Luke Cage
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- Angua
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Luke Cage
Has anyone else started watching Luke Cage yet? I'm just finishing up episode 10 at the moment and it's been pretty excellent imo. I'd be interested to hear what other people think about it though.
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Re: Luke Cage
I'm just finishing Episode 11. I'll be back once I'm done.
For now though, I love it.
For now though, I love it.
- Angua
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Re: Luke Cage
I have finally finished it.
Spoiler:
Jesse wrote:SPOILERS AHOYSpoiler:
Spoiler:
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Re: Luke Cage
I am only a few episodes in but so far I am enjoying it a lot. I feel like its writing quality is incredibly up and down, though, and it feels like its writers do not have enough faith in their own writing ability, or enough faith in their audience, or both. For example, its very opening scene of the series was so fantastic, I thought. It gave so much depth and characterization -- to its neighborhood, to its location, to the characters; for audiences totally unfamiliar with black American culture it contextualized the important social/cultural role its location has in black community; it placed its characters within that community richly and well.
And then later scenes through that episode and the next just kept beating everyone over the head with the exposition hammer like "this place is important to the community! this person is a community pillar! here is why!" and it is like, actually you didn't need to do that, you laid that all out for us in atmosphere so well without needing to sledgehammer it home. And there have been so many things like that where a scene is done with excellent depth and nuance, and then two scenes later the writers will be like IN CASE YOU DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THAT HERE IS A DUMPTRUCK OF EXPOSITION.
and like c'mon just have some faith in either your writing skills or your audience. cuz when it's good it's so good but then at other times I'm just groaning.
Overall though I am loving it a lot so far. The characters are great and I enjoy a superhero show being so unapologetically black.
And then later scenes through that episode and the next just kept beating everyone over the head with the exposition hammer like "this place is important to the community! this person is a community pillar! here is why!" and it is like, actually you didn't need to do that, you laid that all out for us in atmosphere so well without needing to sledgehammer it home. And there have been so many things like that where a scene is done with excellent depth and nuance, and then two scenes later the writers will be like IN CASE YOU DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THAT HERE IS A DUMPTRUCK OF EXPOSITION.
and like c'mon just have some faith in either your writing skills or your audience. cuz when it's good it's so good but then at other times I'm just groaning.
Overall though I am loving it a lot so far. The characters are great and I enjoy a superhero show being so unapologetically black.
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- SlyReaper
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Re: Luke Cage
Just a couple of minutes into the first episode and I'm lost already. A bunch of guys in a barber shop talking about... something? Sports, I think? I can understand maybe 20% of what they're saying. Do you have to be American to understand it? Are we supposed to understand it?
Like "Oakley and new went hard on the pain". "King James is the truth... bronka ball". Wut? What does this mean?!?
Like "Oakley and new went hard on the pain". "King James is the truth... bronka ball". Wut? What does this mean?!?

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- Angua
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Re: Luke Cage
I think most of the sport they talk about is basketball. Though there's definitely baseball at some point.
However, I was not sure. I mainly took it as a group of guys talking about their favourite sports heroes +/- friendly rivalry, and tuned out accordingly. I'm used to not understanding that sort of conversation.
However, I was not sure. I mainly took it as a group of guys talking about their favourite sports heroes +/- friendly rivalry, and tuned out accordingly. I'm used to not understanding that sort of conversation.
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Re: Luke Cage
We're two episodes in (I find it surprising how easily people binge watch these shows, it's a lot harder for me). I definitely feel lost sometimes, especially in the first scene, though that may be because I'm also not American/native English speaker.
I wish there was a bit more explanation what happened between the end of Jessica Jones and the start of this show - it may come, but for now it's kind of confusing. Like, how did we get here from there?
Anyway, I'm enjoying it for now, and I'm curious to see where things go. It seems slightly better paced than the other Netflix superhero shows, but we'll see if that remains true...
I wish there was a bit more explanation what happened between the end of Jessica Jones and the start of this show - it may come, but for now it's kind of confusing. Like, how did we get here from there?
Anyway, I'm enjoying it for now, and I'm curious to see where things go. It seems slightly better paced than the other Netflix superhero shows, but we'll see if that remains true...
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- Angua
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Re: Luke Cage
As far as I remember, Luke just sort of left during Jessica Jones. I guess he went to go live in Harlem and that's where they pick up.
I don't know how true to life it is, but in the netflix mcu shows Hells Kitchen and Harlem seem to be pretty cut off from the rest of new York. The whole thing seems pretty insular in that regard. Which means you don't need much explanation of where we are in relation to Hells Kitchen as the two communities don't really seem to interact.
I don't know how true to life it is, but in the netflix mcu shows Hells Kitchen and Harlem seem to be pretty cut off from the rest of new York. The whole thing seems pretty insular in that regard. Which means you don't need much explanation of where we are in relation to Hells Kitchen as the two communities don't really seem to interact.
Crabtree's bludgeon: “no set of mutually inconsistent observations can exist for which some human intellect cannot conceive a coherent explanation, however complicated”
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Re: Luke Cage
They're about 1.5 hour's walk apart, but obviously very different culturally in the real world. Though I don't think they gave Jessica Jones a placement other than "New York City".
I'm mostly talking about jail stuff mentioned very early on (I assume that will get clarified later).
I'm mostly talking about jail stuff mentioned very early on (I assume that will get clarified later).
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Re: Luke Cage
I'm also two episodes in and I think the jail stuff predates Jessica Jones.
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- Angua
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Re: Luke Cage
I will decline to comment I guess on that bit.
Thoughts about greater implications on the Marvel universe:
Thoughts about Luke Cage halloween costume (not that spoilery):
Thoughts about greater implications on the Marvel universe:
Spoiler:
Thoughts about Luke Cage halloween costume (not that spoilery):
Spoiler:
Crabtree's bludgeon: “no set of mutually inconsistent observations can exist for which some human intellect cannot conceive a coherent explanation, however complicated”
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- The Great Hippo
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Re: Luke Cage
I don't have anywhere near enough knowledge to deconstruct or analyze its themes, but I was struck right away by how directly it seemed to just plunge right into a black-centered narrative. I was expecting it to be sanitized, but it didn't feel that way at all; it felt like it was taking a lot of risks. I suspect that's a good thing? I hope that's a good thing.
Then... Out of no where, we get this clunky exposition: 'You think I wanted this? I was shoved inside of a tank like some sort of exotic fish -- experimented on. Came out with... special abilities.' -- and I was just left super-confused. Did the writers go on break or something? That doesn't sound like something you say to someone who you trust; it doesn't sound like someone you've talked to about this before. It sounds like the intro-trailer for a comic book.
This happened a number of times -- scene with fantastic writing, then, suddenly... bam! Clunky and expository.
Also (spoiler for third episode):
Also (spoiler for episode 6, 7, and 8):
I'm still pushing through some episodes, but -- other than the patches of confusing/clunky writing, I am liking it so far.
Yeah, I kind of got whiplash more than once with how quickly the quality of the writing flipped from amazingly good to just info-dumps. The barber shop scene was fantastic; it gives us a strong sense of who these characters are. Then, the scene in the basement -- with the washing machine -- starts strong, demonstrating Luke's strength (using it to recover a phone-number; our first experience with his powers is him using them privately, with someone he trusts, to overcome a mild inconvenience. The only way I imagine it could have been better is if he stopped to look up the stairs, first, to make sure no one else was peeking). And Pop saying how he loves it when Luke does stuff like that; this is great writing!natraj wrote:And there have been so many things like that where a scene is done with excellent depth and nuance, and then two scenes later the writers will be like IN CASE YOU DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THAT HERE IS A DUMPTRUCK OF EXPOSITION.
Then... Out of no where, we get this clunky exposition: 'You think I wanted this? I was shoved inside of a tank like some sort of exotic fish -- experimented on. Came out with... special abilities.' -- and I was just left super-confused. Did the writers go on break or something? That doesn't sound like something you say to someone who you trust; it doesn't sound like someone you've talked to about this before. It sounds like the intro-trailer for a comic book.
This happened a number of times -- scene with fantastic writing, then, suddenly... bam! Clunky and expository.
Also (spoiler for third episode):
Spoiler:
Also (spoiler for episode 6, 7, and 8):
Spoiler:
I'm still pushing through some episodes, but -- other than the patches of confusing/clunky writing, I am liking it so far.
Re: Luke Cage
SlyReaper wrote:Just a couple of minutes into the first episode and I'm lost already. A bunch of guys in a barber shop talking about... something? Sports, I think? I can understand maybe 20% of what they're saying. Do you have to be American to understand it? Are we supposed to understand it?
Like "Oakley and new went hard on the pain". "King James is the truth... bronka ball". Wut? What does this mean?!?
You don't really need to be able to follow the nuances of sports. That's really just for showing relationships and establishing stuff. As long as you're getting "these folks are friendly, this guy is touchy, this is a social space", you're picking up the important bits.
That said, I haven't watched it all yet either. I'm bad at binge watching, but what I've seen so far has been good.
Re: Luke Cage
Tyndmyr wrote:You don't really need to be able to follow the nuances of sports. That's really just for showing relationships and establishing stuff. As long as you're getting "these folks are friendly, this guy is touchy, this is a social space", you're picking up the important bits.
That's easy enough for an American (and possibly most native English speakers) to figure out - the culture referenced is recognizable, the type of speech is obvious. For people who aren't as familiar, though, it becomes frustrating - we don't know we're not supposed to understand, or that those aren't relevant plot points. It just seems confusing.
Which is fine! It's OK if a show is a bit more challenging to watch, and a show doesn't have to cater to every audience in order to be good.
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Re: Luke Cage
To be fair, I'm an American and I had maybe a vague notion they were talking about sports? I only knew for certain once a character mentioned something about being frustrated with the Knicks, which is a name I recognized as sports-related. I certainly didn't have any idea what they were talking about, but I still managed to interpret the basic thrust of the scene through stuff like facial expressions, tone, physical interactions, etc. Not knowing what they were talking about didn't bother me very much.Zohar wrote:That's easy enough for an American (and possibly most native English speakers) to figure out - the culture referenced is recognizable, the type of speech is obvious. For people who aren't as familiar, though, it becomes frustrating - we don't know we're not supposed to understand, or that those aren't relevant plot points. It just seems confusing.
But your mileage may vary; I think I can understand someone who found that to be frustrating!
Re: Luke Cage
I've finished watching now, here are my thoughts:
Full season spoilers ahead:
Full season spoilers ahead:
Spoiler:
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Re: Luke Cage
Zohar wrote:Tyndmyr wrote:You don't really need to be able to follow the nuances of sports. That's really just for showing relationships and establishing stuff. As long as you're getting "these folks are friendly, this guy is touchy, this is a social space", you're picking up the important bits.
That's easy enough for an American (and possibly most native English speakers) to figure out - the culture referenced is recognizable, the type of speech is obvious. For people who aren't as familiar, though, it becomes frustrating - we don't know we're not supposed to understand, or that those aren't relevant plot points. It just seems confusing.
Which is fine! It's OK if a show is a bit more challenging to watch, and a show doesn't have to show a basic level of decency and respect to every audience in order to be good.
Honestly, I usually find sports chatter to be mostly confusing and/or boring in most movies. It's not a subculture I relate with very much. Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be a primary theme, but yeah, I get how it'd be increasingly difficult as you get further from those cultural standards.
It's odd, the US has *enough* sports culture that plenty of people seem to think it's nigh universal, but some subcultures(such as geek, etc), not knowing sports is basically expected.
Re: Luke Cage
I enjoyed this show a lot. Though I definitely felt like I was missing out on some things, not knowing Harlem.
I do think the show suffered from the same flaw that nearly all shows suffer from: An overcomplicated plot, with too many twists.
One final thing: Did anybody else find the show too dark at times? I mean literally dark. There were scenes that went on for minutes where the entire screen was just pretty much black, and I couldn't make out anything of what was happening.
I realize that I pretty much wrote down only negative things. Yet I still liked this show a lot. It's just harder to say exactly what I liked then exactly what I disliked.
I do think the show suffered from the same flaw that nearly all shows suffer from: An overcomplicated plot, with too many twists.
Spoiler:
One final thing: Did anybody else find the show too dark at times? I mean literally dark. There were scenes that went on for minutes where the entire screen was just pretty much black, and I couldn't make out anything of what was happening.
I realize that I pretty much wrote down only negative things. Yet I still liked this show a lot. It's just harder to say exactly what I liked then exactly what I disliked.
It's one of those irregular verbs, isn't it? I have an independent mind, you are an eccentric, he is round the twist
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Re: Luke Cage
I am halfway through the show and I like it a lot so far but its starting to lose steam a little. I think it might be the lack of a powerful villian or credible threat- so far Luke Cage seems to regard his opposition with more annoyance than real concern.
The other thing that I was really disappointed by so far is the backstory for Shades.
P.S.
The other thing that I was really disappointed by so far is the backstory for Shades.
Spoiler:
P.S.
8 episodes in, I've never had this problem so far. It is definitely something I noticed in Daredevil S1 but it seemed appropriate and intentional then.Diadem wrote:One final thing: Did anybody else find the show too dark at times? I mean literally dark. There were scenes that went on for minutes where the entire screen was just pretty much black, and I couldn't make out anything of what was happening.
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Re: Luke Cage
maybeagnostic wrote:I am halfway through the show and I like it a lot so far but its starting to lose steam a little. I think it might be the lack of a powerful villian or credible threat- so far Luke Cage seems to regard his opposition with more annoyance than real concern.
The other thing that I was really disappointed by so far is the backstory for Shades.Spoiler:
Spoiler:
maybeagnostic wrote:P.S.8 episodes in, I've never had this problem so far. It is definitely something I noticed in Daredevil S1 but it seemed appropriate and intentional then.Diadem wrote:One final thing: Did anybody else find the show too dark at times? I mean literally dark. There were scenes that went on for minutes where the entire screen was just pretty much black, and I couldn't make out anything of what was happening.
I didn't really notice this either.
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Re: Luke Cage
Spoilers for second half of series.Diadem wrote:Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Re: Luke Cage
The Great Hippo wrote:Spoilers for second half of series.Diadem wrote:Spoiler:I liked this series, but it felt like it reached its peak near the middle and got increasingly silly as things went on.Spoiler:
Same spoiler warning as above (which also applies to my original post).
Spoiler:
It's one of those irregular verbs, isn't it? I have an independent mind, you are an eccentric, he is round the twist
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Re: Luke Cage
I'm only just watching LC now. I kind of missed a lot of shows: systematically catching up on all the MCU TV series.
What is the deal with Alfre Woodard playing two different characters in the MCU? I can tolerate different actors playing one character. Shit happens, negotiations fall through. It's jarring, kind of cheap, for one actor to play two characters in a franchise.
What is the deal with Alfre Woodard playing two different characters in the MCU? I can tolerate different actors playing one character. Shit happens, negotiations fall through. It's jarring, kind of cheap, for one actor to play two characters in a franchise.
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Re: Luke Cage
There have been 150 actors who have played two or more roles, though most of them were background parts.
Notable ones are Peter Quill's mother being in the first Captajn America, and Odin's dad being an Irish mobster in Daredevil.
This is probably the most prominent one. And you could maybe even argue that it's not a recast - she just wanted to fuck with Stark for some reason.
Notable ones are Peter Quill's mother being in the first Captajn America, and Odin's dad being an Irish mobster in Daredevil.
This is probably the most prominent one. And you could maybe even argue that it's not a recast - she just wanted to fuck with Stark for some reason.
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Re: Luke Cage
SecondTalon wrote:This is probably the most prominent one. And you could maybe even argue that it's not a recast - she just wanted to fuck with Stark for some reason.
No they're both different named characters though according to the MCU wiki. Just one of those random casting decisions no deeper meaning or anything there.
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