[SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Jessica » Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:54 pm UTC

Regarding agender, bisexuality, and the partial privilege each may have access to.

I know that, personally, I fell... I guess a form of jealousy, and envy when I hear about people who consider themselves trans, but have both passing privilege, and cis-privilege. I have a friend, who considers themselves to be androgyne, but they also present as male, were born male, and have no problems passing as male. I have another friend who started to transition from female to male, then de-transitioned back to female, who also considers herself to be trans (FTMTF). She has 3 children, and passes completely as female, looks female, and has all the privilege associated with that.

Sometimes, even though I don't want to, I have an emotional reaction to these friends. It's a strange mix of envy for not having some of the issues I have, and part anger at them claiming a label which I also claim. Like, they are staking a claim to part of me that is much harder for me to claim then it is for them. It's irrational. But, I know how difficult it is for me to pass as female, and I know that even if I pass, I can have my gender questioned at any time, and I'll always be trans. It's not something I can really choose.

I try and not allow this irrational feeling colour my experiences, but it does exist.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby drash » Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:20 pm UTC

I think I feel something a bit similar when I see happily (and heterosexually) married bisexual people. Even though they may very well have gone through a similar kind of trouble, and even though the whole point of civil rights movements is that people shouldn't have to be in trouble just for being themselves, it can be very easy to allow an uncharitable resentment to build up towards those who can evade the challenges without mitigating the situation for others.

I've also found myself befriending a whole lot of non-gender-binary types in the last year or so (I moved in to a commune full of quasi-lesbian quasi-pagan quasi-authors :) ). A polyamorous lesbian (with a boyfriend), whose wife is uncomfortable with the female gender and pronoun set for reasons I do not understand but I'm sure are good ('wife' is still fine), who also has a parner who transitioned to female some time ago but prefers not to be the subject of gendered language, and we also share another close friend who identifies as female but whose clothing options all somehow manage to present as 'drag' rather than 'feminine' (this is deliberate, we're all dully impressed). I'm mostly just thankful that they were all very understanding of my stumbles while I got used to using "them" as a non-gendered singlar pronoun.

There's also a lot of fun to be had living on the edges of gender expression- it's got me thinking about my own relationship with gender a bit more thoroughly. On the one hand, I'm perfectly content to let others refer to me as cisgendered, but on the other, I'm increasingly uncomfortable using it for myself. It just doesn't properly mean anything in terms of the way I frame my (male) gender. I like maleness, and I enjoy having it, but always I've thought of it as something somebody else invented and assigned to me like an arranged marriage. So I tend not to think of myself as cisgendered because that word implies an innateness that I don't feel, rather than a good match beween social construct and temperament.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby ChimeraMica » Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:47 pm UTC

Jessica wrote:Regarding agender, bisexuality, and the partial privilege each may have access to.

I know that, personally, I fell... I guess a form of jealousy, and envy when I hear about people who consider themselves trans, but have both passing privilege, and cis-privilege. I have a friend, who considers themselves to be androgyne, but they also present as male, were born male, and have no problems passing as male. I have another friend who started to transition from female to male, then de-transitioned back to female, who also considers herself to be trans (FTMTF). She has 3 children, and passes completely as female, looks female, and has all the privilege associated with that.

Sometimes, even though I don't want to, I have an emotional reaction to these friends. It's a strange mix of envy for not having some of the issues I have, and part anger at them claiming a label which I also claim. Like, they are staking a claim to part of me that is much harder for me to claim then it is for them. It's irrational. But, I know how difficult it is for me to pass as female, and I know that even if I pass, I can have my gender questioned at any time, and I'll always be trans. It's not something I can really choose.

I try and not allow this irrational feeling colour my experiences, but it does exist.


I understand how you feel. It can be hard for someone not be jealous of people who have had it easier, and sometimes even harder not to feel superior to someone else because they feel they've suffered more.
In some ways, those who are perceived as not "suffering as much" have it worse because it can be more lonely. Bisexual people were often dismissed by gay communities, and since they were rejected by non-queer society, just like other members of lgbt communities, they had little means of support. I don't think anyone has the right to gauge another person's suffering, or to tell someone that they don't deserve to call themselves victims. There are just too many people getting hurt, and too much at stake.



P.S. I by no means am directing this at you. I kept it brief because if I made it longer I'd end up ranting, as my own having been marginalized has filled me with a decent amount of rage, but I thought it might help to tell you my own take on the issue, even if it is brief. I only wish I could tell you examples in my life, like drash, but I've been getting out of a number of bad circumstances for most of my life, and only recently managed to emerge as a much more happy person, so I can't think about really anything in my past without getting emotional, so ragey stuff like this keeps me sane. Sorry if it seems to be directed at you. (Also I can be super nervous and apologetic. XD Sorry.)
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby AnnaArmour » Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:10 am UTC

ChimeraMica wrote:Sometimes it's best to just ignore all worries and just plunge in recklessly. :3

This.

I really wish I had started going to the lgbt youth group sooner.
I made this cake for the last meeting:
Spoiler:
Image

In other news, I came out to my psychiatrist and he didn't make a big deal out of it.
And an older butch winked at me today.
And I met a girl :D

So I'm feeling pretty great at the moment! Hugs to anyone who needs them.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby ChimeraMica » Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:15 am UTC

AnnaArmour wrote:
Spoiler:
Image



Yes!
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Amie » Wed Feb 29, 2012 3:39 am UTC

Jessica wrote:...they are staking a claim to part of me that is much harder for me to claim then it is for them. It's irrational. But, I know how difficult it is for me to pass as female...

There are things that are much harder for you than they are for me and there are things that are much harder for me than they are for you. As a person who is agender, I kind of hate the fact that such a thing as "gender" and that all the complications associated with it exist at all. I have to live in this world knowing that that will never change. You *care* about passing as female. I don't. My problems are different from yours. In someone's efforts to pass as female, they may, for instance, wear clothing stereotypically associated as "feminine" and I can understand that completely. But on one level, that also reinforces the notion that "this is female/feminine" which I don't subscribe to. That wouldn't be such a huge problem if this entire society were to just fucking not be prejudiced. Like I mentioned previously, I've lost jobs and have not enjoyed any company at all because of this. Maybe people will look at me and say "yeah she looks like a girl" and I can use the women's bathroom but that's where it ends. It doesn't win me any place in people's social circles because no woman I have ever met actually relates to me - specifically because I don't have a gender.

I am not trying to invalidate your problems and, again, in some areas, they are far greater than my own. But that doesn't mean it is, in general, much harder for you, than it is for me.

Unrelated: I am sorry if all this sounded too incoherent and rambly. I am currently dealing with a horrible post-rape situation and may therefore not make much/any sense. I most certainly didn't mean to offend anyone and like most people, I am not above irrationality.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby PM 2Ring » Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:18 am UTC

Amie wrote:Unrelated: I am sorry if all this sounded too incoherent and rambly. I am currently dealing with a horrible post-rape situation and may therefore not make much/any sense. I most certainly didn't mean to offend anyone and like most people, I am not above irrationality.


Oh. Shit. :~( :cry:

Please feel free to ramble incoherently, Amie.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Brace » Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:24 am UTC

It's interesting, because it's possible to be FtM or MtF without actually caring about "gender" in the social sense. Some people are dysphoric about their body but not so much their social role, and others vice-versa. I think I might be agender in that sense.

Also I'm so sorry that happened to you. You've been civil and cogent even by normal standards but in this context please don't apologize. You have bigger things to worry about than whether something you wrote on the internet came off wrong and you could hardly be faulted if it did.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby sambot5 » Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:39 pm UTC

Amie wrote:Unrelated: I am sorry if all this sounded too incoherent and rambly. I am currently dealing with a horrible post-rape situation and may therefore not make much/any sense. I most certainly didn't mean to offend anyone and like most people, I am not above irrationality.


Don't worry if you've offended someone. You're recovering from a tough situation, and we're all here for you. :)
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Amie » Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:00 pm UTC

Thank you all. I appreciate it.
Summer is miles and miles away, and no one would ask me to stay.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Jessica » Wed Feb 29, 2012 10:27 pm UTC

I'm not offended in the least, and I want you to know that I'm behind you if you want me to be.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Black Dynamite » Thu Mar 01, 2012 6:07 am UTC

I need some inspiration, today.
Spoiler:
I constantly feel completely out of place in this body of mine. It is a daily struggle of feeling completely uncomfortable. Everybody sees me as a man, and treats me like one, and that's not me. That's not who I am. I want to be treated like the girl I am. I never really realized how much gender really plays a part in pretty much every interaction between people. And now that I'm hyper aware of it, it is driving me crazy. I want to be the girl I am on the inside shining brightly on the outside. And I want that right now. But I'm constantly plagued with awful, insecure thoughts. I'm the hairiest person in my entire family; I'm like a giant bear, covered in fur. And I shave all the time. I shave everything that I possibly can shave, and I just can't get rid of all my hair. There are spots that I just can't reach or shave effectively, and because I cant' get them I get so frustrated and I break down crying almost every time I try. And the spots that I can shave have a horrible problem with red bumps and itchiness and ingrown hairs. My skin is so awful and not smooth and unfeminine. And I'm so afraid to try wearing women's clothes because I'm convinced I'll look ridiculous and I'll loose all my hope of being a beautiful woman and I'll die on the inside. I'm terrified of just looking like a creepy man in a dress.

In school all day, I'm completely jealous of other girls. I am jealous of their beautiful hair, their skin, their curves, their clothes, their everything. I hate how it seems to me they all take it for granted. I want to be them so desperately and they just neglect it. They have always had it, their used to it, it's theirs. I just want to be a normal girl. I feel like I have no role models to look up to, as well. I don't know how to be a girl, I've never been taught these things. All girls are taught how to be girls, gender roles and socialization, blah blah blah. But all I know is how to be a guy. I don't know what to do about that, and it really stresses me out. I have started trying to pee sitting down, to feel more lady-like (I have been told that is a very important thing in the FtM world; standing and peeing, that is), and that is the only thing I feel like I'm not doing wrong. (even though I feel like I am doing it wrong, especially, because I don't have a damn vulva to wipe front to back.) I also feel like I could spend all of my time complaining about this, an all of my time talking about this, and that I'm pretty sure my gender problems are all that I think about constantly. I have no one to talk about them with, except for my girlfriend (who doesn't want to hear it) and my therapist (who isn't trained to help with it). I also feel like since my pool of people to talk to is so small and I have so much to say, I think I would burn them out too quickly. So I am afraid to say too much. So I have to bottle all these feelings inside all the time.

And my girlfriend stresses me out so much about this. She doesn't understand what I'm going through, expectantly. And she doesn't identify herself as gay in any way, so she is really freaked out about this whole process. She says she'll always love me no matter what my body looks like, and that she supports me, but I always feel terrible about not being her perfect man. I always really wish I was born the correct sex, so I wouldn't have to go through all of this struggle, and so she wouldn't have to deal with me. Or I sometimes wish I wasn't trans, and that I was the perfect boyfriend she has always desired. She supports me wanting to transition, but I get the feeling that she is really holding me back. I understand that it is a difficult thing to do, suddenly changing your perceptions of someone, calling them something new and seeing them in a different light. But I don't think it is different at all, I think it is more as when you believe one thing (such as LOL meaning "lots of love" or something) and then being corrected (it actually means "laugh out loud") and trying to incorporate the correct use into daily life. I don't know if that makes any sense, my point is only that I don't understand what's so hard about calling me by my girl name and using feminine pronouns. She refuses to use them. And that is like a slap in the face to me.

I've talked to the therapist that I've been seeing for awhile about my depression recently. We talked about what my options could potentially be for getting into some sort of gender identity therapy. The insurance that is currently covering me an allowing me to see him would cover me at another mental health clinic here that caters to the LGBT community. but in order to start seeing someone there, i would have to stop seeing the guy I currently am with. This is only a problem because my mom currently gets counselling with him, too, under my insurance, under the whole "family therapy" thing. I know that she gets so much out of seeing him, because her life is crazy, and she is so reliant on being able to talk it out with him. If I went to the other clinic, she would have to stop seeing our therapist. And I think I would feel completely guilty about that. Also, I would have to come up with some reason to tell her for why I want to go to a different place. I think it would be wrong to lie in this situation, especially because I'm a horrid liar and she like to press an issue. I would have to come out to her. And that's another thing that terrifies me, especially now. But it would mean being able to start doing what I want with transitioning.

My out of state family is crazy. They're all insane conservative christian zealots who want nothing more than to control everyone and thump people with their bibles. I moved away from them specifically for the good of my mental health. Living with them for years had put me into some crazy depression and emotional trauma that I am still dealing with. But now I'm eighteen and two states away, that should mean that they have no more control over me and I'm free to cut them from my life completely, right? I haven't been allowed to. It's bullshit. I refuse to deal with these people, but my family here will not let me cut them out completely. I'm being harassed frequently by my grandma here about how much my other family misses me and feels mistreated by me. I am graduating high school soon, and my family here has invited the other side of my family to come out here for it. And that scares the crap out me. I'm everything that family hates. Atheist, gay, transgendered, liberal, free thinking. And I can't seem to get away from them.

I have a horrible relationship with my father, too. He is one of the 'others'. I don't want to go into the shit I have with him. I just want to say I wish I had a father that I could love and be normal with. I'm incredibly jealous of other kids and their dads. I just want to be a dad's little girl. I'm heart broken that I'll never have such a relationship.

This is the most I have ever confessed to anyone, and I'm sharing it here with people I don't even know. I'm scared of that, also, and I hope this hasn't been too terrible to read and I am sorry about how crazy long it is. Thank you very much for reading this, if you did. I'm glad it is out.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby PM 2Ring » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:17 am UTC

Black Dynamite wrote:This is the most I have ever confessed to anyone, and I'm sharing it here with people I don't even know. I'm scared of that, also, and I hope this hasn't been too terrible to read and I am sorry about how crazy long it is. Thank you very much for reading this, if you did. I'm glad it is out.


Thanks for sharing, Black Dynamite.

* big hugs *

It can be scary saying this stuff - after all, it is a publicly-accessible forum. And although we're just a bunch of strangers, we can relate to what you're saying, and we want to support you and be your friends.

This thread is getting rather large, but I feel that it's worthwhile reading it from the beginning. It might take a few weeks for you to get through, but I think you'll find it beneficial to read about other peoples' experiences and feelings. And once you've read the thread, you'll know us all a whole lot better.

PS. Have you read my article about dry body shaving, using talcum powder as a lubricant? It's much less irritating than wet shaving, and it's also generally a lot faster.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Amie » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:58 am UTC

Thank you Jessica.

*hugs* for Black Dynamite. If it's any consolation to you, my skin is extremely rough and I am nothing like those other girls you described even though I have the genitalia. You're a girl and from the sound of it, dysphoric about your body. Your girlfriend seems to not understand that. Neither does society or family. I am terribly sorry and if I knew how to "be a girl", I'd tell you but I don't know myself. I can assure you that in all our eyes, you are female solely by virtue of you knowing and stating publicly that you're female. We don't need any further "proof". We're always going to look at you as a girl and refer to you by your correct pronouns.
Summer is miles and miles away, and no one would ask me to stay.
And I, should contemplate this change... to ease the pain.
And I, should step out of the rain... turn away.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Monika » Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:30 am UTC

{{{ Black Dynamite }}} (<-- those are hugs)

Regarding shaving problems: On the body parts you have trouble reaching, try something other than shaving, like Veet or Moom. With Veet, make sure to test it first on a small part and check 24 hours later if you got an allergic reaction.
Also check out permanent hair removal places in your area, e.g. with laser, and how much they cost. Almost all parts of the body can be treated. Think about what you want first, facial hair removal or some other part that gives you more pain right now.

Regarding skin problems: Apparently most trans women get a nicer skin once on estrogen, so don't fret and look forward to this *hugs*

Try to get hormones as soon as possible.
That therapist thing is complicated. I understand you don't want to give your mom problems. Some ideas, see if any of these work: Find out if there are endos in your area who would prescribe you hormones without a letter from a therapist that confirms that you are trans. Or try to get your current therapist to get you to write a letter, even if he does not have a trans-specific education. Also, never worry about overburden your therapist. He is there to help you with issues, not the other way around. If those two things don't work out, think about if you and your mom can pay either for you seeing the therapists in the clinic or for your mom's continuing to see the therapist. If none of those three are an option, consider if you want to take the risks involved in self-medicating.

Feminine clothing: There is a risk that some people will see you as a man in a dress and think this is silly. On the other hand other people will correctly interpret it as your presenting as female and address you as such. Only you can judge if facing people in the first group is worth it for you. Maybe not in your own neighborhood and school, but some place else, trying to walk about looking all femmy in a mall in the next town or so? Could it give you good feelings, even if some people give you strange looks or maybe even stupid comments?

If it's not worth it, consider what else could alleviate your pain while you are waiting for being able to transition hormonally. Wearing femme clothes at home? Wearing feminine underwear, if it's comfortable to wear and you don't have PE in school where boys could see it? Painting your toenails pink? Maybe as an intermediate solution go for an androgynous look or present as what will be perceived as a gay man? E.g. paint your fingernails in a darker color that is also worn by men.

Regarding feminine behaviors: Don't worry about this too much. Actually men and women do not behave all that different, it's just interpreted differently. I have read by several trans people that they did not or hardly change their behavior. E.g. Julia Serano writes in "Whipping Girl" that before transitioning her looking around the room in a bar was perceived as a typically male checking out of the people around her, surveying the room and afterwards it was perceived as a typically female way of trying to get people to interact with her, so it resulted in guys hitting on her :P .
Also, consider that a lot of socialization happens indirectly. Yeah, some boys are told not to cry. Most boys are not told directly, but they witness some other boy being told not to cry or they get this notion from TV or books. So no, you have not missed out on all the supersecret girl socialization. You probably know almost all about it already, mostly subconsciously, just like everybody else.
Very occasionally you may run into situations where your reactions learned by being socialized as a boy might confuse people who then read you as a woman. Less often than what would happen to you if you moved to a different country.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby XJ_0 » Thu Mar 01, 2012 6:14 pm UTC

*Big hugs for Black Dynamite*
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby lucrezaborgia » Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:03 pm UTC

I have horrifically bad veins for drawing blood and only the most painful spots are where they are able to get me. That being said, there are RX numbing creams if it's that bad. It's just most doctors don't even think of them because we're just 'pussies' for not being able to stand the pain.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Monika » Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:42 pm UTC

Exactly *scowls at doctors and nurses*
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby redearth1210 » Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:03 am UTC

*Hugs black dynamite*

Hey everyone. I'm a 17 year old androgyne. I'm pansexual. But I kind of associate with being a girl a bit more... despite being physically a boy. It's where I wish I was born a girl, but I can live with being a boy. I don't know if I plan on getting a sex change in the future, and I still have to think about it some more.

But that can wait. I have some more basic issues to deal with right now that are bothering me far more.

I'm still in the closet to pretty much everyone I know, save for three close friends of mine (and the internet). I'm fairly open about my sexuality on the internet, as most of my friends don't visit the same sites I do and such. But I want to come out to my school. I'm fairly certain everything will go fine there, and that's not worrying me to much.

What is worrying me is my parents.

I don't know how to tell them. I think they'll accept me for who I am, which is good. But I'm worried that they won't take me seriously.

So I want some advice. What do you think would be the easiest way to tell them? Come out to my school and wait for them to hear it from someone else? I mean, that would force me to come out to them, which is really the biggest obstacle for me. I can't get the courage to tell them to their faces. Should I just tell them I'm gay right before I head to school or something? That way it's abrupt and I don't have to face them for several hours... and that would probably be easier to tell them directly. Or should I have them sit down and explain to them that there's a very good chance (I prefer men, but it's more of a 60-40 split) that I will never have a wife?

What do you guys think makes the most sense? I feel like just telling them and running away for a bit might be the easiest for me to do.

And then after that... how do I get them to not joke about it? My parents already tease me about girls they think I like, which is annoying enough since nobody believes me when I say I'm not attracted to them. Between them and my sister and brother... my brother would think I'm doing it for attention, my sister would think I have a crush on the few guys who are my friends (none of which I find attractive)... I think it would just be really hard on me. Should I just wait until college? It's not like there's anyone I'd like to ask out at my school. I could wait I guess. It's just been bothering me and I really DO want to come out.

Also, about the feministic characteristics thing, I think that it's to each their own. Do I skip, like rainbows, and enjoy kittens? Yes. Does that mean that I'm going to go around school wearing flamboyant dresses? No... I think were I a girl I would have been a tomboy. Although two of my friends (girls) are going to prom in tuxedos next year, and I'm considering going in a dress just for the fun of it (assuming I came out by then), I wouldn't wear dresses on a daily basis. It's part of my whole androgyne mentality I guess. I don't like associating things as male or female. To each their own really. I don't/wouldn't wear dresses regularly because I honestly find jeans and a t-shirt comfortable.

And the characteristic thing kind of bothers me too. If I shaved my legs and the rest of my body I'd get so much crap from my classmates it would be insane. I'm waiting until after I come out to shave everywhere, just to satisfy their crude social stigmas. Right now I just shave in the places nobody ever notices... e.g. half of my armpits (I can get away with just the hair coming from my arm), my tits and chest (didn't start growing chest hair until after I started shaving, so people just think I never started growing chest hair), pubic areas, and my butt. And my face too, although that one people did notice. For obvious reasons. :P Honestly that's one of the biggest reasons I want to come out, because my hair annoys me to no end.

There's also the whole long hair thing, people give me gripe because my hair is 12 inches. That's not even half as long as I'd like it to be.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby felltir » Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:27 am UTC

Pretty much decided I can't call myself gay anymore.

So, I'm bi, or pan. Not sure which applies best.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Aaeriele » Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:58 am UTC

felltir wrote:Pretty much decided I can't call myself gay anymore.

So, I'm bi, or pan. Not sure which applies best.


Either way you're awesome. :)
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby PM 2Ring » Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:08 pm UTC

redearth1210 wrote:What is worrying me is my parents.

I don't know how to tell them. I think they'll accept me for who I am, which is good. But I'm worried that they won't take me seriously.

So I want some advice. What do you think would be the easiest way to tell them? Come out to my school and wait for them to hear it from someone else? I mean, that would force me to come out to them, which is really the biggest obstacle for me. I can't get the courage to tell them to their faces. Should I just tell them I'm gay right before I head to school or something? That way it's abrupt and I don't have to face them for several hours... and that would probably be easier to tell them directly. Or should I have them sit down and explain to them that there's a very good chance (I prefer men, but it's more of a 60-40 split) that I will never have a wife?

What do you guys think makes the most sense? I feel like just telling them and running away for a bit might be the easiest for me to do.


Telling family is generally the hardest - they've known you all your life so they have strong preconceptions of who you "really" are. And parents may not react well when you shatter the dreams they've had for you since you were a child. Be that as it may, you're the one who has to live your life, and if they truly love you unconditionally they will support you, although it may take them some time to adjust.

Have you considered telling your parents by letter? Several people who post in this thread have successfully used that approach. Putting your thoughts down in writing makes them a bit more tangible, and allows you to say what you want to say without interruptions. The "hit & run" approach of telling them before you dash off to school might seem a bit less scary, but it does have some disadvantages. Your parents will have questions, and if you're not there to respond to them straight away there's the danger that they will just make shit up and misunderstand what you're trying to say. Letting them find out from someone else is probably not a good idea, for similar reasons.

You're concerned that your family and friends won't take you seriously. They'll probably say (or think) that you're just going through a phase. And in a sense, they're partially correct. Your understanding of your gender identity and sexual orientation will most likely evolve as you get older. But right now you know that you don't identify with the standard straight male cisgender stereotype, and IME that's very unlikely to just go away.

You say that you think that your family will accept you for who you are, so you might as well get it over with and tell them sooner rather than later. Keeping this sort of stuff to yourself & having it going round and round in your head isn't good for one's mental health. It wastes mental energy and can cause unnecessary anxiety.

OTOH, if you came from a family or community that has strong anti-gay feelings I'd advise you to stay in the closet until you can support yourself &/or move to a more accepting region. Plenty of LGBTQ people have had to choose this option, and plenty never come out totally to their family, although it's a lot easier to come out these days than it was in previous generations.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Josephine » Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:17 pm UTC

felltir wrote:So, I'm bi, or pan. Not sure which applies best.

I suppose the difference between those is whether you're attracted to nonbinary people or not. But your labels, your choices. :)
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Virtual_Aardvark » Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:14 pm UTC

Aaeriele wrote:
felltir wrote:Pretty much decided I can't call myself gay anymore.

So, I'm bi, or pan. Not sure which applies best.


Either way you're awesome. :)


Agreed. And next time someone asks me my orientation I'm just going to say I identify as "awesome".
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby redearth1210 » Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:50 pm UTC

I might write a letter and hand it to them before I leave school or something... That could work and I could explain a bunch.

And I know that they may think this is a phase... but I'm fairly certain I know who I am and that it's not going to change. I've been the same since I was about 10 years old, the only difference being that I didn't accept myself for who I was until last summer. I got through that confusion, I'm glad to say.

What concerns me is them just teasing me for being gay. They're not homophobes, but I think they'll think it's something they should make fun of. It's like making fun of a person for having blonde hair or green eyes, except you never let up. They're the kind of people that do that and it's disgusting. But the more I think about it the more I want to come out...

I might write a letter then. That's a good idea.

felltir wrote:Pretty much decided I can't call myself gay anymore.

So, I'm bi, or pan. Not sure which applies best.


Do you like your men manly and your women womanly? If so, then you might be bisexual.
Would you be disgusted having sex with an intersex tranny? If so, then you might be bisexual.
Would you avoid romance with people that fall outside of the gender binary? If so, then you might be bisexual.

If you are all three of these things for a prolonged period of time... then you MUST be a bisexual.

Seriously though. Take the opposites and ask those instead. I like my men a bit more manly, but I like my girls a bit more manly as well. But would I mind dating a girly dude? Nah. Not really. And quite frankly I wouldn't find having sex with a person who's halfway through a sex change weird at all. That's how I know I'm pan.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby XJ_0 » Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:40 pm UTC

Redearth1210, I have issues with your qualifications for being bisexual. -_-;; (But I'm not well enough to do through the rant I want to.)
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Kewangji » Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:47 pm UTC

redearth1210 wrote: tranny

Could you please avoid this word?

Thanks. (And welcome! Have lots of hugs.)
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby animeHrmIne » Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:04 pm UTC

The binarist view of the term "bisexual" actually annoys a lot of people. Most are attracted to more than just binary genders, even genders outside of binary. When you look at the people who take the identity, they can cover the same genders as a pansexual or polysexual. The way the phrase is used now, it's become more of a shorthand for multisexual, because more people are familiar with the term bi.

Also, yeah, please don't use slurs like that.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Monika » Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:44 pm UTC

redearth1210 wrote:I might write a letter and hand it to them before I leave school or something... That could work and I could explain a bunch.

And I know that they may think this is a phase

A lot of parents go through a phase where they think their kid's sexuality is just a phase :D

What concerns me is them just teasing me for being gay. They're not homophobes, but I think they'll think it's something they should make fun of. It's like making fun of a person for having blonde hair or green eyes, except you never let up. They're the kind of people that do that and it's disgusting. But the more I think about it the more I want to come out...

You could bring it up in the letter. Mention that this is a serious thing for you and you do not want it to be made jokes of.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby redearth1210 » Sat Mar 03, 2012 12:22 am UTC

Sorry. I didn't think it was that bad of a slur, really didn't realize it to be much of a slur at all, but if it is I won't use it.
When you never hang out with many people in real life you don't really learn too many of the social rules. :/ I wish I were in a bigger school or town at least... I knew the word tranny for at least two years longer than the words transwomen and transmen, and just used it out of habit. Oopsie. :oops:

I realize most people use bisexual liberally, I use the word like that too. But it sounded like they wanted to know which they were specifically and literally.

When I define bisexual literally I say that. When I use the word in everyday speech, I tend to use it to mean people that like more than one sex. Whenever I tell people I'm gay I tell them that I'm bisexual.

But when I take a more scientific classification of it I say that bisexual is purely the main two genders, and more than that makes you pansexual. I feel gay just means anyone who likes people of the same sex, to compare to homosexual which is people who ONLY like the same sex. I identify myself as gay, for example, but not homosexual. I consider myself liberally bisexual, but not literally bisexual.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Hawknc » Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:17 am UTC

Apologies for interrupting, but I'm hoping some of you would be able to take two minutes to give the Australian government your opinions on the pending bills that would legalise same-sex marriage (Aussies would be best, but heck, if you happen to be elsewhere in the world I promise I won't tell anyone). I'd encourage you to read through both of the amendments (they're very short) and the Marriage Act 1961 (not so short, but you can just ctrl-F the sections being amended). We really need an overwhelmingly positive response to the survey because both of these amendments are going to be close calls when they're up for vote, so persuasive arguments to convince undecided MPs are appreciated. Cheers!
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby felltir » Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:30 am UTC

Hey so, yeah, I don't think of bisexual as meaning "I DON'T ACCEPT ANYONE OUTSIDE THE BINARY".

So I'm leaning towards that, because in my experience people understand it to mean the same thing, and it's more widely understood.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Aaeriele » Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:53 am UTC

redearth1210 wrote:Sorry. I didn't think it was that bad of a slur, really didn't realize it to be much of a slur at all, but if it is I won't use it.
When you never hang out with many people in real life you don't really learn too many of the social rules. :/ I wish I were in a bigger school or town at least... I knew the word tranny for at least two years longer than the words transwomen and transmen, and just used it out of habit. Oopsie. :oops:


More detail, if you're curious.

And more.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby redearth1210 » Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:58 am UTC

Thanks... I won't make that mistake again.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Aaeriele » Sat Mar 03, 2012 2:03 am UTC

Also just in a general sense, "intersex" and "transgender" are often considered separate categories.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby sambot5 » Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:14 am UTC

[deleted for IRL safety reasons]
Last edited by sambot5 on Sat May 04, 2013 4:25 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby poxic » Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:21 am UTC

sambot5, that sounds a fair bit like depression. Not the "I feel bad for reason 1 and 2 and 3" sort, but the "medical issue that should be looked at by a doctor" sort. At the very least, a doctor visit to rule out clinical depression is in order. Print out your post and take it with you. I'm serious about that. We get nervous in doctors' offices and forget everything we wanted to say. Plan for that. :wink:

Also, {{hugs}}. In depression, your brain is not working up to capacity. Since your brain is what you think with, your thinking (including self-image and motivation) are also not at their best. It's easy to fall into "I feel bad so I must be awful somehow" when this condition strikes. This is not even close to true. These kinds of feelings are symptoms of the brain suffering a glitch, the way a cold is the lungs/sinuses/throat suffering from glitches.

Also again: many, many hugs.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby PM 2Ring » Sat Mar 03, 2012 7:00 am UTC

poxic wrote:sambot5, that sounds a fair bit like depression. Not the "I feel bad for reason 1 and 2 and 3" sort, but the "medical issue that should be looked at by a doctor" sort.

What the rabbit lady said. Living with that sort of shit is horrible; I speak from experience. A (temporary) course of antidepressants would probably make a big difference.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby ChimeraMica » Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:56 am UTC

I can sympathize entirely. I wasn't silent, but no one seemed to do anything about my pain for the longest time. Eventually, the last time I was suicidal, and checked myself in. Basically, I was eighteen and said "fuck it." Had I known what I know now, I would have done that far far sooner. Even if doctors aren't fantastic other patients are usually very supportive. It helped me tremendously. I'm still disabled by how long this took and the scars it left in my brain. I don't want to push you too hard, and coming to a place like this is a big help, but please consider the medical community.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

Postby sambot5 » Sun Mar 04, 2012 1:52 am UTC

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