1190: "Time"

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BytEfLUSh
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby BytEfLUSh » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:15 am UTC

taixzo wrote:
BytEfLUSh wrote:Cueball took all of Megan's stuff in his own bag. So why are both of their bags suddenly heavy?

ETA: This doesn't make much sense. It's a trap.


Perhaps the Beanies gave them food?


Perhaps. Everything is possible. :)

Also notice the verTical "filled" vs horizontal "heavy".

ETE: Leopard mishaps



ETA2: This is one of those Pope Bugs, I think... So, the papal decree this time is to never confuse your computer's leopard with a genuine wild keyboard.
Last edited by BytEfLUSh on Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:24 am UTC, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ofvn2vw1872 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:17 am UTC

AnotherKevin wrote:
taixzo wrote:It's not an original castle, in the sense that it was built as "I want to have a castle", rather than "We need to defend the nobility of this area against invasion, so let's build thick walls and guard towers." I don't think that Connecticut was ever a feudal system.


Bannerman Castle, on Pollepel Island in the Hudson River, comes closer. It was built as an arsenal, so its isolation and thick stone walls made some amount of sense.
Image


Bannerman Castle is a lovely. Unfortunately I've heard it's a bit dangerous to wander around in (if you canoe out to it) because of potential for unexploded ordinance from way back. Not to mention that it's falling apart, a sizable chunk of it fell of in the past two-ish years.

My vote on the bag offer is that it is a genuine offer, concealed as a trap by poor command of the language.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Davidy » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:19 am UTC

SinusPi wrote:Time for some VERY late night analysis!

Image

I wrote out all known roots and "vowels".

Apparently we have 4 to 5 vowels - a convex arc [Xʾ], a concave arc [Xʿ], arc below [X̯ ] and a dot above [Ẋ].
Also, 22 roots so far.

This COULD, barely, map to a regular alphabet, with its 5 vowels and 21 consonants.


Your analysis is interesting and represents a lot of time and effort, but what is the end result to be? In the end, you'll have the Beanish alphabet but no clue to the words' meanings in which the letters are found, and no clue to how they're pronounced. It's like reading a Russian text and listing out the Cyrilic alphabet. You'd still not know what each word means.

The only real way to decode the language is to examine the context in which each word was used, make educated guesses to the possible meanings depending on the speaker's and listener's actions, compare with other times the same word is used, interpolate the meanings of connected words, and build a table of each word's probable meaning. This is the way we know their words for "Yes" and "Water", words that likely are greetings, and how we know that sentences with a "-", "=" or "o" at the end are declarative, interrogative and exclamatory, respectively.

The individual letters are relatively unimportant, it's their combination making recognizably words that counts.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby BytEfLUSh » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:21 am UTC

As I notice that this may be a big thing, let me just re-iterate it:
BytEfLUSh wrote:Also notice the vertical "filled" vs horizontal "heavy".
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Rule110 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:22 am UTC

BytEfLUSh wrote:Cueball took all of Megan's stuff in his own bag. So why are both of their bags suddenly heavy?

ETA: This doesn't make much sense. It's a trap. Try reading the Oracle's texts in Blade Runner, Matrix, Terminator sort-of-way. It does get a different feeling to it.

That's okay. Megan and Cueball can just play along for now, and pull out the aces when the Time is right.

(And with that... molpy
d
o
w
n
)
If you're lost you can look--and you will find me
Time after Time...

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby edo » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:24 am UTC

SinusPi wrote:
edo wrote:I think I've been staring at this too long.
To me, the "ᑲᒥ" in "ᑭᒋᑲᒥᐤ" is starting to look like the "bJ" in "42bJ". Is it just me?

What in the Nine Hells is ᑭᒋᑲᒥᐤ..?


Sorry, in order to read it, you have to have a font installed that supports Canadian Aboriginals, and (for some reason) you can't be using Chrome.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby buffygirl » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:29 am UTC

HAL9000 wrote:
Spoiler:
charlie_grumbles wrote:
Charm Quark wrote:[heretical]Second, a possible solution if post rate is indeed accelerating. Would it make sense to give Time its own sub-forum, which would contain the OTT along with other, smaller, specialized threads (for instance, one for academic geekery, one for the OTC film, etc.)? This would keep ketchup under control while allowing this awesome community to continue to expand. And I don't throw "awesome community" around lightly...I've spent countless hours in various online communities, and I've spent, by my count, nearly a thousand hours running a community of my own, and it doesn't shame me in the least to say that the OTT is, overall, the best online community I've ever been a part of.[/heretical]

That sounds like a bad (terrible) idea to me. While I'm not interested in everything here, I'm happy to skip over the stuff of less interest. On the other hand, I'm being introduced to a lot of things I didn't know or have forgotten. If we split the thread it will be hard (impossible) to get it all. Serendipity is a good thing. I think it would split the community and that would be a bad (terrible) thing.

Indeed. Dividing into multiple threads would also make it maddeningly difficult to read posts in order, and it would take a much larger time commitment on each of our parts to follow Time and the community that has sprung up around it.
If a subtopic is important/unrelated/large enough to merit a thread of its own (such as our frequently-renewed debate over pluralization), that's what the rest of the forum is for. Discuss it here if you're not derailing the thread (hard to do with this many users), but also consider starting a new thread for it so as to access the forum's membership as a whole. We don't need to remain within only this one thread.
My suggestion to keep the postrate down is to avoid posting unnecessary things, such as following the non-comic-related suggestions of whoever's post happens to be at the top of the page, or announcing when you are waking up or going to sleep. "Molpy down" and a picture of a sleeping animal, if the entirety of your post, just adds to the clutter and does not enhance the experience of reading new pages of the thread. Not that you can't let us know if you want to, but make sure it's part of a post that advances some facet of one of our many discussions. We're not a chatroom, not matter how much it feels like we are (which it very much does, at least some of the time).
Edit to add last two sentences so as to not sound overly vindictive.

Hal, I completely disagree re: the molpy-ups and downs. I LOVE the images, and think it's adorable & fabulous that a bunch of nerdy scientist folk can still have a thing for cute cuddly things. I always click on the image spoiler, and always smile! Thus, I counter in the same declarative manner, these posts DO enhance the experience of reading new pages!

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby BytEfLUSh » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:35 am UTC

I look forward for the newpix, but for now...

Spoiler:
Image


Spoiler:
Yes, that is me. 80's
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Re: Beacon Beta, Papal Decree

Postby Chinchokmataa » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:37 am UTC

pelrigg wrote:I hope someone's helping Chinchokmataa out on this. Xe introduced xerself as a linguist in xer first OTT post. I welcomed xer and gave directions to the Wiki and to the first NP with Beanie Talk (just happened to be my ONG on top of it :roll: :oops: ), approximately two dips ago. The biggest thing is, I'm not sure if anyone else noticed xer. (Perhaps because it wasn't a firstpost that bumped a Page Pope?)


It's fine! I figured it out! And I might just make that table myself.
And I'm feeling plenty of recognition, thanks.

SinusPi wrote:Time for some VERY late night analysis!

Spoiler:
Image

I wrote out all known roots and "vowels".

Apparently we have 4 to 5 vowels - a convex arc [Xʾ], a concave arc [Xʿ], arc below [X̯ ] and a dot above [Ẋ].
Also, 22 roots so far.

This COULD, barely, map to a regular alphabet, with its 5 vowels and 21 consonants.


Pretty cool, this is what I was just looking at.
However, I don't think it is fair to ignore ".", "?", and "!" in the analysis, as I suspect they also represent vowels. Definitely not weird for a language to have more than 5 vowels!
(example: The English alphabet uses 5 vowel letters, but those actually represent about 10~14 different distinct vowel sounds, though you are right that most languages have only 5 vowel sounds)
But yeah, I like the bases=consonants and diacritics=vowels interpretation. The numbers seem to look nice anyway.

Davidy wrote:Your analysis is interesting and represents a lot of time and effort, but what is the end result to be? In the end, you'll have the Beanish alphabet but no clue to the words' meanings in which the letters are found, and no clue to how they're pronounced. It's like reading a Russian text and listing out the Cyrilic alphabet. You'd still not know what each word means.

The only real way to decode the language is to examine the context in which each word was used, make educated guesses to the possible meanings depending on the speaker's and listener's actions, compare with other times the same word is used, interpolate the meanings of connected words, and build a table of each word's probable meaning. This is the way we know their words for "Yes" and "Water", words that likely are greetings, and how we know that sentences with a "-", "=" or "o" at the end are declarative, interrogative and exclamatory, respectively.

The individual letters are relatively unimportant, it's their combination making recognizably words that counts.


The end result will be that it'll be awesome :D
But more then that we can find out:
-Something about the way Randal created the language
-If it is just a modern language written in a weird system (I'm personally holding out on the possibility that it is some sort of "futurized" English)

And also, I don't think we should limit ourselves to just trying to seek the knowledge that is "useful." Why can't we know all of the things?

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby trolleypup » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:48 am UTC

Davidy wrote:
SinusPi wrote:Time for some VERY late night analysis!

I wrote out all known roots and "vowels".

Apparently we have 4 to 5 vowels - a convex arc [Xʾ], a concave arc [Xʿ], arc below [X̯ ] and a dot above [Ẋ].
Also, 22 roots so far.

This COULD, barely, map to a regular alphabet, with its 5 vowels and 21 consonants.


Your analysis is interesting and represents a lot of time and effort, but what is the end result to be? In the end, you'll have the Beanish alphabet but no clue to the words' meanings in which the letters are found, and no clue to how they're pronounced. It's like reading a Russian text and listing out the Cyrillic alphabet. You'd still not know what each word means.

The only real way to decode the language is to examine the context in which each word was used, make educated guesses to the possible meanings depending on the speaker's and listener's actions, compare with other times the same word is used, interpolate the meanings of connected words, and build a table of each word's probable meaning. This is the way we know their words for "Yes" and "Water", words that likely are greetings, and how we know that sentences with a "-", "=" or "o" at the end are declarative, interrogative and exclamatory, respectively.

The individual letters are relatively unimportant, it's their combination making recognizably words that counts.

I think this is unnecessarily harsh. Figuring out the mechanics of a written language is not wasted time, as we will never hear it spoken at least we will be able to write it, and having that access to the characters will help understand the word constructions and modifiers. Let those who want to play with the mechanics do so, and others can focus on figuring out meaning to character constructions.

It is possible that a spoken form of Beanish could be created by assigning (heretic) English letters to the vowels and consonants. This idea is not original to me, it comes from an H. Beam Piper story.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ChronosDragon » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:52 am UTC

trolleypup wrote:It is possible that a spoken form of Beanish could be created by assigning (heretic) English letters to the vowels and consonants. This idea is not original to me, it comes from an H. Beam Piper story.


Perhaps, rather than english letters, english phonemes. It'll depend on how many letters/diacritics there end up actually being, and multiple phonemes may have to end up being assigned to the same letter/diacritic (à la english vowels) but ambiguous letters to ambiguous letters seems to present too much ambiguity.
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Re: Beacon Beta, Papal Decree

Postby pelrigg » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:54 am UTC

Chinchokmataa wrote:
pelrigg wrote:I hope someone's helping Chinchokmataa out on this. Xe introduced xerself as a linguist in xer first OTT post. I welcomed xer and gave directions to the Wiki and to the first NP with Beanie Talk (just happened to be my ONG on top of it :roll: :oops: ), approximately two dips ago. The biggest thing is, I'm not sure if anyone else noticed xer. (Perhaps because it wasn't a firstpost that bumped a Page Pope?)


It's fine! I figured it out! And I might just make that table myself.
And I'm feeling plenty of recognition, thanks.

SinusPi wrote:Time for some VERY late night analysis!

Spoiler:
Image

I wrote out all known roots and "vowels".

Apparently we have 4 to 5 vowels - a convex arc [Xʾ], a concave arc [Xʿ], arc below [X̯ ] and a dot above [Ẋ].
Also, 22 roots so far.

This COULD, barely, map to a regular alphabet, with its 5 vowels and 21 consonants.


Pretty cool, this is what I was just looking at.
However, I don't think it is fair to ignore ".", "?", and "!" in the analysis, as I suspect they also represent vowels. Definitely not weird for a language to have more than 5 vowels!
(example: The English alphabet uses 5 vowel letters, but those actually represent about 10~14 different distinct vowel sounds, though you are right that most languages have only 5 vowel sounds)
But yeah, I like the bases=consonants and diacritics=vowels interpretation. The numbers seem to look nice anyway.
Davidy wrote:
Spoiler:
Your analysis is interesting and represents a lot of time and effort, but what is the end result to be? In the end, you'll have the Beanish alphabet but no clue to the words' meanings in which the letters are found, and no clue to how they're pronounced. It's like reading a Russian text and listing out the Cyrilic alphabet. You'd still not know what each word means.

The only real way to decode the language is to examine the context in which each word was used, make educated guesses to the possible meanings depending on the speaker's and listener's actions, compare with other times the same word is used, interpolate the meanings of connected words, and build a table of each word's probable meaning. This is the way we know their words for "Yes" and "Water", words that likely are greetings, and how we know that sentences with a "-", "=" or "o" at the end are declarative, interrogative and exclamatory, respectively.

The individual letters are relatively unimportant, it's their combination making recognizably words that counts.


The end result will be that it'll be awesome :D
But more then that we can find out:
-Something about the way Randal created the language
-If it is just a modern language written in a weird system (I'm personally holding out on the possibility that it is some sort of "futurized" English)

And also, I don't think we should limit ourselves to just trying to seek the knowledge that is "useful." Why can't we know all of the things?


It's nice to hear that you're finding what you need. (Even if sometimes you have to make it yourself.) About my earlier snark, I've noticed sometimes that some new posters get over looked, while others get loads of attention. I just felt you were being ignored.
Again, velkommen, hope you have a good time here, and I'd like to find out what you can make of Beanish.
Would it be possible to come up with a pronunciation guide just from the writing? Or is that impossible?
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby pelrigg » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:01 am UTC

Safest place to put the bags-ONg

Image

Edit
Now off to dinner for Megball and Dean Jeri.....

And coma for me, I've caused enough headaches for one dip
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby wizpretz » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:12 am UTC

[off-topic]
A question for the programmers among you: When/where/how did you get your start in programming? I am looking into learning programming and I'd like to hear your advice. I've read some of the thread on this topic here in the xkcd fora but I'm still not quite sure what to learn or how to learn it and I'd probably give more weight to what you guys say (even if I didn't mean to). You can point me to tutorials, other forums, or just give general advice if you'd like. Thanks in advance.
[/off-topic]

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Re: Beacon Beta, Papal Decree

Postby Chinchokmataa » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:13 am UTC

pelrigg wrote:Would it be possible to come up with a pronunciation guide just from the writing? Or is that impossible?


It depends, but the answer is "probably no"

Possibly, after looking at the distributions of the letters, I might be able to give a decent guess. For example, there are several sounds in English that can only appear in certain places in a word. "h" can only appear at the beginning or middle of a word (we have "happy" and "ahead" but in words like "Sarah", there is no actual pronounced "h"). There is also the "ng" sound, which appears at the end ("sing") or in the middle ("finger") but never at the beginning of a word ("ngarm" is not a possible English word). These are both really common rules for these sounds cross-linguistically, and if I find a similar pattern in the data, then just maybe we could say that that symbol represents this sound.

However, that it hard to establish for many other sounds. For example "p", "t", and "k" all pattern extremely similarly in many languages, and as such it might be hard to distinguish them from writing alone.

Hopefully, Great Lord Almighty Randal will be gracious enough to give a hint.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby BytEfLUSh » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:18 am UTC

Prediction: I am so gonna think about why was I ever born, tomorrow. Oftopic, but I will get very sick, I think so. Cheers, and I hope I will catchup soon after all this! :D
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby capnbuckle » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:19 am UTC

ChronosDragon wrote:
trolleypup wrote:It is possible that a spoken form of Beanish could be created by assigning (heretic) English letters to the vowels and consonants. This idea is not original to me, it comes from an H. Beam Piper story.


Perhaps, rather than english letters, english phonemes. It'll depend on how many letters/diacritics there end up actually being, and multiple phonemes may have to end up being assigned to the same letter/diacritic (à la english vowels) but ambiguous letters to ambiguous letters seems to present too much ambiguity.


I was thinking that phonemes might be a possibility, as well. It would appear that sometime in the prior 11,000 years, a great deal of knowledge was lost...and it wouldn't be a stretch to imagine that written language was among those casualties. Thus, GLR would be free to devise any new encoding system for spoken language that pleases Him.

Apologies if someone has already pointed this out...I just can't blitz the way the rest of you do...but Beanish and all of the other languages wouldn't have materialized out of nowhere. They would most likely have evolved from the predominant languages of today. So even if there isn't a 1-to-1 transliteration with one of today's modern languages, one would expect the basic grammatical forms to be similar, would they not? I will grant, of course, that 11,000 years is a long time for a language to evolve...particularly one freed from the constraints of a written record for at least part of the intervening years.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby jjjdavidson » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:24 am UTC

Blindposting because I've got to get some coma time in, but I really want to get these graphs out.

Post rate by time of day for the sixteen users who've given me permission to graph their data (and for me). User by user, these graphs show how a user's post rate varies from average throughout the hours of the day. I've added my own comments for each graph. PNG versions for the SVG-handicapped.

(If I've got your gender wrong, please let me know; I'm working partly from memory and vague impression on that.)

wizpretz wrote:[off-topic]
A question for the programmers among you: When/where/how did you get your start in programming? I am looking into learning programming and I'd like to hear your advice. I've read some of the thread on this topic here in the xkcd fora but I'm still not quite sure what to learn or how to learn it and I'd probably give more weight to what you guys say (even if I didn't mean to). You can point me to tutorials, other forums, or just give general advice if you'd like. Thanks in advance.
[/off-topic]

In 1978, when I graduated from high school, my parents gave me a Texas Instruments TI-58 programmable calculator. I spent the whole summer playing with it, and when I went off to college I was foolish enough to change my major from math to comp sci. I later came to my senses and changed it back, but I'd already learned enough programming that it seemed easiest to get a programming job after I graduated. Big mistake. High competition, low job satisfaction ─ everything you write is obsolete before you finish it. (But I really didn't have the chops to be a mathematician; I could only have become a math teacher.)
EDIT: Substitute "users who've given me permission to graph their data"
for "users who've requested their graphs".
Last edited by jjjdavidson on Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:37 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Helpful links: Time Wiki FAQrot-13 / Morse decoders
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Re: Beacon Beta, Papal Decree

Postby capnbuckle » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:26 am UTC

Chinchokmataa wrote:
pelrigg wrote:Would it be possible to come up with a pronunciation guide just from the writing? Or is that impossible?


It depends, but the answer is "probably no"

Possibly, after looking at the distributions of the letters, I might be able to give a decent guess. For example, there are several sounds in English that can only appear in certain places in a word. "h" can only appear at the beginning or middle of a word (we have "happy" and "ahead" but in words like "Sarah", there is no actual pronounced "h"). There is also the "ng" sound, which appears at the end ("sing") or in the middle ("finger") but never at the beginning of a word ("ngarm" is not a possible English word). These are both really common rules for these sounds cross-linguistically, and if I find a similar pattern in the data, then just maybe we could say that that symbol represents this sound.

However, that it hard to establish for many other sounds. For example "p", "t", and "k" all pattern extremely similarly in many languages, and as such it might be hard to distinguish them from writing alone.

Hopefully, Great Lord Almighty Randal will be gracious enough to give a hint.


Also, I seem to remember from studying Latin (many many moons ago) that the only way we are certain about how some words are pronounced comes from the mistakes...particularly misspellings...that writers made at the time. I would imagine you would need a much larger sample size than we are likely to get from the OTC to be able to come up with those sorts of relationships...

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On programming.

Postby AluisioASG » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:33 am UTC

wizpretz wrote:A question for the programmers among you: When/where/how did you get your start in programming? I am looking into learning programming and I'd like to hear your advice. I've read some of the thread on this topic here in the xkcd fora but I'm still not quite sure what to learn or how to learn it and I'd probably give more weight to what you guys say (even if I didn't mean to). You can point me to tutorials, other forums, or just give general advice if you'd like. Thanks in advance.

Well, I started with C. Most people apparently advise against going that path, and I'm going to recommend you the same, unless you want to become Dr. William Bell :wink:.
I'd suggest starting with Python. At first, you may want to skip chapter 2.2. Chapter 3 is where the fun begins.

Oh, and this:
Eric Steven Raymond wrote:To follow the path:
look to the master,
follow the master,
walk with the master,
see through the master,
become the master.
Selecting new quote…
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby BlueCrab » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:40 am UTC

For a few newpix todip I was less than 20 newpages behind... :|
I'm off the bellinis for a while, what shall I have now? Mmm, hot fudge sauce. :D

Neil_Boekend wrote: <snip>...The beanies are building the castle, under the command of a misguided scientist that is trying to revive his long dead wife. Queball will be forced to build the castle and the equipment. Megan will be imprisoned but not harmed. She'll be treated well, but she won't be allowed to leave the castle. She'll live in a guilded cage.<snip>
A guilded cage, where all the guards have reached at least journeyman status? I've got to use that sometime, especially as it would be wonderfully confusing if spoken aloud. :P


Uni-diversity: charlie_grumbles, taixzo
Spoiler:
charlie_grumbles wrote:
BlueCrab wrote:
taixzo wrote:<snip>"Infinitely long" does not mean "contains every possibility". For example, the number 0.121121112111121111121111112... does not repeat, but doesn't contain every combination of numbers; it doesn't even contain a 3.
Thank you! Once again an otter has helped me fix a glitch in my worldview. The idea that an infinite universe would contain various obnoxious scenarios has always really bothered me. The possibility for horrors still exist, of course, but they're not guaranteed by the very definition of the universe.

Let me put on my mathematicians hat again and give you a bit more enlightenment. Taixzo's number is infinite and not repeating, but it does have a regular pattern. However, an infinite string of random digits would contain any sequence of any length that you would care to choose. This is due to (one version of) the "law of large numbers" which says, more or less, that any thing that can happen will happen if given enough chances to happen. An infinite string of rolls of a fair die, for example will contain a sequence of 1000 sixes, or 10000, or any given value. Infinity is strange stuff.

Moreover your chosen "event" will occur an infinite number of times. Go figure.

Here is the math. Your event has an incredibly small probability of occurrence. Call it p. p is very small. So 1/p is large. In approximately 1/p rolls of the die you would expect it to happen approximately once. In a few multiples of 1/p you would almost certainly expect it to occur once at least. But in an infinite sequence you have an infinite number of those also. Got it?
Drat. Yes, I see, when we talk about an infinite universe we mean the ‘given enough chances’ definition, not the limited (uni-directional?) one that taixzo* used.
Here's the problem I have with the concept of an infinite universe, and my thought is that the problem is purely a semantic/logical one: some people argue that if the universe is truly infinite (if any thing that can happen will happen) then impossible things must happen. These impossible things include the universe not being infinite which, they claim, means the universe can not be infinite to begin with. To me, the argument makes no sense: impossibilities are denied by the very definition ‘anything that can happen’, and the phrase ‘impossible things must happen’ is semantically null, because by definition impossible things cannot happen.
Are my conclusions correct, at least for the conditions as stated? I did see where you qualified with ‘one version of’, and I know that there are many mathematical concepts which are difficult to explain non-mathematically; if a straight ‘yes’ or ‘no’ will answer my question, feel free to leave it at that. :D

*Just realized I've probably been spelling your name wrong this whole time, taixzo! I'm sorry :oops:



xpatiate (Warning and pre-emptive apology: spoiler contains a lot of fan-girlish squeeing.)
Spoiler:
xpatiate wrote:Here's one for you sford - I learned about "moss piglets" today. Also known as "water bears". Sounds cute right?

Image

Actually this one does look kind of cuddly...
Image
OMFGLR, I LOVE tardigrades! Do you really not think that's cute?! I love how, in the electron-microscope pictures, they look like they're pumped up just a leeeetle too much, like they might spring a leak and deflate at any moment. (I think they might actually be aliens wearing tiny little survival/stasis suits - that would explain the over-inflated look, and their survival abilities!) I also love how fake they look in the E-M pictures. The thing in the snout looks like a spray-nozzle, the grabby-claws look like tiny stems, and their surface looks like clay! And look at the little guy waving his tiny limbs around, just like a baby... Gosh, these guys are adorable, almost as good as chameleons. :D


And on that note, molpy down.
image.jpg
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby buffygirl » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:55 am UTC

Regarding vocal samples -- I agree that maybe we should sort of start over and standardize the samples in some way, (I don't remember who suggested it, or if that's even what they meant). For example, we could come up with a standard "script" (from the OTC, of course) to be read, along with some direction re: moods or tones to try (such as one in wonderment, one spunky, and one in a tone/mood-of-choice). Then these can be posted on the wikia "anonymously" by some generous volunteer willing to gather and post them. Then we could take a poll.

I keep worrying about hurt feelings if someone isn't "picked," so I just wanted to offer this thought: The way I see it, we are each offering our voices to the forum and taking in suggestions to try to create a sound that fulfills the need. It's not a matter of whose voice is better, but whose vocal instrument has the sought-after sound.

:)

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ggh » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:57 am UTC

jjjdavidson wrote:Blindposting because I've got to get some coma time in, but I really want to get these graphs out.

Post rate by time of day for the sixteen users who've requested their graphs (and for me). User by user, these graphs show how a user's post rate varies from average throughout the hours of the day. I've added my own comments for each graph. PNG versions for the SVG-handicapped.

Thank you so much jjjdavidson! And you are right, I am not in the US, but in New Zealand, 8 hours behind (and a day ahead) of RST. I'm actually a little surprised that it's so apparent though: with the little one, I thought maybe I'd be more random. In my case, my weekend activity is not necessarily that I have more time to Time then, but because I don't like to blind post and that's when the OTT generally let's me catch up... barely.

Neat stuff, all of it! I really enjoyed reading your analysis of us all. :)
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby lmjb1964 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:00 am UTC

This has been a brutal ketchup. I'm tried just from all the reading! Fortunately, most of what I was going to say has been ninja'd, so this isn't as seaish as it was going to be.

SinusPi wrote:I think we're (mostly) taking the "transpires" too literally. To live, to transpire, to happen, to exist, to occur - all these verbs have a common "something/somebody is somewhere for a time" meaning. We must prepare for Hairdo to commit even worse verbal atrocities, of which this might yet prove but the iceberg's pocket money.

Huh? Never heard that metaphor!
BTW, thank you for all the amazing work you've done with the transliteration.

jovialbard wrote:eta: yes I know that's not really what deja vu is. On a side note, has anyone here not experienced deja vu? My wife never has, and every time I tell her I have deja vu she says "but this hasn't ever happened before" and I try to explain that that's the point but she doesn't get it because she hasn't experienced it...

I've never heard of someone never experiencing deja vu. Wait, haven't we had this discussion before?

jovialbard wrote:Perhaps she's an incredibly talented throat singer and can vocalize multiple words simultaneously by injecting different consonants in line with the various pitch changes of her discrete overtones. Actually, has anyone ever heard (of) a female throat singer? I feel like every throat singer I've seen is male. I would assume that's simply because it comes from cultures that are traditionally sexist, but I suppose it's also conceivable that it could be more difficult or less common for women to be capable of vocalizing in that way, what with the statistical difference in voices between men and women. Actually, I've tried throat singing in falsetto, and while it's possible to create multiple notes it doesn't sound nearly the same as a bass throat singing. Perhaps a very low alto could manage it...

Interesting. I know some guys who can throat sing, but no women. I've tried it with no success.

rvloon wrote:Ok, here's my contribution for whatever you want me to read out loud.

rvloon-sample.mp3


As for the band, I am a base/baritone. I was going with the dialogue page from the Wiki, but I mixed up some of the Megan/Cueball lines. Anyway, it gives an indication. I could do it in silly voices too :-)

I love your voice and your accent. Maybe a little deep for Cueball, though. :)

HES wrote:I have a bad feeling this whole infinity thing can be traced back to a casual reference of mine.
Spoiler:
This would be the thirdabc distraction I am responsible for... cease and desist! :evil:
aDouble posting, because of this editong
bLego/Lego's
cThis infinity thing. Though its a 5 day old post, I think it got picked up in someones ketchup

Aha! So you're to blame! you get a degree, and think you can come back and break the OTT. Hmph. :P

Pfhorrest wrote:I think this raises an interesting question for your religion here.

Did the Creator have every step of the OTC planned out from the start, or is he allowing his characters free will and their world some randomness (i.e. making shit up as he goes along)?

The $64,000 question! And I think it's been asked 64,000 times. But I fear we will never know the answer...

AluisioASG wrote:And now, cakes again!
snippety snippety

You are an evil little dragon!

AnotherKevin wrote:
moody7277 wrote:Attend to matters = give you dinner and a comfy place to sleep for the night?


Or file their survey reports, perhaps.
ETA: Ninja'd by ChronosDragon.

Or to fire up the roasting pit.

BytEfLUSh wrote:As I notice that this may be a big thing, let me just re-iterate it:
BytEfLUSh wrote:Also notice the vertical "filled" vs horizontal "heavy".

I don't think it's "FILLED." It looks like the word ends with "..TED."

I love how exciting times in the OTC bring out new members. Some of these firstposts have been bumped already, but welcome to all!

superluminal wrote:I finally had to delurk to say this:

What if Cuegan are just tourists and they don't know the local language? After all, many tourists like beaches and sandcastles... They might have been on the same beach before, but never wandered this far from their hotel.

(I liked this hypothesis more before Hairdo started talking...)


neopifex wrote:Hi folks, I just registered but I've been following this thread for quite some time. I decided to create an account because...

Does anyone else think Translatrix's (my name for Long Hair Person) arm position in frame 2875 looks like she's pantomiming eating? Perhaps she's telling the Beanies to take Megball to get some food.

Tangent: How do you put images in your posts? It keeps telling me my post is spam. :(
(That question has been answered already for him/her, I think, but the magic number is 5 posts before you can upload an image.)

Gedeon wrote:I think it is

"They understand nothing, so (thus) they will tend to matters".

Also, hi! :)


apsmith wrote:A few thoughts (long-time lurker here, I admit I haven't read everything!):

* The lack of any use of names (at least by Cuegan - the Beanies may have used names for one another) suggests a profound difference in culture from modern humans - maybe they are simply accustomed to very small communities where pronouns or simply proximity suffice? In my experience the first thing everybody learns in a foreign language (admittedly classroom settings) is how to address people by their names, yet that didn't happen at all in the Cuegan/Beanie encounter. Why?

* There has been no sign that Cuegan can read or write. When they saw the marks on the Baobab (which we weren't shown?) they wondered what it meant and said it didn't look familiar. The Beanie book with the map/triangulation didn't seem to have any written language, at least the part we were shown. Learning the written form of a foreign language can help a lot with distinguishing words that sound similar but have different spellings (and meanings). Has writing been lost? And yet the Beanies seem to be pretty sophisticated...


tchemgrrl wrote:
edo wrote:Mscha: Respires!


I think "respires" makes total sense, as an English speaker with enough knowledge of romance languages to either sound erudite or nonsensical. I know the long latinate words because they're usually the same in English, except when they're not. (Don't get embarrassed in Spain, that's for sure.) She also may have learned Cueganish in some other part of the world, or secondhand from a Beanish teacher with a terrible accent.

It seems like she knows enough of the similarities between the languages to know some possible words that overlay correctly, even if the context is not quite appropriate. Any bodies left in the desert don't respire much.

(Hi OTT-ers. Been following along off and on since about page 10 and this frame got me out of lurker-dom.)


cshep70 wrote:Been watching the OTC since newpix 8 or so, the OTT since wondering if some astronomers could tell us when/where Cuegan were based on the night sky. I registered today to say (and I've got no ketchup, so forgive me if this has been covered):

This is starting to seem like the OTT is driving the OTC.

Yep, that has been pronounced and refuted many times. :D

And I just want to say that people are getting a little testy. Just because BlitzGirl isn't here to brandish her flame retardant doesn't mean we can all be grumpy. Maybe everyone suffering from sleep deprivation because they've been avoiding coma so they don't miss anything. C'mon everyone, group hug! Now go get some sleep!
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Postby Eternal Density » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:00 am UTC

OgNnGo
Image

jjjdavidson, thanks for the graphs!
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby slinches » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:01 am UTC

What is Rosetta gettONG?
Spoiler:
Image

Ninja'd, but the question stands.

Wait ... maybe it's her stone.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby b2bomberkrh » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:03 am UTC

A book or a map is what I'm going to guess. Both seem equally likely, I guess I'll go with a map.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ChronosDragon » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:10 am UTC

jjjdavidson wrote:Blindposting because I've got to get some coma time in, but I really want to get these graphs out.

Post rate by time of day for the sixteen users who've requested their graphs (and for me). User by user, these graphs show how a user's post rate varies from average throughout the hours of the day. I've added my own comments for each graph. PNG versions for the SVG-handicapped.

(If I've got your gender wrong, please let me know; I'm working partly from memory and vague impression on that.)


Ooh, how enlightening! You're right, I have a rather solid sleep schedule that I intend to keep :P Interesting that my peak posting times are different on weekends, but then I've been in school in one form or another for 60% of the OTC's duration, so it only makes sense.

It's also interesting how some users seem to never sleep...
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby lmjb1964 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:14 am UTC

buffygirl wrote:Regarding vocal samples -- I agree that maybe we should sort of start over and standardize the samples in some way, (I don't remember who suggested it, or if that's even what they meant). For example, we could come up with a standard "script" (from the OTC, of course) to be read, along with some direction re: moods or tones to try (such as one in wonderment, one spunky, and one in a tone/mood-of-choice). Then these can be posted on the wikia "anonymously" by some generous volunteer willing to gather and post them. Then we could take a poll.

I keep worrying about hurt feelings if someone isn't "picked," so I just wanted to offer this thought: The way I see it, we are each offering our voices to the forum and taking in suggestions to try to create a sound that fulfills the need. It's not a matter of whose voice is better, but whose vocal instrument has the sought-after sound.

:)

I agree that it would be good to have a "script," post them all anonymously and have people vote. I too worry about hurt feelings, especially since I was a wee bit bummed that so few people commented on mine. :) (And a few people have, now, with constructive comments.) But I wasn't really upset, because I know that people are waiting to hear the voice that fits best with what they hear in their heads. So, maybe we can couch the voting in those terms: "Select the voice that best fits your idea of what Megan or Cueball sound like." Or something like that.

BTW, I liked your version 2 better. :)
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Moose Anus » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:16 am UTC

She's going to put on a beard.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby KeonSkyfire » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:19 am UTC

(So, first post, and semi-blindpost (Only read the past 5 or so pages...))

Has there been any speculation to what Rosetta's status is? She lives in a castle so it's sensible to assume she is at the least a noble or relative of one. This would suggest Beanies are a feudal society, or that they are under some sort of threat, so that they could require a castle at some point. (Or they just enjoy building sand castles but they have better construction techniques.)

Basically, it seems like Rosetta can command the other Beanies, and she lives in a castle, I'm going to guess she's some kind of vassal to a larger Beanie Monarch.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Exodies » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:41 am UTC

taixzo wrote:My prediction for the OTC: Beanie teaches Cueball the word for whatever that is. Then, Megan gets up. Cueball says something to her to the effect of "I've been learning their language; ImageImageImageImage means water."

{P1059}
And Megan replies "That's very good, Cue".
And mutters "5 chirping newpix and he learns one word. Molpychirping dimwit."
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Eliram » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:46 am UTC

edo wrote:Finished my google translate check:

Nothing fits great. Languages with the same root are:
Hebrew
[snip]

As a native Hebrew speaker, I do find some beanish letters and even words a little familiar, especially with Hebrew script alphabet, but nothing really meaningful.
Water in Hebrew are pronounced mAyim
Sea is pronounced Yam
These words are close, but note that the shorter word means sea while in beanish it's the other way around.
It's about time.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Arky » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:50 am UTC

My bet is that Hairdo is fetching the English-Beanish dictionary which she learned English from.

Either that or she's pushing the secret button in the bookshelf which drops a cage on people who stand in front of her desk.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Exodies » Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:56 am UTC

mscha wrote:TalkONG Beanon
Image

Transcription:
Cueball wrote:Voter
Beanie wrote:No, Water

{P1059}
When I try to repeat foreign words, I tend to get the end wrong, rather than the beginning. So not "voter" but "warten" for example. So I think the alien tongue is written left to right as the correction to Cue's pronunciation is on the right side of the word.
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Too comfortable, in fact.

Postby Eternal Density » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:06 am UTC

Latent22 wrote:Stack of BookONGs
Spoiler:
Image
Or a really big beard.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby a_s_h_e_n » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:08 am UTC

PLEASE be English-Beanish dictionaries; perhaps Beanish is far more complex than we know and it takes that many books OR they enjoy large fonts
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby 42 guests » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:09 am UTC

I was hoping for a rancor molpy...

rancor2.gif
rancor2.gif (9.84 KiB) Viewed 11329 times


Edit: Megan needs a stick.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ChronosDragon » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:29 am UTC

42 guests wrote:I was hoping for a rancor molpy...

rancor2.gif


Edit: Megan needs a stick.


Oh, that's why I thought "beardo" sounded familiar (and no, I wasn't thinking of this thing. There's a bounty hunter in star wars called Greedo. Which isn't actually that similar to beardo, but it's close enough that my mind made the jump, apparently. Well, it's ALL related, and your image fills the gap nicely.

On that note, I must coma. Raptor down!

Image
Image


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