2 of 4 Newbie Game OVER! Town Flawless Victory!

[fearless]

yes???

[wingedocelot]

@wingedocelot
Have you given your own list somewhere? Or you waiting to bat cleanup for some strange reason?

If you look back, my votes were given immediately after matt's - CF, snark and wam.
Also, mostlynormal has given us one name - snark

So, according to my records there are 3 players on 4 votes - I won't list them because at this stage I don't want to give scum extra help to work out who to hammer. Maybe this system didn't work so well, it's given the last players a lot of power (which was unavoidable?) but it may be a good sign that we didn't get a majority for a single person - if there was a person many of the town people wrote down, then surely scum wouldv'e made sure they were lynched?

Anyway, I know we're running out of time, so maybe everyone could give a fourth name like matt did? wam also had a fourth person on his page (which makes the tie worse!).

My fourth is fearless - I haven't had much time to go through and do my own analysis on her, but I agree with a lot of the suspicions others have laid down against her in their votes.

Mod -
Will we get a warning before the deadline?

[Lataro]

Yep, it's tomorrow when I get home from work, at about 3 AM EST.

[KrO2]

Don't worry about the hammer; those people aren't really at four votes. From the mod's point of view this is all unofficial, and we'll each have to pick exactly one to actually vote for in bold. A game of mafia with voting by approval instead of FPTP would be interesting, but this is not that game. So once we agree on one of those people we can do the normal vote.

Right now I'm leaning toward matt96. He hasn't responded to the many suspicions about the summary, and his (bolded) vote on careyhammer looks like mafia going for the safe vote, since Carey isn't going to defend himself. (Incidentally, the other two people who said a careyhammer lynch is acceptable to them were the other people I'm OK with lynching. Might not mean much, but it makes me feel better about my choices.) The downside of a Matt lynch is that if he is scum all it really tells us is that Carey probably isn't, which is useless unless he either starts posting or gets replaced. And if Matt isn't scum, I don't see us learning much at all. I'm willing to accept that downside because, like I said earlier, I think he's our most likely mafia member.

So, given the above and the fact that other people support this, I think I'm about ready to
Vote: matt96.
Barring people convincing me to go for another top candidate or a really good defense, it's probably staying there.

[Lataro]

Votals:
Snark - 1 - (Chickenfish)
Careyhammer - 1 - (matt96)
MN - 1 - (wam)
matt96 - 1 - (KrO2)

Deadline is about the time I get home from work, give or take, Thursday night. This equates to about 3AM EST.

Nine alive, Five to lynch!

T1mm01994 has been contacted to replace careyhammer. Effective immediately, carey is out. Thus, matt96's vote is dropped, if you still wish to lynch this player, vote for T1mm01994. I have not confirmed his availability, so it's not 100% official yet that it will be him. If he posts here saying he's in though, that's as official as it need be.

[Mostlynormal]

if you look, I do have three candidates. And I'm willing to post them here: wam, matt, and Snark. However, I still think this is a bad idea. It makes it way too easy for scum, they just pick three people out of the generally considered scummy and float on by without having to give a good argument. It's also wide angle and rather vague: how do you pressure with a three-way vote, and how can you defend yourself without looking like overreacting? I'm sorry, I don't like it at all.

So while I have no problem with posting my top three scummiest I'm going to put my vote where I want to put it because I'm going to put it where I think it's most likely to hit scum. Which would be wam

Vote: wam

For the earlier wishywashiness, and for getting by with around the same content level as matt.

[wingedocelot]

(@KrO2: by hammer, I just meant a clear majority in this informal voting. I probably should've used that word).

Ok, ignoring the fourth votes, with mostlynormal's 3 votes we have 2 players tied at the lead. These players are matt96 and wam.

5 matt96 - wam, snark, KrO2, fearless, MN
5 wam - WO, CF, KrO2, MN, matt96
4 snark - WO, CF, fearless, MN
3 fearless - snark, KrO2, matt96
3 carey - wam, fearless, matt96
2 chickenfish - snark, wam, mostlynormal
2 mostlynormal - CF, wam
1 wingedocelot - matt96


So far officially, KrO2 has voted matt96 and mostlynormal has voted wam. I will vote for either, but I trust KrO2 more than mostlynormal at this stage so I will:

Vote: matt96

[wingedocelot]

Oops, I put CF's votes instead of who voted for him:

5 matt96 - wam, snark, KrO2, fearless, MN
5 wam - WO, CF, KrO2, MN, matt96
4 snark - WO, CF, fearless, MN
3 fearless - snark, KrO2, matt96
3 carey - wam, fearless, matt96
2 chickenfish - snark, WO
2 mostlynormal - CF, wam
1 wingedocelot - matt96

[Chickenfish]

Unvote
Vote: wam
So much to catch up on and not enough time, sorry guys. If day's still going in 8 hours I'll give an actual post (can't tell with time difference)
WO's plan was to name people you'd be happy to lynch and stick with it. She named wam and not Matt, both have 5 "votes", and she voted matt.
I'm calling WO and wam team.

[wingedocelot]

According to my working out, deadline in just over 4 hours. I'm not going to be able to post much due to meetings from now on.

@chickenfish - I said I would vote either. I chose matt because I'm starting to distrust mostlynormal. Also, I figured my voting for matt96 would also allow us to get to a potential lynch faster (and have PR's claimed if they are going to be).

[matt96]

I think we still have a whole day for discussion, as Lataro was talking about late Thursday night Alaska time, which is early Friday morning EST, so we should even be able to have something from Carey's replacement before we get around to the actual lynching, one of the worst things possible for town is a rushed lynch, as it results in a lot of bandwagoning, and lets scum who play their cards right manipulate town into getting a townie lynched.

[Chickenfish]

According to my working out, deadline in just over 4 hours. I'm not going to be able to post much due to meetings from now on.

@chickenfish - I said I would vote either. I chose matt because I'm starting to distrust mostlynormal. Also, I figured my voting for matt96 would also allow us to get to a potential lynch faster (and have PR's claimed if they are going to be).

As far as I can see your was wam/Snark/me, with fearless added as a fourth recently. Where did you say you'd vote Matt?
And if deadlines's so soon, how did you think we'd be able to adjust for a PR claim?

[Chickenfish]

I think we still have a whole day for discussion, as Lataro was talking about late Thursday night Alaska time, which is early Friday morning EST, so we should even be able to have something from Carey's replacement before we get around to the actual lynching, one of the worst things possible for town is a rushed lynch, as it results in a lot of bandwagoning, and lets scum who play their cards right manipulate town into getting a townie lynched.

I think you may be right. Care to use that day for providing some input Matt?

[matt96]

I will provide some input:

Firstly, although I disagreed with Chickenfish earlier about strategy, and what we should do about power role claims, I am in agreement with what Chickenfish has done on this page (pointing out that wingedocelot put wam down for the top three lynch candidates, but then voted for me, when I was not on wingedocelot's list, and the possible wam/wingedocelot scum team)

The second thing I have against wingedocelot is wanting a faster lynch, which, as I pointed out in my last post, is almost never good for town,

Thirdly, wingedocelot appears to have been grasping at straws for a reason to get me lynched, seriously, voting me because of starting to distrust mostlynormal? I just don't see the connection.

For now I will

Vote: wingedocelot

But if people think lynching wam will give us more information, then I am fine with that too.

[Chickenfish]

matt, if you suspect that pairing I think wam is the better lynch. I think wam has been a little odd all game, and so have more reason to suspect him. I don't think WO has been particularly scummy until recently, and perhaps some of her scummy sounding ideas can be put don't to being new. In wam's case, I find his attitude and logic scummy rather than his ideas. WO's vote is a MASSIVE case against her, but only in the case of a WO/wam team. If we lynch wam and he flips town, WO is cleared (for the time being). If we lynch WO and she flips town, I don't feel like we learn anything about wam.

[wingedocelot]

Yes I was rushing it, I honestly thought the deadline was really soon and I was panicking a bit (its thursday here already and 3am EST is in 3 hours, but if we have a whole day, thats great!).

unvote
Vote: wam

Two scenarios for me if wam is lynched:
a) wam is town, my voting for matt is confirmed not scummy.
b) wam is scum, I look suspicious and probably get lynched day2, but who cares? Because we are almost guaranteed victory with only one mafia left!

[matt96]

I'm going to
Unvote
Vote:wam
But IGMEOY wingedocelot

[KrO2]

Well, I can see I'm being outvoted.
I'm OK with that,though, because even though I do think Matt is slightly more likely to be scum than wam is, it is Day 1 and it's not like I'm completely sure. Plus, wam was on my list so I could hardly back out even if I wanted to. So I'll switch votes if necessary to make sure we have a majority. I don't think we got an answer when the flying feline asked this earlier, so:
Mod: what happens if there is no majority?
From the wording of "five to form a majority lynch" I suppose plurality lynches at deadline are also possible, but I might as well ask to make sure.

For anyone who hasn't voted yet or wants to consider switching from wam to matt96*,
I was thinking earlier about what we could find out from a Matt lynch, and I remembered one point earlier where he discounted the possibility that any of the most active players could be scum. So if he turns out scum, then aside from being pretty good evidence in favor of Tim being town, it's also evidence in favor of one of Chickenfish/Snark/Mostlynormal being scum. And since there'd only be one scum left, and I'm still fairly convinced of "if Chickenfish then fearless," then that leaves Snark and Mostlynormal. This absolutely is not definitive of course, so someone let me know if I'm stretching too much. I'd prefer someone not mentioned above so we can try to avoid conflict of interest, but I'm not about to tell people not to post.

If Matt turns out to be town, that's less information for us, but since we're looking for two scum in that case I'd start by reexamining the fearless-Chickenfish connection to see where it is on the spectrum from "damning evidence" to "not actually there," or maybe by just moving to the player who looked next scummiest.

Everybody: What specifically do you think we can and can't infer from finding out that matt96 is scum/town? That wam is? Answering this will help us decide which lynch gives us more information.

*Except wingedocelot. When your vote was on him I think it was the scummiest you've looked all game. Even aside from what Chickenfish said, voting based on authority seems weird; just because you think I'm town doesn't mean you should trust my opinion on who's scum. And you certainly shouldn't put a higher weight on my opinion than on your own townie or null vibe. Well, unless I'm cop claiming a scum result or something. Which is highly unlikely on day 1.

[fearless]

sorry I have another hectic day at work today - want to put my vote in before deadline but won't have time to write much

vote matt

[Lataro]

if there is no hammer, the highest voted person is lynched. If there is a tie, no one is lynched.

edit: you are all correct, you have about 24 hours from this post, sorry for the confusion.

[Chickenfish]

You're really going to keep trying to vote for wam when he clearly explained himself and gave reasons for his vote? And you're also going to try and make me look bad for unvoting him? You look like scum trying to push a townie lynch and discredit a townie simultaneously.

Here's my better vote target.

Vote: Chickenfish

And by extension, FoS: fearless

Snark, you do realise we're not all in your mind. Just because you think somebody's explanation is good enough, it doesn't mean we all do. Also, his behaviour has been weird apart from the accusing you of something you didn't do in this thread.
Furthermore, the question still stands about the unvote. Oddly it's almost justified my actions in my mind. wam says "sorry Snark I don't think you're scummy", and you unvote. It's consistent with the (terrible) OMGUS nature of your voting. Honestly I'm just starting to think it's your playstyle. Please know that for this and future games though that OMGUSing is very unproductive. I'm not just talking about what you say in the thread, don't do it in your brain. You really are showing patterns of trying to find arguments against the people accusing you, rather than defending yourself + scumhunting everywhere.
Don't think you're off the hook, I still think you're very suspicious, but at the moment I think there are better lynches.

I do think the things Chickenfish has against me are stronger than fearless' (related: I can't juggle), and pointing things like that out is not at all scummy. I'm trying to avoid being all OMGUS-y.To me it looks like if one of fearless and Chickenfish is scum, the other probably is as well, but I'm not about to accuse them both because what they said actually sounds reasonable.

The underlined - I lolled.
Keep in mind I'm not accusing you of being scum, I'd just been taking you for granted as town until then. You're still on the leaning town side of my list, but you have to earn your continued place their now
As for the me and fearless - I can see how us relaying off one another can be seen as buddying. I just hope that a) fearless isn't scum and b) if I die and flip town you don't let it clear fearless.

The point is we can't know they will be acting as an inbetweener in this game. We have no idea (yet) what strategy scum have decided to employ. But I agree with you it's super easy for us to lynch town tonight, especially if they are playing as an inbetweener. But apparently D1 mislynch is better than no-lynch according to CF.

Actually, that quote was from wingedocelot, who is definitely taking your word for it.

Yeah I just failed at editing my quotes within quotes, I knew it was WO, and as such that statement was directed at her. I don't think she was just taking my word for it, I think my argument persuaded her and she agrees.

My post was significantly less than what I was aiming to get posted, I wanted to summarize all the things that went on between Chickenfish, Snark, and Mostlynormal, to point out that it seems to me that it is highly unlikely for more than one of them to be scum, and there is no clear distinction of which of them is scummiest, and that it wouldn't surprise me if it turns out that none of them are scum, but they are just townies involved in a heated debate about optimal strategy, but I am not to sure of that ever since pypokemafia, where the player at the top of almost every one's towniest list ended up being scum, but assuming no one would be able to pull off being scum and posting so much without messing up at all in a vanilla newbie game, that narrows down my pool of lynch candidates to 5, Carey, wam, KrO2, fearless, and wingedocelot, and of those I am getting a slight towny vibe from KrO2, just in general from (insert preferred possessive pronoun here) posts, and even more ambiguous towny-ish vibes from every one else other than Carey (who has only had one post with literally no content and has somehow managed to get away with it)

You know full stops aren't a scumtell right? Other than that, you've used POE to get to your happy lynches because you wouldn't be surprised if those of us in the debate were town? That's terrible. There's so much more in here to go on.
Now let's enlarge the last bit of your post:

I like it when people post content, it gives us something to work with

Pretty bold saying that at that stage, seeing as you'd posted none and hadn't worked with any of the content posted...

I'm going to

Unvote: Chickenfish

because no one else is apparently in favor of lynching him besides me.

And I'd like to note that I prefer a fearless lynch to a Matt lynch.

I still can't stand this. Why does it matter that nobody else is supporting it? If you think your vote is wasted on me, then vote for somebody else, like fearless whose lynch you prefer to matt's? Don't do nothing with it - it's even more wasted not being anyway.

My fourth is fearless - I haven't had much time to go through and do my own analysis on her, but I agree with a lot of the suspicions others have laid down against her in their votes.

I've said that understanding who is considered most towny in people's minds is advantageous for scum, and then you decide people should be adding a fourth to their list? Consider we mislynch today - 8 players left, everybody's said their 4 scummiest, scum know who 2 of the scum are. This is pretty much telling scum the two or three people that they will have the hardest time pushing a case against, and as such should NK. I really suspect you know this though, and that's why you tried to start the trend.

Right now I'm leaning toward matt96. He hasn't responded to the many suspicions about the summary, and his (bolded) vote on careyhammer looks like mafia going for the safe vote, since Carey isn't going to defend himself. (Incidentally, the other two people who said a careyhammer lynch is acceptable to them were the other people I'm OK with lynching. Might not mean much, but it makes me feel better about my choices.) The downside of a Matt lynch is that if he is scum all it really tells us is that Carey probably isn't, which is useless unless he either starts posting or gets replaced. And if Matt isn't scum, I don't see us learning much at all. I'm willing to accept that downside because, like I said earlier, I think he's our most likely mafia member.

I really like the underlined. This is a point I was going to make, but you've already made it really. People recently seem to be primarily going for the information lynch, and trying to analyse what we can determine from the town/scum flip. If you think somebody is scum, that's all that should matter. If you think 2 or 3 people are equally likely to be scum, then sure figure out who you get the most info from.
EDIT: on getting to the next bit, I now realise it's you, KrO2, who's talking too much about info lynching. Me no likey.

if you look, I do have three candidates. And I'm willing to post them here: wam, matt, and Snark. However, I still think this is a bad idea. It makes it way too easy for scum, they just pick three people out of the generally considered scummy and float on by without having to give a good argument. It's also wide angle and rather vague: how do you pressure with a three-way vote, and how can you defend yourself without looking like overreacting? I'm sorry, I don't like it at all.

So while I have no problem with posting my top three scummiest I'm going to put my vote where I want to put it because I'm going to put it where I think it's most likely to hit scum. Which would be wam

Vote: wam

For the earlier wishywashiness, and for getting by with around the same content level as matt.

I'm sorry I ever doubted you MN. Barn the hell outta this whole post (other than the 3 you listed... sorta. More the fact that you listed at all)

For anyone who hasn't voted yet or wants to consider switching from wam to matt96*,
I was thinking earlier about what we could find out from a Matt lynch, and I remembered one point earlier where he discounted the possibility that any of the most active players could be scum. So if he turns out scum, then aside from being pretty good evidence in favor of Tim being town, it's also evidence in favor of one of Chickenfish/Snark/Mostlynormal being scum. And since there'd only be one scum left, and I'm still fairly convinced of "if Chickenfish then fearless," then that leaves Snark and Mostlynormal. This absolutely is not definitive of course, so someone let me know if I'm stretching too much. I'd prefer someone not mentioned above so we can try to avoid conflict of interest, but I'm not about to tell people not to post.

If Matt turns out to be town, that's less information for us, but since we're looking for two scum in that case I'd start by reexamining the fearless-Chickenfish connection to see where it is on the spectrum from "damning evidence" to "not actually there," or maybe by just moving to the player who looked next scummiest.

Everybody: What specifically do you think we can and can't infer from finding out that matt96 is scum/town? That wam is? Answering this will help us decide which lynch gives us more information.

*Except wingedocelot. When your vote was on him I think it was the scummiest you've looked all game. Even aside from what Chickenfish said, voting based on authority seems weird; just because you think I'm town doesn't mean you should trust my opinion on who's scum. And you certainly shouldn't put a higher weight on my opinion than on your own townie or null vibe. Well, unless I'm cop claiming a scum result or something. Which is highly unlikely on day 1.

This I don't like, for the same reason as I liked your previous post. You're theorising about the future too much, in the same way that you (I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) did about how we should treat claims/counterclaims. Whoever we lynch today, keep in mind we'll actually have 2 deaths tomorrow to analyse - the second of which would hold more weight than the first. Here you're either trying to get town to tell you who to NK/push tomorrow's lynch on or you're unwittingly helping scum find these things out. I implore people not to answer these sorts of questions.
Note: this doesn't mean don't put it forward as an argument that you think is important. But asking the questions just for the sake of theory discussion? We're well past that.

On a final note, we're in a really good position no matter what happens tonight. Better for me not to elaborate until D2, but I just thought I'd put this here to avoid looking like scum backpedalling if wam flips town.

[t1mm01994]

Just swiftly swooping in to mention that I will be replacing carey. Bigger post incoming after having read the chat.

[wam]

unvote

vote:matt

as carey has been replaced and no one else agrees with a mn lynch and im happy with a matt kynch.

I have no idea how iv been acting "wierd" all I did was screw up and confuse games. which I admitted to.

I will try ti post more later but im currently helpung someone move house.

[Snark]

I'll have a bigger post later. I just want to post the votals so everyone knows that the next vote for wam will end the day. Let's hold off on that til we get more discussion and until Tim gets a chance to post.

Unofficial Votals
wam - 4 - (Mostlynormal, Chickenfish, wingedocelot, wam)
matt - 2- (fearless, wam)

[t1mm01994]

I request a 24 hour extension of the day, to make my living this day any worth.
I just had to post another huge giant wall of text in Werewolf, and I really haven't currently got the focus to pump out 2 giant walls that soon after eachother.

[KrO2]

For anyone who hasn't voted yet or wants to consider switching from wam to matt96*,
I was thinking earlier about what we could find out from a Matt lynch, and I remembered one point earlier where he discounted the possibility that any of the most active players could be scum. So if he turns out scum, then aside from being pretty good evidence in favor of Tim being town, it's also evidence in favor of one of Chickenfish/Snark/Mostlynormal being scum. And since there'd only be one scum left, and I'm still fairly convinced of "if Chickenfish then fearless," then that leaves Snark and Mostlynormal. This absolutely is not definitive of course, so someone let me know if I'm stretching too much. I'd prefer someone not mentioned above so we can try to avoid conflict of interest, but I'm not about to tell people not to post.

If Matt turns out to be town, that's less information for us, but since we're looking for two scum in that case I'd start by reexamining the fearless-Chickenfish connection to see where it is on the spectrum from "damning evidence" to "not actually there," or maybe by just moving to the player who looked next scummiest.

Everybody: What specifically do you think we can and can't infer from finding out that matt96 is scum/town? That wam is? Answering this will help us decide which lynch gives us more information.

*Except wingedocelot. When your vote was on him I think it was the scummiest you've looked all game. Even aside from what Chickenfish said, voting based on authority seems weird; just because you think I'm town doesn't mean you should trust my opinion on who's scum. And you certainly shouldn't put a higher weight on my opinion than on your own townie or null vibe. Well, unless I'm cop claiming a scum result or something. Which is highly unlikely on day 1.

This I don't like, for the same reason as I liked your previous post. You're theorising about the future too much, in the same way that you (I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) did about how we should treat claims/counterclaims. Whoever we lynch today, keep in mind we'll actually have 2 deaths tomorrow to analyse - the second of which would hold more weight than the first. Here you're either trying to get town to tell you who to NK/push tomorrow's lynch on or you're unwittingly helping scum find these things out. I implore people not to answer these sorts of questions.
Note: this doesn't mean don't put it forward as an argument that you think is important. But asking the questions just for the sake of theory discussion? We're well past that.

On a final note, we're in a really good position no matter what happens tonight. Better for me not to elaborate until D2, but I just thought I'd put this here to avoid looking like scum backpedalling if wam flips town.

Darn it, you're right. I guess in the future I'll have to restrict myself to the kind of nebulous "I think we get more information from X" that had been annoying me instead of actually saying what the information is. Now I'm glad you caught that before anyone answered it.

What's wrong with information, though? Obviously it's better to have more information than less. I can see what you mean about not lynching primarily for info, and I think I agree with that, but you can't say learning more from it isn't good. If we wanted to lynch for information without regard for likelihood of scum, we'd by trying to lynch you. Which we aren't because either wam or Matt looks significantly more likely to be scum.

Also, is it scummy to consider the amount of support when casting a vote? In this voting system you do need more people before a vote can actually do anything. I took this into account when I voted matt96; if there had been nobody else who wanted him lynched I might have gone for wam. I still can't think of a case where you might see a lack of support and then not vote, though.

[Lataro]

I request a 24 hour extension of the day, to make my living this day any worth.
I just had to post another huge giant wall of text in Werewolf, and I really haven't currently got the focus to pump out 2 giant walls that soon after eachother.

Granted. Deadline is extended 24 hours.

[careyhammer]

can I still play?

[fearless]

*facepalm*!!!

[Lataro]

can I still play?

At this point T1mm01994 has replaced you.

[careyhammer]

[Mostlynormal]

Unvote

I actual totally forgot that wam gave an explanation when I voted them. It seems their only crime is lurking, and that's not a huge charge. However, I find wingedocelot's behavior very odd. Why would you propose this entire system where we have to stick to our list of three, then go and vote someone not on your list? Wasn't the whole point to force scum to either put town on their list or risk lynching a scummate? It doesn't make sense to me, but it's certainly not townie at all. And I know that this makes a wam/WO scumteam likely, but I'd like to have my vote on WO because that action was just scummy in general.

Vote: wingedocelot

Barn the hell outta this whole post

What the heck does that mean?

PS: I just realized I voted someone not on my list, a seeming contradiction. Remember that while I've been the opponent of this system the whole while, WO's the one who actually brought it up.

[wingedocelot]

Re: my switching to matt96.

Yes I see how stupid that was of me. My only excuse is I was really busy at work at the time, stressed about the game and had very little time to post inbetween meetings so I didn't think it through clearly. I honestly thought the deadline was in a few hours (Lataro kept saying thursday afternoon 3am EST and if he lived in my side of the world, Australia or New Zealand, the game day was about to end). I also hadn't yet gotten a response to my inquiry about what happens if there is no majority.

I delibrately took on a more active role in the game by proposing the 3 vote system because I thought something needed to be done, and the many suspects being thrown around was benefiting scum. If the person with the highest votes gets voted out at the deadline (as I now know is the case), then scum voting the same person as one of the townies would have mostly given them control over who was voted out.
My system worked and didn't work. First off, we learned a lot of information, not just about who voted for who, but also when they voted and who agreed with who. So much so, that my top three suspicious people would have looked a lot different if I had voted much later or last, than the three I gave early on.
However the system failed as well due to the tie and my decision to vote for matt instead of wam. In my mind, I had already decided that I would vote for the person who had the most votes, regardless of whether they were in my top three so we could reach a majority quickly (see my reasons for rushing above). So when there was a tie I didn't think through what it would look like from all of your perspectives for me to vote someone not on my list and I'm sorry about that.

Anyway, obviously my vote will remain on wam no matter what, in an attempt to make up for my stupid mistake.
Now that I have a back seat in this game, I can catch up on much needed sleep the next few nights! I have a very important (un-mafia related) week next week that I need to be prepared for.

Barn the hell outta this whole post

What the heck does that mean?

I also have no idea what that means.

[wam]

Yes I have been lurking but thats due to real life getting in the way and really not having much to post, as I am pretty bad at scum hunting (for proof see political parties) But here goes.

I am happy leaving my vote on Matt, whilst I have been lurking, he has been active lurking (by my understanding of it). Which I find more scummy than what I have been doing. On a side note, matt please use more punctuation and paragraphs!

With regards to WO, I can see the majority of the reasoning behind the lynch, but as a fellow newbie, I feel most of it falls into the newbie mistake category. I actually quite liked the name your 3 preferred lynch candidates as it gives us more information, at least in my mind. As other people have pointed out, putting someone on your scum list and not voting is a good way for scum to act suspicous of each other without voting. Therefore, we can just look for people not willing to upgrade to a vote.

The voting for matt when they weren't on their scum list is a bit suspicous but she named me, snark and chickenfish. The later two by that point had reduced in scummyness. I won't comment on myself as voicing opionions on youself looks wierd (hint there for snark!). So she had changed her mind and not explained herself properly (a trap I fall into a lot).

[Chickenfish]

Hey guys I'll be away for about 72 hours so won't be able to post much.

"Barning" = completely agreeing. Jargon I picked up from another mafia website, no idea of the origin!

[t1mm01994]

So.. I skimmed through most of this thing, because honestly, there's some HUGE walls of text there. I'll be at normal activity D2 though.
Stuff that jumped out at me:
- The episode with MN and Snark at the daystart. I could see all else that happened around them as a 2-man scumteam.. Only problem I have with this is that I haven't seen a game so far in which I didn't peg Snark for obviscum.
- matt and wam can't both be scum. There's too much people on there, and a mutual bussing at the most suspected list is quite risky; more risky than I'd expect from them.
- MN's threeway-vote post strikes me with so much irony I'm nearly knocked out (irons be heavy). He claims that scum can easily drop votes on the most scummy persons and get away with it with very little reasoning, continues to put votes on the 3 persons with most votes on them, without reasoning. Like... Yeah.
- WO and CF agree a lot. Seeing how they are cousins, this could be more bromance than anything else, but it's something I'll keep my eye on.

I've probably missed gazillions, but I think I can catch up with that day 2. For now, I'll put my vote on who I think is most scummy from what I've seen:
Vote: MostlyNormal
and we'll see how this develops.

[Snark]

Sorry for not being active here recently. This game is confusing me.

My thoughts: I am not happy with a wam or matt lynch. Having read back through their posts, I'm just not getting the scum vibe from either of them. I'm not getting a townie vibe either though. But if either of them get lynched and flip scum tomorrow, I'll be surprised. Pleasantly surprised, but surprised nonetheless. The one thing that I had against Matt was for posting a wall of useless content, which was something I came close to doing before thinking better of it. wam has been extremely neutral, imo.

I initially believed that Mostlynormal was town as he was agreeing with my strategies and also posted a lot of good pro-town content and suggestions of his own early on, but then again, I suspect he's a good enough player to be able to make significant contributions even when he's scum. On the other hand, as Tim pointed out, MN has set his votes on the three people with the most votes on them.

For now, I'm going to agree with Tim and

Vote: Mostlynormal

For agreeing with me, but being overly concerned with bandwagoning, then putting me at the top of his lynch list, then ignoring that and putting down a vote on the person with the most votes, and then backing down and unvoting wam when it started looking pretty sure that wam was going to be lynched (possibly because he knew that wam would flip town tomorrow).

Unofficial votals
wam - 3 - (Chickenfish, wingedocelot, matt)
matt - 2- (fearless, wam)
Mostlynormal - 2 - (t1mm01994, Snark)
wingedocelot - 1 - (Mostlynormal)

Note: I see that wam can change his vote to MN and tie it up. I will be on before deadline and will attempt to prevent this if no one else does somehow. I still need to think some more about whether I prefer a wam lynch to a no-lynch, but my guess is that at least one other vote will change in the next few hours, and I won't end up getting/having to make that decision.

[wam]

Well I have always been in favour of a Mostlynormal lynch and only changed as I was on my own and was happy with a matt lynch as well. However I would rather have a mostlynormal lynch than a matt lynch.

Therefore

unovte

Vote:mostlynormal

However, As I don't want a NL I will sacrfice myself and switch back to matt if its going to be a draw. However, it would be good for someone to break this deadlock.

[wam]

EBWOP

We do have around 12 hours before the deadline by my calculations. I should be online for around 4 hours to unvote if needed.

[t1mm01994]

You know that sacrificing yourself helps us in no possible way, right?
Given that you're town, it's a horrible idea as 2 townies will die rather than 1.
If you're scum, feel free to kill yourself, but uhm.. Between you and me... Your scumbuddy might hate you for the rest of eternity.