.

Any thoughts on Amumu vs Sejuani? From a jungling perspective they seem nearly identical. I have played Sejuani and will likely pick her up at some point. I just know her weakness would be that if anything shows up in my jungle, Sej can't fight 1v1 at all.

Up to 8 games played with Nautilus, and I've won all but one. And the one I lost was against a Shaco. I hate him SO MUCH. 0 fun to be had in any games he's involved with.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Bakemaster » Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:40 pm UTC

Well, Amumu has problems with counter-jungling champs too. I tried Sej while she was free and didn't really like her. Not sure how her clear times compare to Amumu's, and I haven't felt her presence very much late-game. Not much I can say there.

I'm also far from the most experienced jungler in the world, though.
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