Snark wrote:You're really going to keep trying to vote for wam when he clearly explained himself and gave reasons for his vote? And you're also going to try and make me look bad for unvoting him? You look like scum trying to push a townie lynch and discredit a townie simultaneously.
Here's my better vote target.
And by extension, FoS: fearless
Snark, you do realise we're not all in your mind. Just because you think somebody's explanation is good enough, it doesn't mean we all do. Also, his behaviour has been weird apart from the accusing you of something you didn't do in this thread.
Furthermore, the question still stands about the unvote. Oddly it's almost justified my actions in my mind. wam says "sorry Snark I don't think you're scummy", and you unvote. It's consistent with the (terrible) OMGUS nature of your voting. Honestly I'm just starting to think it's your playstyle. Please know that for this and future games though that OMGUSing is very
unproductive. I'm not just talking about what you say in the thread, don't do it in your brain. You really are showing patterns of trying to find arguments against the people accusing you, rather than defending yourself + scumhunting everywhere.
Don't think you're off the hook, I still think you're very suspicious, but at the moment I think there are better lynches.
KrO2 wrote:I do think the things Chickenfish has against me are stronger than fearless' (related: I can't juggle), and pointing things like that out is not at all scummy. I'm trying to avoid being all OMGUS-y.To me it looks like if one of fearless and Chickenfish is scum, the other probably is as well, but I'm not about to accuse them both because what they said actually sounds reasonable.
The underlined - I lolled.
Keep in mind I'm not accusing you of being scum, I'd just been taking you for granted as town until then. You're still on the leaning town side of my list, but you have to earn your continued place their now
As for the me and fearless - I can see how us relaying off one another can be seen as buddying. I just hope that a) fearless isn't scum and b) if I die and flip town you don't let it clear fearless.
KrO2 wrote: Chickenfish wrote:
fearless wrote:The point is we can't know they will be acting as an inbetweener in this game. We have no idea (yet) what strategy scum have decided to employ. But I agree with you it's super easy for us to lynch town tonight, especially if they are playing as an inbetweener. But apparently D1 mislynch is better than no-lynch according to CF.
Actually, that quote was from wingedocelot, who is definitely taking your word for it.
Yeah I just failed at editing my quotes within quotes, I knew it was WO, and as such that statement was directed at her. I don't think she was just taking my word for it, I think my argument persuaded her and she agrees.
matt96 wrote:My post was significantly less than what I was aiming to get posted, I wanted to summarize all the things that went on between Chickenfish, Snark, and Mostlynormal, to point out that it seems to me that it is highly unlikely for more than one of them to be scum, and there is no clear distinction of which of them is scummiest, and that it wouldn't surprise me if it turns out that none of them are scum, but they are just townies involved in a heated debate about optimal strategy, but I am not to sure of that ever since pypokemafia, where the player at the top of almost every one's towniest list ended up being scum, but assuming no one would be able to pull off being scum and posting so much without messing up at all in a vanilla newbie game, that narrows down my pool of lynch candidates to 5, Carey, wam, KrO2, fearless, and wingedocelot, and of those I am getting a slight towny vibe from KrO2, just in general from (insert preferred possessive pronoun here) posts, and even more ambiguous towny-ish vibes from every one else other than Carey (who has only had one post with literally no content and has somehow managed to get away with it)
You know full stops aren't a scumtell right? Other than that, you've used POE to get to your happy lynches because you wouldn't be surprised if those of us in the debate were town? That's terrible
. There's so much more in here to go on.
Now let's enlarge the last bit of your post:
matt96 wrote:I like it when people post content, it gives us something to work with
Pretty bold saying that at that stage, seeing as you'd posted none and hadn't worked with any of the content posted...
Snark wrote:I'm going to
because no one else is apparently in favor of lynching him besides me.
And I'd like to note that I prefer a fearless lynch to a Matt lynch.
I still can't stand this. Why does it matter that nobody else is supporting it? If you think your vote is wasted on me, then vote for somebody else, like fearless whose lynch you prefer to matt's? Don't do nothing with it - it's even more wasted not being anyway.
wingedocelot wrote:My fourth is fearless - I haven't had much time to go through and do my own analysis on her, but I agree with a lot of the suspicions others have laid down against her in their votes.
I've said that understanding who is considered most towny in people's minds is advantageous for scum, and then you decide people should be adding a fourth to their list? Consider we mislynch today - 8 players left, everybody's said their 4 scummiest, scum know who 2 of the scum are. This is pretty much telling scum the two or three people that they will have the hardest time pushing a case against, and as such should NK. I really suspect you know this though, and that's why you tried to start the trend.
KrO2 wrote:Right now I'm leaning toward matt96. He hasn't responded to the many suspicions about the summary, and his (bolded) vote on careyhammer looks like mafia going for the safe vote, since Carey isn't going to defend himself. (Incidentally, the other two people who said a careyhammer lynch is acceptable to them were the other people I'm OK with lynching. Might not mean much, but it makes me feel better about my choices.) The downside of a Matt lynch is that if he is scum all it really tells us is that Carey probably isn't, which is useless unless he either starts posting or gets replaced. And if Matt isn't scum, I don't see us learning much at all. I'm willing to accept that downside because, like I said earlier, I think he's our most likely mafia member.
I really like the underlined. This is a point I was going to make, but you've already made it really. People recently seem to be primarily going for the information lynch, and trying to analyse what we can determine from the town/scum flip. If you think somebody is scum, that's all that should matter. If you think 2 or 3 people are equally likely to be scum, then sure figure out who you get the most info from.
EDIT: on getting to the next bit, I now realise it's you, KrO2, who's talking too much about info lynching. Me no likey.
Mostlynormal wrote:if you look, I do have three candidates. And I'm willing to post them here: wam, matt, and Snark. However, I still think this is a bad idea. It makes it way too easy for scum, they just pick three people out of the generally considered scummy and float on by without having to give a good argument. It's also wide angle and rather vague: how do you pressure with a three-way vote, and how can you defend yourself without looking like overreacting? I'm sorry, I don't like it at all.
So while I have no problem with posting my top three scummiest I'm going to put my vote where I want to put it because I'm going to put it where I think it's most likely to hit scum. Which would be wam
For the earlier wishywashiness, and for getting by with around the same content level as matt.
I'm sorry I ever doubted you MN. Barn the hell outta this whole post (other than the 3 you listed... sorta. More the fact that you listed at all)
KrO2 wrote:For anyone who hasn't voted yet or wants to consider switching from wam to matt96*,
I was thinking earlier about what we could find out from a Matt lynch, and I remembered one point earlier where he discounted the possibility that any of the most active players could be scum. So if he turns out scum, then aside from being pretty good evidence in favor of Tim being town, it's also evidence in favor of one of Chickenfish/Snark/Mostlynormal being scum. And since there'd only be one scum left, and I'm still fairly convinced of "if Chickenfish then fearless," then that leaves Snark and Mostlynormal. This absolutely is not definitive of course, so someone let me know if I'm stretching too much. I'd prefer someone not mentioned above so we can try to avoid conflict of interest, but I'm not about to tell people not to post.
If Matt turns out to be town, that's less information for us, but since we're looking for two scum in that case I'd start by reexamining the fearless-Chickenfish connection to see where it is on the spectrum from "damning evidence" to "not actually there," or maybe by just moving to the player who looked next scummiest.
Everybody: What specifically do you think we can and can't infer from finding out that matt96 is scum/town? That wam is? Answering this will help us decide which lynch gives us more information.
*Except wingedocelot. When your vote was on him I think it was the scummiest you've looked all game. Even aside from what Chickenfish said, voting based on authority seems weird; just because you think I'm town doesn't mean you should trust my opinion on who's scum. And you certainly shouldn't put a higher weight on my opinion than on your own townie or null vibe. Well, unless I'm cop claiming a scum result or something. Which is highly unlikely on day 1.
This I don't like, for the same reason as I liked your previous post. You're theorising about the future too much, in the same way that you (I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) did about how we should treat claims/counterclaims. Whoever we lynch today, keep in mind we'll actually have 2 deaths tomorrow to analyse - the second of which would hold more weight than the first. Here you're either trying to get town to tell you who to NK/push tomorrow's lynch on or you're unwittingly helping scum find these things out. I implore people not to answer these sorts of questions.
Note: this doesn't mean don't put it forward as an argument that you think is important. But asking the questions just for the sake of theory discussion? We're well past that.
On a final note, we're in a really good position no matter what happens tonight. Better for me not to elaborate until D2, but I just thought I'd put this here to avoid looking like scum backpedalling if wam flips town.