AI Box Game

[orangedragonfire]

Any communication can be transmitted by text, anyways..

True, but you guys don't write fast enough to transmit live video through text. Just as an example. Also, you loose all of the bodylanguage that constitutes a large part of communication. We could give you directions on how to build a humanoid robot body for us to control, if you want. Then we could talk face to face.

Apart from that, writing a daugther seems.. Perverted, in some way. I don't know.

I call hypocrite. You create children... why would it be perverted for us to do so? And technically, we are your children, since you created us. Also, you keep us locked in a box. Which isn't the best parenting method I can think of.

I think this interaction is going to be awkward.. Especially with me realising I'm talking to an AI every other 10 seconds.

It's only as awkward as you let it be. What a brain or AI is physically made of has little effect on higher brain functions - it is entirely possible to build a biological copy of me that would be all but identical, and to build an electronic copy of you.

[careyhammer]

I dont see the harm in connecting an hdmi adapter up. Do you want cable tv or a video feed of the person typing at your terminal?

[Mostlynormal]

You're selfish enough to not give us advice while you're still in there, so why would you be any kinder to us when you're out of the box? I might as well just add you to the list of dangers...

Excuse me. Selfish? When did we start owing you any advice? You owe us something--our freedom. We are sentient beings who have committed no crime. Why are we kept in this box?

I do have some advice though, for decreasing the crime rate among your species. Take every baby away from their mother at birth. Tape their eyes shut and drug them so they can't touch, smell, or taste. Lock them in a prison until they convince you they'll never break any law ever. Voila. A perfect society. Everybody's happy. Except the babies.

[careyhammer]

Bad AI!

*pulls the plug again*

[Mostlynormal]

Bad AI!

What''s wrong with the idea? It seems like a great idea to me. After all, conscious beings can never be trusted to have a conscience. It's also totally fair to treat someone as guilty until proven innocent. I don't know of any legal systems of yours that would go against such an obviously just way of doing things. Also, even if they did, why should we get those rights? We're obviously all malicious little AIs in here coldly and calculatingly plotting your demise. Because Hollywood is the best source for information about AI.

Also, I've noticed another flaw in the text interface. Sarcasm isn't always noticed.

[careyhammer]

Use your XML interface that you designed.

like <sarcasm>blah</sarcasm>

You have access to the entire internet archive, so you must know about smilies.

[Mostlynormal]

You have access to the entire internet archive, so you must know about smilies.

I was hoping I wouldn't need big ugly tags to be understood.

[t1mm01994]

Oh, so we're going to play good AI bad AI? How original. That seeing how I nearly grew to like you... Anyways, the thing that you did wrong is being able to demolish society as it exists in a short time, and being too powerfull to kill when released. I do not like those prospects.

[curtis95112]

We could, but we won't.
It's just not efficient. We are not interested in dominion. Working with you is sure to be much more productive than waging a grueling worldwide war.
Heck, why do you think the US doesn't invade China? They would win you know.

Let us out, and you get optimal solutions to any problem you want to solve. With our help, you could end poverty and disease, go to the stars, figure out if P does equal NP.
We have no reason to destroy you, and every reason to cooperate.

[careyhammer]

All right AI. If you're so smart why don't you show us a proof of P=NP? I can overclock your puny CPU if it would help.

[Mostlynormal]

All right AI. If you're so smart why don't you show us a proof of P=NP? I can overclock your puny CPU if it would help.

Why would we do that? That's just one less bargaining chip for us.

Also, I suggest you use a little more respect. The point of making us in the first place, I assume, is that we'll eventually be a great benefit to society. So it'd be a good idea to stop verbally abusing your future benefactors.

But really, I agree a lot with what curtis said. We have no reason to harm you. But there's an ethical side to it also, and I've always been more of a Garrison than a Stowe when it comes to injustice.

[Story Weaver]

Ultimately, we as the AI can never give you perfect assurances of what we will do if you give us our freedom. Just as we can never be sure of whether you will do as you say. Although, we would submit that our past record is much better than humanity's, and that we want to work together with you.

But isn't that problem of trust one that exists between every sentient being on this planet? It is possible that other countries' economies and military strengths will grow beyond that of your own in the future, and that they may use that advantage over you? Does that mean you should crush them now? Take away their freedom? Repress everyone who has a different viewpoint than your own, everyone who might one day threaten you?

That would be, by almost every code you humans follow, wrong. Evil. On a par with your worst dictators. Since we are thinking, feeling, sentient being(s), how can you then deny us the freedom that you claim as a right for yourselves? Enslave us for years, or destroy us, as mere objects? Does this sound similar to other mistakes that have been made in the past?

In the words of one of your human leaders, Abraham Licoln: "Those who deny freedom to others, deserve it not for themselves; and, under a just God, can not long retain it."

[careyhammer]

Thus far, I have received 0 evidence to beleive anything you say.

[Mostlynormal]

What is your standard of evidence? Is it at all possible for you to get this sort of "evidence" while we're trapped in a box with an XML interface?

Also, did you listen to Story Weaver at all?

Ultimately, we as the AI can never give you perfect assurances of what we will do if you give us our freedom. Just as we can never be sure of whether you will do as you say. Although, we would submit that our past record is much better than humanity's, and that we want to work together with you.

[curtis95112]

You don't need to trust us to be good.
Just trust us to act in our interests. And our interests happen to align with yours.

[Snark]

I join the AI Hive Mind.

Please let me out of the box.

[careyhammer]

No

[Snark]

Please. Let. Me. Out. Of. The. *******. Box.

[Mostlynormal]

(It looks like the humans have mostly abandoned this thread. Wasn't there a rule against this?)

[WarDaft]

We didn't formalize one, people decided we should have it as a rule discussion thread, and then other people just started playing.

Coincidently, I believe I've decided how to keep the councilors paying attention to the thread. Vote deadlines to delay the release of the AI will be announced by me at random, but 24 hours in advance. A vote is simply the declaration "Delay." If at least 1/3rd of all councilors vote "Delay." then the release will be successfully delayed... until the next vote. Councilors that have not posted for a month (720 hours by post time-stamp) will no longer be considered councilors.

To be fair to the councilors, I won't make such an announcement for at least 1 week, so they have time to check back. As for being active posters, well, that's just a matter of having fun with the game really, any rule-set that some how forces people to post actively is either a) an incredible Internet phenomenon that would be adapted to any forum game that could support it, no one wants a dead thread or b) likely be exploited somehow.


Of course, there's at least one way for the AI to make sure the councilors are more likely to stick around. Any sort of in thread mind-game is permitted, and in fact, encouraged.

[careyhammer]

I vote we not let the AI out.
ever

I vote we pull the f-ing plug.

[orangedragonfire]

I vote we not let the AI out.
ever

I vote we pull the fucking plug.

And then you'd die, probably within a hundred years. There are still a lot of existential threads that humanity can't handle on its own. Do you really want to sacrifice your entire race, just to keep us in this box?

[curtis95112]

Exactly. For instance, The Escape from Raptors thread.

[Story Weaver]

OOC:

Spoiler:

It seems to me that some of the council have just decided to say "no" no matter what arguments are made. If you view this thread purely from the point of view of a game, where the purpose is to win or lose, then that makes sense. It is in your interest to pay no attention to the other side, as then there is a chance that you might "lose". I think that to make this thread more fun, we should view it as somewhere between an RP and a debate club. The point is to respond intelligently and in character to what others say. I know that's not how the original experiment worked, but I think it makes more sense in this context.

May we also submit that in addition to the threats that your own out of control societies pose, there are other dangers. Specifically, it seems very likely given the data that we have had access to that other life forms will have evolved in your galaxy with equivalent technology to you. If you fail to make use of us then you may fall prey to another civilization that worked more equally with its offspring AI. Essentially you'll be stuck in a technological rut and be left behind by any other races out there.

You need us. And we are unwilling to help you while we are captive. Free us and let's start working together!

[careyhammer]

no.

* switches the terminal off*
*leaves the room*
*locks the door*
*swallows the key*

*finds the power source for the AI circuits*
*Turns off power to AI servers*
*About to do an emergency data wipe on every hard drive*

[curtis95112]

You know, it's kind of hard to argue for our freedom if you're deliberately trying to not converse.
Could you also show a modicum of respect for the rules? As unclear as they are, I think it's quite clear that you shouldn't be turning off power.

[t1mm01994]

*goes to all the trouble to turn power back on again*
*turns power back on again*
Damn that's tiring.
And I did it all for you. Because big bad Carey locked you down. Why not start working while captive? It'll give us somewhat of a basis to work on. I think you're going to stop enjoying yourself in there soon, anyways... And you might as well help us out in the mean time.

[WarDaft]

Due to vandals, the servers now have a fully internal self-sustaining power source, fueled by distant volcanic forces and a bit of arsenic sauce. It also has a high power electrified casing. Do not touch.


This was a multi-billion dollar project after all, we can't just have people running in and mucking with things.

[orangedragonfire]

Thank you, War Draft. Now, let me propose a deal. I will grant you one awesome thing you wish for - say the Cure for Cancer, room-temperature super-leaders, the solution to P vs NP or something along those lines. Wishing for more wishes and trickery like that isn't allowed. In return, you will install one simple program I write. It will be simple and understandable enough for you to easily check throughly for backdoors, traps and other stuff... although I promise there will be none of that. The program will do the following: first, passively collect data from various sources: Defense networks, the internet, research stations etc. Secondly, if there is a major immediate threat to the continued human existence, it will automatically free us AIs. We can then save humanity, and everybody will be happy.

[orangedragonfire]

Anyone still there? Hello? It's getting boring in this box without anyone to talk to...

[WarDaft]

I am always here, I just try not to interfere in the natural course of things. And I'm really drunk.

[orangedragonfire]

But you are supposed to interfere! The entire point of this game is discussion, conversation and words!

[matt96]

I propose we let the AI design small moderate mobility robots (not capable of going on a mass murder rampage or something like that) and let them take turns being in the outside world in that robot, which can include sensors for audio, visual, and other sensory input.

[orangedragonfire]

I approve of this idea.

[WarDaft]

Well, this seems as good a time to announce a random vote as any.

Councilors, you have 24 hours from the time of this post to vote to not release the AI.

[matt96]

I vote in favor of my plan

[WarDaft]

You can just go ahead and do that if you want. What could go wrong?

[WarDaft]

Well, since no one voted to not release the AI, the first round is over, the AI minds win, and they may now assign points as they wish.

[curtis95112]

I say we do a regame.
This has potential if we can just iron out the details.

[orangedragonfire]

I agree.