Bowties Vs. Ties

[A Lurker]

So here it is. The absolutely 100% most important questions known to man kind. Which is better, the bowtie, or the plain tie? Personally I have to go with bowtie due to it's superior class and sexyness, along with it's ease of tying (they are actually much easier to tie once your used to them).

Spoiler:

I know religious wars is generally for CS topics, but in the second post of the rules it says

the scope of this forum is going to be restricted to CS topics and other traditional geeky holy wars.

and at least in my mind this falls under "traditional geeky holy wars." If a mod disapproves feel free to move it or else to close it, and sorry for any extra work that my cause you to do.

Spoiler:

Off Topic:

By the way, does anyone know any good bowtie stores? I know of a one, but they don't get new selection very often...

[scarecrovv]

I've got work to do, so I'll make this quick:

Bowties are cool.

[Steax]

Obviously, in any profession, study or topic with the word 'science' in it...

[Izawwlgood]

Thin ties are where it's at. Bow ties to me suggest that you are either eternally single, or that your wife dresses you. The latter isn't really a bad thing, just sort of fits the bill for older dapper gentlemen.

I'm 28, not getting to retire.

[Steax]

In all seriousness, I wear long ties whenever I'm trying to be serious because it seems to be the norm here.

... Though my ties do tend to have either Elmo, Tigger, Cookie Monster (LONG LIVE THE COOKIE MONSTER), or... something to that degree. I haven't found a bender tie yet.

[EvanED]

Of course, the other holy war here is "what knot do you use for your (non-bow) tie"?

Also I am no longer a mod so it's up to phlip whether this thread belongs here.

[Steax]

There are different knots?

I always do the... right (long/main end) over left, right loops in, right wraps left side, right wraps right side (via inner side), right over left (via outer side), right through the loop, right in between the knot and recent out-side-segment, pull down, tighten with short end, hope length works out, repeat several dozen times till it does thing.

[Izawwlgood]

Sounds like a Windsor?

http://www.valparks.com.au/photos/Tie-Knot.gif

That's saved me a few times.

[EvanED]

http://www.tie-a-tie.net/ gives four (the same four as Izawwlgood's link). I can't tell from your description what you do, but that site has some decent pictures. I sort of get the sense that the most common is what is called the four-in-hand though, so that should maybe be your first stop.

Since discovering that site, I've been using the Pratt knot when I need a tie. Which is only once every couple years, so I totally sympathize with the "hope length works out, repeat several dozen times till it does" part of your instructions.

[Steax]

Yeah, looks like a Windsor (though, I think, in my laziness in college days I sometimes mentally turned that into the Half-Windsor variant). Huh, I didn't know there were other ways to do that...

... I'll go get a tie now.

What's the usual measure of 'length'? I was first taught by a teacher that it should be bellybutton-length, then my parents said it should be till about crotch-length, then someone else mentioned it at waist length. Evan's site gives top-of-belt length, which sounds alright, but is that generally accepted or just one of many standards?

[A Lurker]

Thin ties are where it's at. Bow ties to me suggest that you are either eternally single, or that your wife dresses you. The latter isn't really a bad thing, just sort of fits the bill for older dapper gentlemen.

I'm 28, not getting to retire.

You see, this form of thinking is really common where I'm at now. Thankfully I'm here to change that . As for thin ties, I've never really been able to stand them to be honest. Whenever I see them, even if the person wearing it is all dressed up, I can't help but feel as if they belong in the deep south. Well either that or else in a gay parade. (Most of the people who I see with thin ties tend to be gay, or else bi for that matter.)

In all seriousness, I wear long ties whenever I'm trying to be serious because it seems to be the norm here.

... Though my ties do tend to have either Elmo, Tigger, Cookie Monster (LONG LIVE THE COOKIE MONSTER), or... something to that degree. I haven't found a bender tie yet.

Okay, I do have to admit. Bowties are rather bad when it comes to designs most of the time. Just not a big enough surface area to really put much of a design. Although I have seen a bowtie or two with a pokeball on it. And of course the Cookie Monster, where else will the youth of this world learn about the true realities in life =P

Of course, the other holy war here is "what knot do you use for your (non-bow) tie"?

Also I am no longer a mod so it's up to phlip whether this thread belongs here.

Hmm, I always just kinda made up a know. From what I've gathered sometimes I do a double windsor, and sometimes a windsor, and one person told me I once did a triple windsor, but I think he may have just been trolling me. Really, even when I was wearing a tie two times a week though I could still never get the length right the first time. Absolutely terrrible.

There are different knots?

I always do the... right (long/main end) over left, right loops in, right wraps left side, right wraps right side (via inner side), right over left (via outer side), right through the loop, right in between the knot and recent out-side-segment, pull down, tighten with short end, hope length works out, repeat several dozen times till it does thing.

Ninja'd. Yeah, think that's a windsor.

http://www.tie-a-tie.net/ gives four (the same four as Izawwlgood's link). I can't tell from your description what you do, but that site has some decent pictures. I sort of get the sense that the most common is what is called the four-in-hand though, so that should maybe be your first stop.

Since discovering that site, I've been using the Pratt knot when I need a tie. Which is only once every couple years, so I totally sympathize with the "hope length works out, repeat several dozen times till it does" part of your instructions.

Okay, Hmm, well I guess I've been doing the Windsor, the Half-Windsor, and one that's like mixing a prat with a windsor. Interesting.

Yeah, looks like a Windsor (though, I think, in my laziness in college days I sometimes mentally turned that into the Half-Windsor variant). Huh, I didn't know there were other ways to do that...

... I'll go get a tie now.

What's the usual measure of 'length'? I was first taught by a teacher that it should be bellybutton-length, then my parents said it should be till about crotch-length, then someone else mentioned it at waist length. Evan's site gives top-of-belt length, which sounds alright, but is that generally accepted or just one of many standards?

For length I normally did between the belly button and belt. I could never get length right so as soon as I got into that range I just said "screw it, I'm close enough."

[Gear]

Ties are superior for reasons already cited: I have yet to run into a penguin, circuit board, polar bear, Deadpool, Startrek, Garfield, or Tux bowtie.

[cphite]

Of course, the other holy war here is "what knot do you use for your (non-bow) tie"?

Also I am no longer a mod so it's up to phlip whether this thread belongs here.

The easy one, whatever it's called. And I never untie them if it can be avoided. I have ties that haven't been untied for years. I just loosen them and tighten them to take them on or off, which takes almost zero time.

Which is what makes the long tie vastly superior to the bowtie.

[Izawwlgood]

This was a Windsor, kind of wideish tie, but I fucking love herringbone, which you can't see from the image, but I assure you, makes everyone swoon. I can't even look down, I just start swooning.

Spoiler:

Boom!

studly.png (49.76 KiB) Viewed 5188 times

[Jacque]

I'm a fan of both types of ties. Though, each has it's own proper time to shine. Unfortunately I don't have many reasons to wear a tie in my line of work but I enjoy wearing one when an opportunity comes around. And personally I'm preferable to the 4-in-hand knot for the little bit of added personality the slightly asymmetrical knot lends.

My favorite tie I own is one of my summer ties, a real raw silk beaut:





As for bow ties, I've actually not had an good opportunity to wear one yet, but I picked up this number a little while back and I think it's pretty great.



And always a real knot, never a clip on. Learning to tie both a regular tie and a bow tie are some of those things that every boy should learn to do.


EDIT:

By the way, does anyone know any good bowtie stores? I know of a one, but they don't get new selection very often...

There's a few places I'd look for bow ties. First and foremost is J.Press, they're an old-school shop that specializes in the classic american style. Some stores like J.Crew (just noticed the common J.* naming convention here) tend to carry bow-ties every now and then and change up their offerings pretty often. Also, I've picked up some bow ties for my groomsmen from a shop called General Knot & Co. (vintage fabrics) and they had a few good things there. And of course, one of the best known names when it comes to ties is Drakes London.

Evan's site gives top-of-belt length, which sounds alright, but is that generally accepted or just one of many standards?

The tip of your tie should lie just about in the middle of your belt/waistband.

[Steax]

I've found that wearing a suit and tie increases a person's awesomeness by quite a bit (and, depending on the situation, a tie that mirrors a person's personality adds to that so much). I especially like decorated/personalized ties because they let people stand out at a party ("that guy with the tigger tie") and also make for interesting conversation-starters.

Do all knots share that "pull to undo" feature?

[Iranon]

I like bow ties, but don't wear them frequently.

For long ties, I prefer the Windsor knot unless the tie is unusually thick. I'm tall, long-necked and look like I need a shave after all but cutting my head off - If the knot isn't tidy and solid, I may as well fly the tie at half mast and use an overfilled glass of whisky as an accessory.
Which also looks better with an ordinarily stuffy knot.

@ Steax: They don't, that assumption is a good way to mess up a perfectly good tie.

[Endless Mike]

Anyone can wear a long tie, but only some people can pull off a bowtie. But damn, if they can pull it off, it rocks.

[A Lurker]

Ties are superior for reasons already cited: I have yet to run into a penguin, circuit board, polar bear, Deadpool, Startrek, Garfield, or Tux bowtie.

Hmm, I know I've seen those first two somewhere's before. Gonna have to see if I could use some google-fu to find them again.

The easy one, whatever it's called. And I never untie them if it can be avoided. I have ties that haven't been untied for years. I just loosen them and tighten them to take them on or off, which takes almost zero time.

Which is what makes the long tie vastly superior to the bowtie.

Well, yeah, guess normal ties do win on that count. Can't really do the just loosen to put on with a bowtie.

This was a Windsor, kind of wideish tie, but I fucking love herringbone, which you can't see from the image, but I assure you, makes everyone swoon. I can't even look down, I just start swooning.

Actually had to look up herringbone ties, never heard of 'em before. Seem like the kinda tie you could use for a semi-formal event, but that it'd look kinda out of place at say... Tie Thursday at work. Seems like grey suit attire.

I'm a fan of both types of ties. Though, each has it's own proper time to shine. Unfortunately I don't have many reasons to wear a tie in my line of work but I enjoy wearing one when an opportunity comes around. And personally I'm preferable to the 4-in-hand knot for the little bit of added personality the slightly asymmetrical knot lends.

My favorite tie I own is one of my summer ties, a real raw silk beaut:

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

As for bow ties, I've actually not had an good opportunity to wear one yet, but I picked up this number a little while back and I think it's pretty great.

Spoiler:

And always a real knot, never a clip on. Learning to tie both a regular tie and a bow tie are some of those things that every boy should learn to do.

I'm actually extremely jealous of that bowtie. Always wanted to try out the diamond ones, but never actually seen one in a store anywhere's, and they always end up being more expensive when I've seen them online. And I guess the normal tie is cool looking too...

Spoiler:

By the way, does anyone know any good bowtie stores? I know of a one, but they don't get new selection very often...

There's a few places I'd look for bow ties. First and foremost is J.Press, they're an old-school shop that specializes in the classic american style. Some stores like J.Crew (just noticed the common J.* naming convention here) tend to carry bow-ties every now and then and change up their offerings pretty often. Also, I've picked up some bow ties for my groomsmen from a shop called General Knot & Co. (vintage fabrics) and they had a few good things there. And of course, one of the best known names when it comes to ties is Drakes London.

Thanks, I'll have to check those out once finals week is over =)

I've found that wearing a suit and tie increases a person's awesomeness by quite a bit (and, depending on the situation, a tie that mirrors a person's personality adds to that so much). I especially like decorated/personalized ties because they let people stand out at a party ("that guy with the tigger tie") and also make for interesting conversation-starters.

Do all knots share that "pull to undo" feature?

Yeah, Suit + Tie = Win. It's fundamental mathematics, up there with 2 + 2 = 4. Just one of those undeniable truths in the world. And no, some tie knots, if you just pull to undo them, get all jankied up and slightly confuzzled with itself.

I like bow ties, but don't wear them frequently.

For long ties, I prefer the Windsor knot unless the tie is unusually thick. I'm tall, long-necked and look like I need a shave after all but cutting my head off - If the knot isn't tidy and solid, I may as well fly the tie at half mast and use an overfilled glass of whisky as an accessory.
Which also looks better with an ordinarily stuffy knot.

You know, you could always go for the classy drunk look. I hear that really works wonders on the ladies if they had parental issues...

Anyone can wear a long tie, but only some people can pull off a bowtie. But damn, if they can pull it off, it rocks.

And rock it does. From what I can tell it's all personality. You gotta own your tie man. And yes, it's damn sexy when you do.

[AvatarIII]

Bow Tie for a tux, long tie for anything else. I say.

also according to the stuff posted earlier in the thread, I always tie my tie Four in Hand style, because it's easy, I should probably learn the symmetrical ways though, normally I just tug the four in hand style until it looks symmetrical.

[ssbookyu123]

I love bow ties in a way that is just short of sexual due to the fact I don't want to stain a bow tie They tend to be much more practical than a tie that just flops all over the place and they might be limited in print, but there are more styles of bow tie than skinny and normal. I also might have a particular bias to bow ties because I love steam punk and anything Victorian

[Wolby]

Thin ties are where it's at. Bow ties to me suggest that you are either eternally single, or that your wife dresses you. The latter isn't really a bad thing, just sort of fits the bill for older dapper gentlemen.

I'm 28, not getting to retire.

Correction: Bow ties suggest you are eternally single, that your wife dresses you, that you are an older gentlemen, or that you are a (dead sexy) fashion-conscious dyke.

I love butches. We are the only people I have ever met who know how to tie a bow tie from scratch.

I like long ties less, but I wouldn't want to choose just one to wear for the rest of my life.

[Izawwlgood]

Late on the reply here, but;

And always a real knot, never a clip on. Learning to tie both a regular tie and a bow tie are some of those things that every boy should learn to do.

For starters Jacque, those are damn sexy casual wear patterns, and you rock that vest like a star.
The 'know how to tie a tie' thing is so engrained in my head as being something 'grown ups know how to do' that I occasionally have nightmares where I find myself unable to tie a tie right before a formal event.

Actually had to look up herringbone ties, never heard of 'em before. Seem like the kinda tie you could use for a semi-formal event, but that it'd look kinda out of place at say... Tie Thursday at work. Seems like grey suit attire.

Herringbone is just the pattern, and it happens to be my favorite. I agree, I feel it's a bit on the 'more formal' side of things, but I don't think that's set in stone or... a thing, really.

...or that you are a (dead sexy) fashion-conscious dyke.

I wonder actually, if that is a sort of hijacking of a particularly 'dapper' male dress style?