Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his chest

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Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his chest

Postby Ipsum » Thu Apr 26, 2012 8:53 pm UTC

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Spoiler:
Rapid City, South Dakota – A member and resident of the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe of South Dakota came home from a 14-day stay in the hospital to find he had been horribly mutilated. Three Ks can be easily seen carved or burned into his abdomen in the shocking photograph taken the day after he came home.

Vernon Traversie, who is completely blind, said his nightmare began when he had a heart attack while at the Heart Doctors office in Rapid City last August. He said they immediately sent him a few blocks away to Rapid City Regional Hospital for emergency surgery.
Traversie is a 68-year-old Lakota elder who told Last Real Indians, “I was supposed to have emergency surgery on my heart, but they (hospital) had scheduling problems. Every night they would prep me for surgery which went on for four or five days. Every night they would shave my chest and stomach and wouldn’t feed me.”
Being blind, Traversie said he didn’t even know what was done to him until a RCRH employee came into his room and advised him to have pictures taken of his chest and abdomen as soon as he got home. He says she told him that she could not testify for him, but that her conscience got the better of her and she didn’t agree with what they did to him.
Last Real Indians asked retired nurse, Joyce Anderson, to view the photograph of Traversie’s injuries. She was a surgical nurse for nine years and worked on the heart team at Baptist Hospital in Little Rock, Arkansas. She said, “It appears the area under the incision was done with a scalpel for drainage of the incision. The other wounds seem to be necrotic, meaning the tissue is dead. This could indicate the wounds were burned into his skin.”
Traversie has posted a Youtube video (See Vern Traversie Video) in which he explains his ordeal.
He calls what has been done to him a racial hate crime. In the video he explains that if the mutilation of his abdomen was done in surgery that there were many who would have witnessed it. However, he said, “I had a male nurse come over and tell me to shut my f****** mouth, because I asked for pain medication after my surgery.
He then related, “I felt scared and humiliated. I couldn’t even move my arms. I felt helpless.”
Traversie then explained that he found it odd that he requested to be transferred to a rehabilitation hospital to regain his strength but was not granted his request – all the while various people kept coming in to look at his abdomen. At the time, he was not aware of the suspicious wounds.
He claims the hospital told his attorney that the extra wounds were caused by tape. However, he said he did not have any tape on him that he remembers.
Traversie said he did have pictures taken of his abdomen the day after her returned home from the hospital. The pictures he said are dated September 9.
He said a West Wind Home Healthcare nurse visited him at his home and he told her about the hospital nurse telling him to have pictures taken. He said when the West Wind nurse saw his abdomen she just kept saying, “Oh my God, Oh my God. I don’t know what they did to you.” She then took pictures and ran them over to a nearby health facility where tribal police were requested to meet with her.
The tribal police, FBI, and Traversie’s pastor all have photographs of the suspicious wounds.
Traversie said nothing is being done on his behalf by law enforcement and that the doctor who saw him at the nearby health facility said she could not make any statements about his injuries.
He explained that he has waited for seven months for his Rapid City attorney to take action on his behalf. He said he posted the above video because his attorney took no action and had told him not to speak about his case.
He told Last Real Indians, “Not all white people are like this, but I don’t think this should be allowed to go on.
Traversie has no resources for an attorney but did say council member Ryman Lebeau and Tribal Chairman Kevin Keckler are trying to get an attorney for him.
Traversie concluded, “Those Ks are causing me pain still. And, I have to live with that on my stomach the rest of my life.”


A blind lakota tribe elder was taken to a hospital for surgery after a heart attack, and is later told by a nurse that he has the letters "KKK" carved into his chest. Police are refusing to investigate.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby natraj » Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:28 pm UTC

i don't even know what to say to that. that is so horrible, what is wrong with people.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Iulus Cofield » Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:40 pm UTC

For convenience, I've spoilered the image of his chest below.

Spoiler:
Image


I'm not really seeing three Ks there. One for sure, and maybe a partial one, and some things that kind of look like Hebrew letters, but not KKK. It definitely sounds like he got some pretty lawsuit worthy mistreatment, but I'm not seeing the hate crime.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Роберт » Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:54 pm UTC

Iulus Cofield wrote:For convenience, I've spoilered the image of his chest below.

Spoiler:
Image


I'm not really seeing three Ks there. One for sure, and maybe a partial one, and some things that kind of look like Hebrew letters, but not KKK. It definitely sounds like he got some pretty lawsuit worthy mistreatment, but I'm not seeing the hate crime.

Good call looking up the image. It looks painful but it's hardly clear that there's any intentional reference to the Klu Klux Klan on there. Reminds my of Mary on toast. It's probably there if you look for it.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Ipsum » Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:30 am UTC

I saw pretty clearly one K on the left, and two more on the right, but maybe I'm just looking for it. Then again, this was taken a few days after the surgery, so some of the lettering may have been healed.

Regardless of whether or not there was "KKK" on there, it still seems like a hate crime.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby PeteP » Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:38 am UTC

The rightmost one is pretty clear, the one slightly to it's left, well if somebody asked me what letter it is I would say K, but if I weren't looking for a letter, I probably wouldn't identify it as a k so possible but not sure. The leftmost one is tricky, I immediately found it when locking for ks, but it's far from clear and it's quite far away from the other two, why put it there if you are writing kkk?
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Vaniver » Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:19 am UTC

Yeah, this looks like malpractice, which is distressingly routine, rather than a hate crime.

[edit] I should be clear that some doctors ought to be asked some questions by lawyers / police, but the "started prepping for the procedure then stopped" thing seems much more serious than the "I sort of see three Ks" thing.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Telchar » Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:58 am UTC

It's also a little distressing that some of the wounds are described as being burns. IANAD but burn wounds after heart surgery seems odd...
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Iulus Cofield » Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:57 am UTC

I'm most distressed that he's apparently been discouraged from suing them, when it sounds like there was plenty of malpractice going around.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Ormurinn » Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:59 am UTC

Telchar wrote:It's also a little distressing that some of the wounds are described as being burns. IANAD but burn wounds after heart surgery seems odd...


I believe there may be a cauterizing instrument used in some surgeries that might explain this, but I'm not a medic.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby addams » Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:11 am UTC

Ormurinn wrote:
Telchar wrote:It's also a little distressing that some of the wounds are described as being burns. IANAD but burn wounds after heart surgery seems odd...


I believe there may be a cauterizing instrument used in some surgeries that might explain this, but I'm not a medic.


Diabetes? It is not possible to Dx from photos. Not really.

But; What the heck. It is the internet!

I looked at the photos. Yep. It seems that man had open heart. He lived! Hey. That is a win.

I see wounds that were, most likely, for two drainage tubes. The other drainage tube incision is in there somewhere. Some of the wounds are located where the tape to hold the drainage tubes in place would be. The healing looks slow. Diabetes? The incision is doing well.

The other wounds are newer. Who knows how long the tubes needed to be in place? That is, still, a distended abdomen.

I would want to ask a few questions and look at the wounds up close with good light.

Pfft. kkk? Nah. Damn lucky to be alive? Yes.

The one wound that does look like a K, also looks like a bruise. If, it is, then, it will heal.

Good Grief, People; Lighten up on the medical staff. That is a hard job.

(Shall I place the drainage tube here and secure it with an X of tape? Or; Will that look like an image of Mohamed when the tape is removed?)
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby TheKrikkitWars » Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:23 am UTC

Ormurinn wrote:
Telchar wrote:It's also a little distressing that some of the wounds are described as being burns. IANAD but burn wounds after heart surgery seems odd...


I believe there may be a cauterizing instrument used in some surgeries that might explain this, but I'm not a medic.


Youbetcha... and it causes burns like that in unprotected skin.

I don't think that this is some kind of hate crime, I think it's possible that someone has inappropriately adhered a conductive pad, or fucked up their settings and ended up with the cautery going to town on his abdomen... Which shouldn't be happening, but it's hard to tell whether those are burns or incisons or what from that picture...
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Роберт » Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:32 pm UTC

addams wrote:(Shall I place the drainage tube here and secure it with an X of tape? Or; Will that look like an image of Mohamed when the tape is removed?)

This post was full of win.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Ormurinn » Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:51 pm UTC

Роберт wrote:
addams wrote:(Shall I place the drainage tube here and secure it with an X of tape? Or; Will that look like an image of Mohamed when the tape is removed?)

This post was full of win.


Seconded.

On topic - this is clearly medical malpractice, but do we have any evidence of a racially based motive other than the "Jesus in my toast" effect with regards to the 3 "K's"? Seems like a slow news day piece more than anything.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Dauric » Fri Apr 27, 2012 3:26 pm UTC

addams wrote:Good Grief, People; Lighten up on the medical staff. That is a hard job.

(Shall I place the drainage tube here and secure it with an X of tape? Or; Will that look like an image of Mohamed when the tape is removed?)


If the tape leaves behind large swaths of necrotic (dead) tissue in the image of -anything- then you're clearly using the wrong tape.

Ormurinn wrote:On topic - this is clearly medical malpractice, but do we have any evidence of a racially based motive other than the "Jesus in my toast" effect with regards to the 3 "K's"? Seems like a slow news day piece more than anything.


I think what we don't have is context. The mentions of Mr. Traversie's issues with being repeatedly prepped for surgery and generally being badly treated by hospital staff would suggest that this wasn't just one doctor, which itself suggests that the community where this hospital is located has larger issues with discrimination against native Americans, but that's nothing but inference based on a very small piece of information. If this had been a black man being mistreated in Alabama we'd have a lot more ready-made context to work with, but Native American issues don't get the same kind of airtime so we don't have the context of the state of discrimination where this happened.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Telchar » Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:28 pm UTC

I guess I didn't realize they cauterized relatively small incisions like that. It also looks like the incisions were all over the map so to speak. Multiple angles I can understand as necessary but to my admittedly untrained nonsurgical eye that looks not unlike road rash.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby Chen » Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:48 pm UTC

Telchar wrote:I guess I didn't realize they cauterized relatively small incisions like that. It also looks like the incisions were all over the map so to speak. Multiple angles I can understand as necessary but to my admittedly untrained nonsurgical eye that looks not unlike road rash.


A lot of the smaller ones look like incisions for laproscopic surgery. Which I suppose could be necessary when doing heart surgery to avoid too much more cutting. Still the larger ones do look like someone dropped a cauterizing tool which is some pretty big malpractice...
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby addams » Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:46 pm UTC

Thank you, for the 'win'. That kind of thing is nice. So, I'll write more.

O.K. We are going to do a Dx on one photo and a bunch of mean things that may or may not have been said or done.

O.K. First; Let's attack the being preped repeatedly for surgery. That part is somewhat understandable.

Someone would have to look at the records. Why? Why was he preped and then the surgery was not done?

Was his B/P too high? Was the equipment for that very difficult and dangerous procedure not ready? Did they have to wait for some of the medical staff to get there?

Preping every day should not be a horrible ordeal. It may have been. I don't know. People that are in hospitals need to be washed. A little shave with that bath does not seem so awful to me. White men shave all the time. Like, everyday. I was not there.

Yes. The man said that one of the Nursing Staff told him to, "Shut up!"?
Gee Willikers. It could be true. That is a Huge problem. What kind of people are we? Nurses can be wonderful. Some are fricking Saints. They put themselves on the line for their patients. They work hard. They have more to do than is humanly possible and they do it, anyway. They take care of the Doctors, the other Nurses. Everyone. They earn more respect than they are given.
Some Nurses are mean controlling Assholes. The profession attracts some of those kinds. People are often helpless when they are hospitalized. That is why they are in the hospital.

It is a good thing to have family or friends hanging around. I know they get underfoot. They can also be a great deal of help.

Sometimes people that have major surgery also have hallucinations. Some one needs to read the records and talk to the staff.

Telcher; The incision is huge! All that Road Rash is secondary. It is drainage and things like that.

Now on to the idea that American Indians are not treated well by medical staff, because, the culture in the surrounding area is biased against Lakota. I have no idea. No clue. None. Not even a hunch. Lakota. I have met Lakota. Maybe. It is like a last name up in that area. The Lakata. The Sioux. All of 'em. They have babies together and with other people. I don't know. The Tribal Police are 'on' it. If, there is a problem, they will take care of it.

Malpractice? Really? He lived! It looks like he is healing well. That surgery is a hard thing to do. They call it practice for a reason. No one get it perfect, every time. Darn good, sometimes. I could have done better, sometimes. Tough job.

The poor man. He is blind? Jeeze. It is so mean that someone told him that he has kkk on his belly. It is not true.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby DaBigCheez » Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:56 pm UTC

I can offer a little (very limited) regional context, as I'm originally from South Dakota but lived on the other side of the state.

Rapid City is relatively close to the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation, which is where much of the state's Oglala Lakota population resides. It is also, if I remember correctly, one of the poorest regions per capita in the entire nation. It sounded like the man in question here probably lived in Rapid City proper, rather than being from the "res"; I hadn't noticed any particular bias against the Lakota from where I lived, but had heard that there was in some places a stereotype of people living on the reservation as being lazy, overly laid-back, unambitious and frequently drunk - sort of a Midwestern version of the stereotype about Mexicans commonly (AFAIK) held in the South/Southwest.

Whether that's a prevalent view in Rapid City I don't know, but it's definitely within the realm of possibility that people could be biased against the Lakota due to the economic status of the reservation and stereotypes.

(Side note: Lakota is really a more proper name than Sioux, for those who didn't know, Teton Sioux originally being a moniker ascribed to the Lakota by their enemies, translating to "snake" or "enemy". It's passed into common parlance now so I don't think too many people get worked up about it, but it's still similar in concept to calling someone from France a "frog" rather than a "Frenchman" because you heard about them from someone who didn't like the French and thought "frog" was the correct term.)
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby addams » Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:38 pm UTC

Oh, dear. You took me on a trip in Mr. Peabody's way back machine.

The American Indian. Well; There are a great many tragic stories. That is true. I know some. There are a great many funny stories, too.

Have you ever heard of the Reservation Car? A car that is such a piece of shit that it can not be taken off the Reservation? I heard a story about one that was so funny it made me cry. Those girls loved that car.

The short story is that much of the Culture of The American Indian was erased by the white people. They were, just, doing what they had learned to do to each other. It gets complicated. White people are not THE problem. They were for a while.

So; American Indians, kind of, have to make up a culture for themselves, on the run. The American Indians are doing alright.
Nope. I am wrong. The Indians are not doing alright. Sorry. A few funny stories does not make the rest of it O.K.
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There are people that have been working hard to find the culture of the past and using what works. Keeping records of everything, else.

Some of the hair dos were amazing. Not everyone has enough hair for that. I think that work is, most likely, going along well.
I have seen some stuff. The white culture is still very dominate. Indian pride seems to be on the upswing. The Reservation Police are the only Police that I would trust, at this point.

It is an Indian issue. It is also a human issue. Indians are like everybody else. Some have great integrity. Some are devoted to their people. Some are a just mean. They are people.

I have noticed that some tribes are nicer than other tribes. They still have problems with the white people diet. There are people working on it.

Diabetes rates are high for Indians. Diabetes may have taken that man's sight.

The Reservation Car and stuff like that. Still going on. I think that the Res Car did not come from the distant past. It has became a part of the culture. I think that those cars should be preserved.

Two girls taught themselves to drive in a car that only had Reverse. They got good at it. It still strikes me as funny. It was what they did. Like Ginger Rodgers, who did it backwards and in high heals. They did it backwards and in flip flops.
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Re: Blind Lakota tribal elder has "KKK" carved into his ches

Postby TheKrikkitWars » Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:42 am UTC

Telchar wrote:I guess I didn't realize they cauterized relatively small incisions like that. It also looks like the incisions were all over the map so to speak. Multiple angles I can understand as necessary but to my admittedly untrained nonsurgical eye that looks not unlike road rash.


They don't usually, but some surgeons use cauteries to control bleeding from minor vessels during open surgery, especially during the initial "cuting through all the bits in the way of the broken bit" phase... Monopolar electrocauteries can cause burns pretty much anywhere if the current isn't given a nice, safe, low resistivity path from the person to the ground, though advances in equipment technology mean that theoretically, it shouldn't happen.

Also, it's difficult to tell from that photo what those black looking marks are, they *could* be necrotic tissue, they *could* be fulgarated tissue (ie cautery burns), they *could* be coagulated blood... Without more detailed and evenly lit photos it's really very hard to make even reasonable guess; so perhaps we shouldn't surmise too much from it. This said, it is hard to find a logical explaination for the number, arrangement and shape of the marks.
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