So there is this guy who can run the fastest (The Flash)

[maybeagnostic]

So that... happened.

Spoiler:

I don't understand the significance of the ring or why it seemed to control the yellow suit or even change its color. It looks a lot like Barry's suit but if it is capable of changing colors and being remote controlled (or acting independenly?) at Flash speeds then the similarity between the suits must be only superficial. Anyway, it really looked like there was someone in the suit during the fights so I can't see how Wells could have pulled it off by himself. But are we meant to take it that this was all a ploy by Wells to take the device without suspicion falling on him?

I am starting to think Eddie is the most sympathetic character in the show. He keeps being set up as Barry's opponent in all sorts of things but he's actually a pretty nice guy, risks his carrier to go after a clearly dangerous vigilante (which seems entirely reasonable and I wonder why no one else is doing it) and he's being lied to by his partner for no good reason. I hope they don't make him turn evil when he eventually uncovers Barry's identity.

[pkcommando]

Spoiler:

Though he does seem to be somewhat confused.

Well, that will happen

Spoiler:

when there are two people in your head

Spoiler:

I'm hoping we get to see more of his powers, but I'm worried about what a TV budget (especially the CW) will give us. If all we're going to get is Human Torch, DC Edition - forget it. At least Victor Garber has been cast as Stein, so that should be cool.

[clockworkmonk]

so I just watched the Man in Yellow and had a thought

Spoiler:

Harrison Wells could be Barry Allen from the future, or at least a future. The ring he had at the end is the same as the ring the Flash uses to keep his costume in. He came back to make sure that a different future arose. Such a thing is not unheard of in Flash stories.

Also, super excited that they commited to Firestorm, not just Ronnie Raymond.

[SecondTalon]

Spoilers based on the comics:

Spoiler:

Interesting! I just read an article about tonight's episode. There were actually two characters to have been called the Reverse Flash, Thawne and a guy called Hunter Zoloman. It seems this second guy is more in line with Wells' characterisation, which may indicate that he is a Reverse Flash, but not the one responsible for Nora's death. Then again, he may just be a composite character of both Thawne and Zoloman.

They are currently up to Five. But Two only appeared in the last decade, and one of those in the last year or two. Historically, though... 3

Spoiler:

Zoloman, Thawne (which started the Thawne-Allen feud) and The Rival. Last few times The Rival was seen, it was more of a possessing force than coporal entity. Still annoyed they never resolved that in the comics...Max Mercury is a good character.

[CannedCourage]

Spoilers based on the comics:

Spoiler:

Interesting! I just read an article about tonight's episode. There were actually two characters to have been called the Reverse Flash, Thawne and a guy called Hunter Zoloman. It seems this second guy is more in line with Wells' characterisation, which may indicate that he is a Reverse Flash, but not the one responsible for Nora's death. Then again, he may just be a composite character of both Thawne and Zoloman.

They are currently up to Five. But Two only appeared in the last decade, and one of those in the last year or two. Historically, though... 3

Spoiler:

Zoloman, Thawne (which started the Thawne-Allen feud) and The Rival. Last few times The Rival was seen, it was more of a possessing force than coporal entity. Still annoyed they never resolved that in the comics...Max Mercury is a good character.

Given his seeing himself as a protector/trainer/worthy adversary, his motivations seem to line up with what I read about

Spoiler:

Zoloman

Yet, in the comics he wasn't a time traveller? Granted, it was only implied on the show. And the business with Eddie?

[SecondTalon]

In the comics, everyone with access to the Speed Force has the potential to be a time traveler. Some do it more than others. And that's before we talk about the Cosmic Treadmill. I am not making that up.

[Zcorp]

I hold hope, but doubt, that we could get a story with even a bit of the convolution and thoughtfulness of Primer.

[clockworkmonk]

So the last few episodes have been pretty great.

Spoiler:

Firestorm has been fantastic, Clancy Brown was wonderful, and the teaser with Gorilla Grodd made me squee.

Oh, and Time Travel confirmed as a big plot point.

[Angua]

Here's the main thing that has been bugging me about this show:

Spoiler:

Who is looking after all the meta-humans in the prison? They've got the gas guy in an airtight cell, peek-a-boo can't see outside her cell, and there doesn't seem to be a toilet or a bedroom in any of these cells, or a way to get food in without it being a big ordeal every time.

Otherwise, totally agree about the last couple of episodes.

Spoiler:

I'm sad that firestorm has turned out so powerful that we now have to put him on a bus perpetually, with him only turning up for the big stuff.

Also, won't the government just now think that the Flash kidnapped the General?

[CannedCourage]

Holy hardcore hill-midgets! :O

Spoiler:

Wells IS Eobard Thawne! The reason he's helping Barry is to steal his speed and shiz, or something, and return to his time.

Spoiler:

Wells kills Cisco! Even in spite of what will probably be a timeline reset, that scene was amazing. Carlos Valdes and Tom Cavanagh nailed it.

[Angua]

Wow the month wait was worth it.

Spoiler:

CIIIIISSSSSSCCCCCOOOOOO!!!!!

please tell me that Caitlin will realise he's evil. Though you're probably right about the timeline reset given Iris also found out.

[ArgonV]

I don't get why they didn't first air this episode, then took a month break.

[Angua]

A good episode, though:

Spoiler:

Barry is easily fast enough to just take away people's guns. He doesn't need to threaten the sister.

It's a shame that they didn't realise that the new timeline saved Cisco's life, but at least Barry knows Wells is up to something now.

[mathmannix]

Spoiler:

It's a shame that they didn't realise that the new timeline saved Cisco's life, but at least Barry knows Wells is up to something now.

Meh. I felt like they wasted the "relive the day" opportunity by not making the two episodes more parallel, more connected. It really was a different episode... different bad guy (Snart wasn't mentioned the first time through, didn't he still try to take over the crime syndicate in that timeline?), different side stories (I don't remember any mention of Cisco's brother or the birthday party from the first episode; if there was it was just in passing?). And why didn't Cisco start stumbling onto the Professor's secrets in this timeline? Was it just because Barry didn't mention the reporter's investigation, because it looked to me like he was already getting suspicious and that just tipped the scales in the first timeline. Oh, and is there a reason that Reverse Flash wouldn't have killed the reporter the first time through, because it looked to me like nobody mentioned him out loud in front of the professor in this episode - in fact, they talked about it more in the first timeline. At the very least, I think they should have had Caitlyn mention a little bit more to Barry on the phone the first time through, so that there would be SOMETHING carried over in continuity to the new pass through, but really I hate episodes of TV shows (especially the ones in Star Trek Voyager and Smallville) where everything is reset and nothing plotwise is affected by the first timeline ever having existed. Why show it to us, then? Just as a "What If"?

That brings me to my second point: there are two ways to do time travel into the past in media. One, which I prefer, is that there is a second copy of you. This one, which was also used in the original Star Trek (such as in "Tomorrow is Yesterday", although Star Trek as a whole uses several different theories of time travel), has you replace your past self, but it has always seemed inconsistent to me, even when not used consistently. Why don't you disappear if you go back before you are born? More to the point of this series, why would Barry see himself running next to himself briefly in this and the previous episode, and why would there be a second Flash at Nora's death in the 80's? Wouldn't adult Barry Flash just "leap" into his younger body, possibly without powers?

I liked the first episode of the two better, but it set up expectations for me of a much better resolution. On the other hand, I am totally psyched about [extra spoiler!]Mark Hamill reprising his role (1990-91 Flash series, DCAU) in the "Next Episode..."

[Angua]

Spoiler:

They did mention about the birthday party - Cisco ended up saying no to work on the Dr Wells thing.

I think the reporter never got a chance to talk to Iris properly, so Iris didn't know to talk to Caitlin and co. I wouldn't be surprised if Wells just had longer to have whatever computery notification spy system he's got set up to let him know that the reporter was asking around about him.

Also, given Barry told the reporter that he was wrong, maybe he had second thoughts about bringing Iris into the loop because she'd tip off Barry who'd tip off Wells.

[mathmannix]

Spoiler:

Ok. So do we have any theories as to what Wells' goal is now? I mean, he told Cisco that he was trying to kill Barry, not Nora. I don't know if he meant young Barry or current Barry (I assume young Barry, but I'm not sure), but either way, why not just kill him? What does he have to gain by helping Barry become the Flash?

[CannedCourage]

Mystery solved then!

Spoiler:

Happy to see Eddie protest keeping Iris in the dark. The character may actually get some use this season.

[speising]

Mystery solved then!

Spoiler:

Happy to see Eddie protest keeping Iris in the dark. The character may actually get some use this season.

Ha, somewhat prophetic.
I just binged the whole season. Unfortunately, it goes down the usual

Spoiler:

time travel drain. They just can't seem to do that without massive inconsistencies.

Also, i'm mainly pissed by the little things, like people always taking into lit up phones. Whats up with that? Real smartphones don't work that way!
And Caitlin stupidly asking "what's a

Spoiler:

singularity?

" She's working at S.T.A.R Labs, for heaven's sake. Why didn't they give that line to Joe?

In all, i really liked the series, though. Fast paced (fittingly) and funny, and the actors actually show emotions, in contrast to stonefaced Arrow and botox victim Laurel.

[rmsgrey]

The main problem with time travel on TV shows is that, while the actual shooting order of individual scenes, and even individual episodes, is often a bit timey-wimey, it's not actually possible to go back and add the right scene into one of last year's episodes to support this year's plot - you need to successfully anticipate what you're going to want to have happened long before it would normally come up on the planning schedule...

Babylon 5 managed to pull it off with an isolated storyline that spanned three episodes - a standalone in one season and a two-parter two years later - but even there, you can see where some joins were papered over in order to fit changes to the grand plan that had arisen in the interim. And B5 was pretty much a super-sized mini-series rather than an ongoing serial - it had, and mostly followed, a 5-year plan going in.

Anyway, no matter how good your advance-planning is, any show with lots of short-range time-travel that abides by the Novikov self-consistency principle will sooner or later want to go beyond the initial planning - at which point the first wave of episodes will cease to be interactive - you stop being able to have had things happen in them to support your current plans...

[SecondTalon]

Spoiler:

Ok. So do we have any theories as to what Wells' goal is now? I mean, he told Cisco that he was trying to kill Barry, not Nora. I don't know if he meant young Barry or current Barry (I assume young Barry, but I'm not sure), but either way, why not just kill him? What does he have to gain by helping Barry become the Flash?

I've not seen everything, as Hulu is dumb.

Spoiler:

my assumption is he's going to use Barry to try and jumpstart his reconnection to the Speed Force.

[Zohar]

We ran out of DC animated universe series to watch on Netflix (mostly) so we decided to watch The Flash and I'm actually really enjoying it. We're almoooooost done with season 1 (just finished watching e20 I believe) and it's pretty great. Ridiculous science and heroic shenanigans, but generally well-done character interactions? That's pretty cool.

Re: Prison conditions

Spoiler:

I also wondered about that. The only thing I can think of is the cells we see the prisoners in might be kind of like automated car parks, and they have a larger room "in the back" to be in. But yeah, it's pretty fucked up.

I loved the way they built up Wells during the season, and the surrounding cast is pretty awesome too. I'll wait to see the finale and the beginning of S2 before I comment here again.

[AngrySquirrel]

I've been pretty lukewarm to The Flash earlier, but after watching DC's Legends of Tomorrow (which is the greatest "so bad it becomes amazing"-show ever), I felt the need to go back and watch the Flash, if only to see Captain Cold a bit more. And I wasn't all that into it. That is until:
Not massive spoiler, but maybe if you're very strict about spoilers:

Spoiler:

Mark Hamill as the Trickster. Delivering the line; "I am your father". That is some meta-level humor I can get behind.

And now I forgive it all its flaws.

[Zohar]

The Flash is ridiculously fun, I like it a lot. They even do emotional stuff well (sometimes).

[Zohar]

Yey, more speedster villains. Although I'm definitely enjoying that the real villain this season is

Spoiler:

Barry Allen's constant screw-ups.

[Zohar]

The musical Supergirl (and Glee) crossover episode was delightful.

[Angua]

I was kind of disappointed.

There was not enough singing. I wanted the only way to convince [redacted] to [redacted] to be to burst in to song, and both Barry and Kara being all 'not again'.

It was super cute though.

[Zohar]

Yes, I would have liked more singing too. But everything was so cute and adorable, really great. And the original number was fantastic.

[TimelordSimone]

I stopped watching a few episodes into season three, not been feeling it for a while, but I dropped back in solely for the musical episode and it was a lot of fun, very silly, didn't really make sense if you thought about it at all, but I had a good time.
(I am still watching Supergirl but am really behind so the crossover 'previously on' technically gave away a spoiler but also I had called it forever ago so, no big deal.)

[Angua]

Anyone still watching this? Bit annoyed by the last episode (Goldface).

Spoiler:

So, the previous episodes had Cisco falling out with Frost over the fact that he wanted to make a cure being a meta, because Frost felt that they would use it on Caitlin to get rid of her. Cisco obviously pointed out the problems with the metas like the nuclear guy who couldn't touch anyone, etc. Frost finally relented when Caitlin and Cisco agreed that they would only give the cure to poeple who wanted it. Then, the very next episode, Cisco decides he wants to use the cure on Cicada. This will obviously be without his consent. In Goldface, Caitlin/Frost are still working on the cure, no objection given to its intended purpose, and they're now working on how to administer it to Cicada.

I feel like there were some interesting ethics in there which have now just been completely skipped over, and it's kind of bugging me.