The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

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LaserGuy
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby LaserGuy » Wed May 24, 2017 12:00 am UTC

EBWOP Shakespeare:
Spoiler:
Actually, I guess it could be Sabrar/Znirk. As soon as I proposed the bessie lynch, he immediately suggested SDK would make more sense, and his argument for doing so was fallacious. If SDK is actually town/indie, that would take a lot of suspicion off of bessie. Hmm....

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Gopher of Pern » Wed May 24, 2017 12:09 am UTC

Shakespeare III:
Spoiler:
I know for sure that YOLO isn't supernatural (barring godfather), but he may be scum buddies with DethStalker. I'm just not sure how possible that is.

Really interested in what SDK has to say. That will probably pin down where I'm putting my vote.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby LaserGuy » Wed May 24, 2017 6:30 am UTC

Shakespeare III:
Spoiler:
@bessie, I am sorry that you feel I spoiled your fun roleplaying this game. You did it very well, and I probably wouldn't have thought anything of it had you not rewritten that one soliloquy in response to BoomFrog. There was just enough there to make me curious, and your reaction was clearly visceral.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Gopher of Pern » Thu May 25, 2017 12:25 am UTC

Shakespeare III:
Spoiler:
My theory, as I hinted at in thread:
Bard is town. Misguided in going for me. But their power is to target someone publically, and they will be redirected to themselves. He targeted me in D1, causing me to cop Bard instead of YOLO, and getting a human result. I hope I've breadcrumbed the fact that I got a human result while I targeted YOLO enough. If scum get wind, they will probably NK me. I hope if they do, and I'm right about Bard, Bard will come clean the next day.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby LaserGuy » Thu May 25, 2017 6:36 am UTC

Shakespeare:
Spoiler:
Okay, existential dilemma time.

I think there is very good reason to believe that YOLO is town. I think there's a chance that I could derail this lynch if I really wanted to.

So the question is... is it worth trying to pick up the townie points to try to move the lynch? Or should I just let it go? The alternate wagon is GoP, but I don't think that SDK/BoomFrog/Sabrar are going to move that way. The compromise wagon is probably plytho, which would be bad for us, and YOLO flipping town probably gives him townie credit. Unless I can force the wagon to flip to SDK or Sabrar in hopes that one of them are scum? It might be worth it to lynch SDK, since breaking up bessie/SDK is going to be very hard. YOLO is a strong power role...

Yeah, there's really no dilemma. This is a good lynch for us. It's just interesting because it's been pushed entirely by the other scumteam, or, possibly, all townies. Which is also not bad either. I just feel bad about it because I know it's wrong.

(FWIW, process of elimination favors YOLO being town anyway, but, I feel the real towntell is that he isn't switching his vote to GoP (his towniest read) even though it might be able to save him. Scum would have voted for the best alternative wagon.)

Sorry YOLO. I believe you're town, and if I were also town, I would have tried to save you.

[ninja edit]Yeah this lynch is so bad. Of course YOLO isn't aligned with DethStalker. DethStalker had roleblock immunity. Why would he be on the same team as the roleblocker? Now, granted, there is at least one other roleblocker in the game, but town doesn't know that. Oh well, I'm sure I'll probably overlook obvious things like this when I'm town too.[/ninja]

[ninja2]Actually, if a couple more votes pile on, I could time it so that I "figure out" these revelations just before end of day, and frantically attempt to save him, only to sadly, fall a vote or two short. Not knowing the exact deadline makes this a little dicey though.[/ninja2]

[ninja3]You know what, fuck it. Let's see what happens.

[ninja4]Okay, not really. Sabrar is probably scum though.
Last edited by LaserGuy on Thu May 25, 2017 6:21 pm UTC, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrar » Thu May 25, 2017 7:42 am UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
So much of BoomFrog's thoughts mirror my own that I have to believe he's town. That makes me feel better about the push on YOLOSWAG. It's very exciting playing against 2 scum-teams as the dynamic is much more different than in a normal game.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby plytho » Thu May 25, 2017 10:30 am UTC

Talking traffic, everyone can read, spoilered for not mafia related

Spoiler:
Bessie, I'm also happy to talk about traffic lights. Not sure if I'll be able to answer your question.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrar » Thu May 25, 2017 7:11 pm UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
@YOLOSWAG: I apologize for using an off-topic reason to start your wagon. If I don't spot you playing in Mass Effect on MU on Sunday when you were supposed to be V/LA then I probably don't look into you that much.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby SDK » Thu May 25, 2017 7:12 pm UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
Ha, I wasn't actually expecting YOLO to post. I was pretty sure he was scum just buying time to make it unsure what alignment he was going into Night. This is much more amusing. :mrgreen:


I was three minutes too late to post this. Guess I will at Day's start if I'm still alive. With YOLO flipping scum, I'm not 100% sure where to go. Do I follow my plytho read? I suppose I'll wait and see what I get back from Bard. If Bard is scum, probably I'll be dying tonight though... Still need Bessie to die at some point too. Yuck. Maybe I should try to get her lynched, scumminess be damned! I could lie about the reply I just got back from mpolo... Come clean about my lyncher status and make it clear that I made some false assumptions based on the randomness thing (that's the lie)? Might work. Whatever.



BoomFrog wrote:
SDK wrote:
plytho wrote:I'm thinking there's no way town would behave any way close to that as town would be more open to trust people and take their advice, while you are saying there is no way scum could behave like that because they need to blend in. I guess I see where you are coming from now.

You've never been mafia before. In many ways it's actually way easier to trust people as mafia - you know who your team is and you know who is town.

By the way, why did you say this?

Hmm, that was a while ago. I think it was partly because I thought plytho might react to it, and partly trying to help town plytho see the game from scum's perspective.

That whole "tie a buddy to a townie, then lynch the townie to relieve pressure from your buddy" play is something I've done a lot, actually. Not this time though. :D


plytho wrote:(You might have a town tell on Gopher from experience that I don’t have yet.)

True enough. With Gopher, I'm so sure he's town based on writing style and a healthy dose of meta. Gopher makes mistakes. He likes to ponder and muse prior to really fully thinking through where those musings lead. He's right that he's often considered scummy for it, and rightly so! We do need to hold people accountable for their mistakes. But when Gopher has a reasonable explanation after the fact, I'll tend to be more lenient with him. I mean, look at Gopher last game. We would have strung him up Day 2, but that was being pushed by scum because it's easy (though town helped well enough). I suspect the same thing may be happening here. For example, the fact that you have nothing really concrete to point at here is a big part of why I'm still concerned you're scum, regardless of YOLO's flip. Plenty of people have made mistakes this game, though perhaps not as obviously as Gopher. Wanting to string someone up based on two specific points when you have no overall scum read otherwise? Not a reliable way to catch scum if you're simultaneously letting others off without as much scrutiny. Still need to solidify that, and Bard might be more important. We'll see what happens.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby plytho » Thu May 25, 2017 7:19 pm UTC

Shakespeare III

Spoiler:
I wonder what SDK quoted me on in the post above..
He's probably saying he'll be gunning for me D3 :)
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby BoomFrog » Thu May 25, 2017 7:41 pm UTC

@YOLO:
Shakespeare
Spoiler:
Well, that was certainly an entertaining send-off. How close was my mind reading post?
Guild!YOLO: Shakespeare is fun, thee thou forthwith! ugg, I'm mates with plytho and dethstalker, w/e I can win this solo. SWAG vote stalker, put some distance between us. Wow, dude's crumbling, w/e better just let it ride. SDK proposes madge, no I can't lose my credit here. Dude just roll over and die for me. Night chat: plytho just do what your doing we got this. Kill sabrar because they'll focus JimBob. D2 alright, JimBob's dead, go after the off-wagon. Oh right, the other scum team.


Obviously answer me in a spoiler, but I'd like to find out at the end of the game what your thoughts were at this moment.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby LaserGuy » Thu May 25, 2017 9:04 pm UTC

Shakespeare:
Spoiler:
Wow, my reads are terrible. Okay, so YOLO was apparently mafia (or he's trolling) and aligned with DethStalker.

Process of elimination points to bessie/SDK both being town then. Though it's possible SDK has a role equivalent to Bard, somehow, I guess. plytho rolecopped SDK as a Wizard, which is a supernatural doctor. Nonetheless, we'll probably kill bessie tonight (I'll roleblock SDK). SDK maybe tomorrow.

Madge seems to have breadcrumbed her role to be tracker. We're going to leave her alone since that power can't really hurt us.

Setup seems very scum-favored as YOLO's post suggests we're 10-3-3, and townie power roles don't seem that strong to me.

If it's YOLO/DethStalker/X, last person seems likely to be SirGabriel, BoomFrog, kalira or Bard. I'm guessing one of the former two. Given that BoomFrog just posted an @YOLO post here in Gojoe, my feeling is probably not him. I think SirGabriel is right. But then, my reads are mostly wrong. Let's go with kalira instead.

Most of YOLO's post appears to be nonsense/wine. By happenstance we're targeting someone in the pool he suggested, but we're not considering it seriously. Also by happenstance, none of the members of our team are in the pool he's suggesting his team target. Based on the relative lack of coordinations on the wagons and YOLO's increasing boredom with the game until he was seriously threatened with the lynch, I'm guessing both of his buddies were of the lurky sort.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrar » Thu May 25, 2017 9:15 pm UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
@YOLOSWAG: by the way I would like to express my gratitude for revealing yourself before the official flip, I like not having to spend the next 2 days in suspense on whether I was right.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby #HBC | YOLOSWAG » Thu May 25, 2017 10:47 pm UTC

@BoomFrog Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
Glad you liked it, BoomFrog.

Regarding your guess as to my thought process, pretty much perfect!

Swap in plytho with Bard and that hits the nail on the head. The only other thing is that we killed Sabrar because I figured he'd be a difficult lynch. Well done! Your YOLO impression with regards to my language is dead on as well :lol:

Sabrar, sure, no problem. Good job this game.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Gopher of Pern » Thu May 25, 2017 11:01 pm UTC

Shakespeare III:
Spoiler:
Will be very interesting to see which side YOLO is on. I'm kinda hoping that he ends up being supernatural. It would almost confirm my theory.

@YOLO: last game you should have claimed SK, especially if you were immune to scums NK (I don't recall whether you were or not.) Town couldn't lynch you without losing.

Not sure who I should go for tonight.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby kalira » Fri May 26, 2017 2:55 pm UTC

Shakespeare III:
Spoiler:
Sigh. There's no way I am going to make my win condition in this game. Not one but TWO scum killing factions. Presuming Yolo wasn't lying about the fact that there's at least one more member of his scum team, and why would he lie about that if it would just be disproven in the morning, that means both kill factions are still in play tonight. Which means two more townies down the drain, especially since Yolo fucking left a bomb detailing "here's a list of people our team doesn't know the faction of for your team to focus on killing." Obv Yolo's scummate(s) remaining (what does he mean by "I have a traitor in the thread" anyway?) are in the "Yolo's team will kill from this list" list. So if we focus on killing Yolo's scummates, the rest of my group will be open season for the remaining scum team, which means I'm certain to get killed. Especially if Yolo has managed not to split up his non-teammate scum evenly between his listed groups.

Presume 11-3-2 (grouping myself with town) -- If Yolo is DS's scummate as I suspect and he didn't lie abt another scummate, they have to be the group of 3.
With perfect town days and perfect scum nights,

Code: Select all

D1      11-3-2
End D1  11-3-1   or   11-2-2
D2       9-3-1   or    9-2-2
End D2   9-3-0N  or    9-1-2   or    9-2-1
D3       8-3-0N  or    7-1-2   or    7-2-1
End D3                 7-1-1   or    7-2-0
D4                     5-1-1   or    6-2-0
End D4                 5-1-0   or    6-1-0
D5                     4-1-0   or    5-1-0
End D5                 4-0-0TW or    5-0-0 TW


Presuming 10-3-3 --

Code: Select all

D1      10-3-3
End D1  10-3-2
D2       8-3-2
End D2   8-3-1   or    8-2-2
D3       6-3-1   or    6-2-2
End D3   6-3-0  / 6-2-1 / 6-1-2
D4       5-3-0   or    4-1-2   or    4-2-1
End D4   5-2-0   or    4-0-2   or    4-1-1
D5       4-2-0   or    3-0-2   or    2-1-1
End D5   4-1-0   or    3-0-1   or    2-1-0   or   2-0-1
D6       3-1-0   or    2-0-1   or    1-1-0SW or   1-0-1SW
End D6   3-0-0TW or    2-0-0TW or    (SW)    or   (SW)


If it's any more than 3 and 3 on the scum teams, I don't know how the heck town was ever supposed to win. Hell, just looking at those numbers, I'm not sure how town was ever supposed to win in the first place -- perfect play by scum kills is a lot easier to manage than perfect play by town lynch. Any mislynches at all and town is fairly boned in a 10-3-3 scenario, and it looks like only 1 mislynch is possible in the 11-3-2 one. And that's all presuming I count as town. If I switch to scumside, town's chances are even worse, though I am highly likely to be killed by town or whichever scum team is ailing because of kingmaker scenarios.

Yolo said 3rd parties should side with scum -- well, Yolo, the thing you didn't think of/mention: how the HECK would I even let scum know I'm on your side without getting immediately lynched? Hell, I have a power that even lets me talk anonymously to someone at night, but I'm not sure how to do it. If I send it to the wrong person? Lynched. I have to hit one of either 2 or 3 people, because there's no way I can win with a scumteam that's at 1 person right now. 11 people left now, excluding myself -- that makes it at best a 27% chance. And even if I send it to the right person, it might still get me lynched.

At what point is it in my best interests to side with scum? Well, in the 10-3-3 case, that's simpler: D4 I could end the game if one scumteam is gone. If I reveal myself D4 and it's a 4-2-1 situation, though, it is in the 1-person scumteam's best interests to try to off one of the other scumteam or me in the night, which could lead to 4-0-1 or 3-1-1 in the morning. 4-0-1 is squirrelly and I could switch sides again if needed? 3-1-1 would be the same as 4-2-1 for me. All of course presuming I wasn't killed in the night. I can't really see an obvious point in the 11-3-2 for me to come out siding with scum -- if that's the layout, I'm going to have to play it by ear and see where I can slide under the radar and hopefully manipulate one way or the other.

Some of these scenarios are going to be super squirrelly with the avoiding prisoner's dilemma and the brain machinations of trying to pick which scum team to tell I'll support (dat 4-1-1 scenario, doe).

Asking mpolo if I can send messages involving codes for use in thread or if I can outright identify myself in my message.

I'm so getting killed tonight, aren't I?
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby bessie » Sun May 28, 2017 5:57 am UTC

@Madge, plytho, anyone may read but you will probably be bored
Spoiler:
Madge, my question isn’t about the lights themselves but if you know of any research about people running dead traffic lights, and if this number is increasing? So to clarify a bit what happened, we were outdoors on the patio at the bar and the power went out for the grid. I don’t know how large of an area that was, the power company site said 7000+ people were without power. So not very large, 5 blocks? Anyway, almost immediately at least two cars ran the dead traffic light without even slowing down (I wasn’t looking that direction when it happened, but the impact and number of cars involved makes me think so). A few minutes later, similar thing happens a block away (I didn’t see that one either but paramedics were called so probably similar). So I was wondering if running dead traffic lights is a recent trend. What made me think about it is the freeway on ramp lights, which are only on at rush hour, and off most of the time. So do you think we are being conditioned to run through dead lights without stopping? Or is this just a coincidence and I’m just a quality engineer that has been so conditioned that I can’t look at anything in my life without filtering it through a 5-why analysis?


Shakespeare III Mafia, no one alive may read
Spoiler:
Sorry for neglecting you again Gojoe thread. I’m neglecting my mason partner too. I was hoping to have some analysis done for him but I spent half of my Friday night in the puppy emergency room (he’s fine). I didn’t hold back much anyway, most of my thoughts are in the thread. I probably put too much out there, but I didn’t want my thoughts to die with me in case I am night killed. Which was stupid of me, because I’m a mason and I could have left it in mason chat. Anyway, I think LaserGuy is scum and he’s going to feel he needs to kill me, for the same reason his team killed me in Dark Tower (as verified by SDK).
bessie wrote:I am quite the novice and either can easily work me

Work you? No. You're hard to work. When you get set on a course, pulling you off of that can be very difficult. It's why we killed you Night 1 last game.

I still don’t know about SDK. SirGabriel wanted to try to push him to claim, so I did my best to try to make some noise and look scummy but only YOLOSWAG, LaserGuy, and Gopher of Pern voiced strong suspicions of me, and one is “confirmed” scum and the others are highly suspect themselves. Hmm.

#HBC | YOLOSWAG wrote:I'm 3/4 on this site now. Do I have Carlington beat? What's troublesome though is that I think I'm going to get scumread when I finally roll Town.
:lol: Not sure if you’ve beat Carlington, he has a pretty high scum/town ratio. And freezeblade had a really long streak, 9-10 games? This spectacular post was actually made toward the beginning of that streak. And if LaserGuy is scum he’s 3 for 3. :wink:

YOLO, I can only think clearly about one game at a time. More on your game after I think about it a little. :)

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Madge » Sun May 28, 2017 7:06 am UTC

@Bessie (traffic talk)
Spoiler:
Madge, my question isn’t about the lights themselves but if you know of any research about people running dead traffic lights, and if this number is increasing? So to clarify a bit what happened, we were outdoors on the patio at the bar and the power went out for the grid. I don’t know how large of an area that was, the power company site said 7000+ people were without power. So not very large, 5 blocks? Anyway, almost immediately at least two cars ran the dead traffic light without even slowing down (I wasn’t looking that direction when it happened, but the impact and number of cars involved makes me think so). A few minutes later, similar thing happens a block away (I didn’t see that one either but paramedics were called so probably similar). So I was wondering if running dead traffic lights is a recent trend. What made me think about it is the freeway on ramp lights, which are only on at rush hour, and off most of the time. So do you think we are being conditioned to run through dead lights without stopping? Or is this just a coincidence and I’m just a quality engineer that has been so conditioned that I can’t look at anything in my life without filtering it through a 5-why analysis?


I'm not familiar with the research but I might ask the person I know in the safety research data arm if she knows anything about habituation and whatnot.

Problem is as I see it, due to the rarity of dead traffic lights, it'd be hard to do research. It also makes me wonder some pretty normal things - how well delineated the site is at night and whatnot. Like, I wonder, without the lights being on, whether there's enough reflective markings/etc to have people be aware that an intersection is coming. becuase people breezing through intersections like that - it's horrible and i just want to hope it's only becuase people aren't aware the intersection is there rather than because they are being silly and reckless. :(

We have a procedure called road safety auditing in Australia which is no doubt similar to what is done elsewhere. I did a week-long course on it about 5 years ago and it was very informative, you never look at intersections the same way again. Here's a link to a very expensive standard about it: https://www.onlinepublications.austroad ... /AGRS06-09 - I can actually download it for free on a work computer.

This here has a list of different "improvements" that happen to intersections and how much they reduce crashes by - not directly relevant to what you asked but at least it's not behind a paywall and it could be fun to click through especially if you're a quality engineer: http://www.cmfclearinghouse.org/

I also find quality really interesting - one of the units in my CS degree was all about software quality and hearing about the Japanese quality revolution/etc was just so amazing. How do you actually become a quality engineer? It never seemed like a thing you could just... do, you know? (Like traffic engineering is a civil engineering subdiscipline, and basically I just got a civil engineering job at a road company - even though my job doesn't require an engineering degree for a bunch of historical reasons)

Anyway, not sure I'd want to move into quality engineering, just curious mostly. I'm studying a nutrition degree now, part-time, which has been fun. Considering going into dietetics but if that happens it's something like 10 years away so nobody hold your breath okay???
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby kalira » Sun May 28, 2017 4:18 pm UTC

Shakespeare III:
Spoiler:
Fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck. I was so concentrating on figuring out what to do with my night powers that I FORGOT TO SUBMIT SOMETHING to mpolo :(
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrar » Sun May 28, 2017 5:16 pm UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
My guess (depending on mod's answer to pm) is that SDK is Backup for bessie.
Should have investigated plytho last night (trusting SDK) but as always I second-guessed myself due to YOLOSWAG's wine.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby bessie » Mon May 29, 2017 4:08 am UTC

Shakespeare III mafia

Spoiler:
Well, very disappointed. I don’t think I’ve ever been as excited about a game as much as this one. And this would have to be a game I can’t replace in.

LaserGuy, as difficult as it is for me to accept, I know you did the correct thing in killing me (though I still think you took the role playing accusation too far). I already had my first D3 post written out. It seems you know your Shakespeare well. Perhaps you recall the context of this quote.

Now are we well resolved, and by God's help,
And yours, the noble sinews of our power,
France being ours, we'll bend it to our awe,
Or break it all to pieces. Or there we'll sit,
Ruling in large and ample empery
O'er France and all her almost kingly dukedoms,
Or lay these bones in an unworthy urn,
Tombless, with no remembrance over them.
Either our history shall with full mouth
Speak freely of our acts, or else our grave,
Like Turkish mute, shall have a tongueless mouth,
Not worshipp'd with a waxen epitaph.


D3 I planned on going full Henry V (for those that don’t feel like looking it up, Henry V is battling the King of France). And LaserGuy, I’m really curious, was I correct in this read or is perhaps my ego that overinflated?

Note to everyone, if I go into tunnel mode, I’m usually correct (Dark Tower, Diablo, Secret Santa 2016, etc).

Second note to everyone, I keep bringing it up but no one is interested in running or playing a newbie game, so the only place for newbies to go is the regular games. If we want to keep this forum from dying we need to support new players, and try not to scare away the spectators that are lurking and thinking about joining their first game. This post re newbies was entirely truthful.

Sabrar, I know you will figure it out. Don’t let me down. Be the smartest guy in the room.

Maybe some comments later, after I read through Gojoe and figure out the setup.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrar » Mon May 29, 2017 4:25 am UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
Scratch my previous idea, I keep forgetting the additional info SDK said along with his confirmation re:bessie.

Hi bessie! I'm sorry if I got you killed because of my speculation re: the 2 scum-teams. However this should give us a confirmed townie who will hopefully attract the NK-s the following night.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby BoomFrog » Mon May 29, 2017 4:31 am UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
Alright, traditional post death pre spoiler predictions to hone my skills:

Guild is Plytho

Supernatural is: SirGabriel and hmm... Bard? no...
New Sabrar then.

Oh no! I was killed by new Sabrar because he's the only one who knows why the townies are in the secret townie club. So new Sabrar is the Guild and supernatural is SirGabriel and... hmph, plytho I guess.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Madge » Mon May 29, 2017 5:16 am UTC

@bessie (Traffic Talk)

Spoiler:
So, as promised I asked your question to our research and data co-ordinator, who is basically the smartest person I know about "does this cause accidents?". Here's a transcript of our IM conversation. In the interest of anonymity, I'm (e) and she's (RDC). The day is still not over so stay tuned for more potential updates.

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 9:23 AM] (e):
hey! I have a traffic safety question that is not actually directly related to anything i was doing for work, just general curiosity, but was wondering if you knew if any research has been done / what i could google for. a friend was saying that they reckon that ramp metering signals turning off and on during peak / non-peak conditions people to drive straight through signals that are out (e.g. power outage). i get the feeling it would be hard to research it - power outages are so rare - but do you know if people habituate to signals being turned off during ramp metering? or does ramp metering best practise require that instead of e.g. actually turning the signals off, you leave them green, say?
again, this is just an idle curiosity thing so if you're busy don't feel obligated to make time for it

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 9:25 AM] (RDC):
Hey, interesting question. I dont know if any myself, but a couple others here might. Leave it with me and Ill have a chat to them and get back to you

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:36 AM] (RDC):
Hi Madge, You are right that ramp metering signals are only on during peak times (in off times they leave them off, not on green). Therefore the majority of the time people use the ramps the same way they do now (without signals) i.e. people adapt their driving behaviour. Therefore, if there happens to be a power outage during peak times there isn't any increase in road safety issues, as people just go back to merging 'normally' - it just means the ramp is far less efficient than it is when the ramp metering signals are working. There isn't any research per se on this, but this is what other juristrictions have observed

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:37 AM] (e):
wow that's really cool!!! But I think you misunderstood my question a bit, even though you answered a different question which was also interesting
i was wondering specifically if people being habituated to light off = ignore it (via ramp signals), causes them to think the same thing (maybe subconsciously) about regular 4-way intx?

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:38 AM] (RDC):
Ah ok ... hmmmm

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:38 AM] (e):
this is a friend who lives in the US and she said there was a power outage near her house and within 15 minutes there were two accidents at the out signals
so she was wondering if this was a phenomenon that was known/observed or if like, it was just a very tragic coincidence
(sorry, two accidents = two accidents at two seperate sets of signals)

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:39 AM] (RDC):
And both signals were out?

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:40 AM] (e):
yeah there was a power outage for the whole block
i should probably have asked if the power outage was due to a storm or a tree falling or something because that would also increase the liklihood of a crash, because it was also at night (coming from the civil side my first thought was, was there enough reflective marking and stuff so people coudl see there was an intersection at all???)

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:42 AM] (RDC):
Hmmm very interesting. I will go away and ask the guys about this. I haven't heard of anything like this. I know from personal experience, I always find it amazing how well people navigate and take turns when there are power outages at signals - but of course we dont have ramp signals that are turned off ....

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:43 AM] (e):
yeah people are so courteous when signals are out i can't believe it
but what you were saying about power going out when ramp signals should be on but aren't, people would just drive like normal, so merge/etc. so you'd expect that people would treat it like a normal 4-way intx

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:44 AM] (e):
and no doubt lights being out is very bad for safety, but is there a psychological issue or is it just bad enough that the street lighting is out and it's dark and there's maybe also rain?
and i mean two accidents is bad and tragic but it could just be a very sad coincidence. i was looking at crash data for one of my intersections and two accidents happened within a couple of hours of each other, and another one had two accidents happening like exactly a year apart to the day. there's always weird coincidences if you have enough data...

[‎29/‎05/‎2017 11:55 AM] (RDC):
Yes very true, and if its dark with no street lights and a strom or whatever people may be less likely to see the intersection at all, hense the crashes
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby BoomFrog » Mon May 29, 2017 2:58 pm UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
The more LaserGuy posted D2 the more scummy I felt he was. And yet the idea that Bard and LaserGuy were scum together was so unlikely since it would be suicide for Bard to stick his neck out for a buddy D1.
The fact that they are on opposite scum teams is hilarious.

Town is probably going to lunch perfectly this game for like 5 days then get one misslynch at the end when the weakest scum hunters are left alive and still lose.

I'm a little frustrated that my breadcrumb didn't work.
I got my night result early by accident so I had to fake the timing but apparently I was a bit late.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Mon May 29, 2017 5:29 pm UTC

Shakespeare III (also contains a Diablo spoiler, if anybody is worried about that):
Spoiler:
I'm not reading spoilers, so I have no idea if SDK is telling the truth, but assuming he is, I'm amused that I'm getting good at calling mechanics apparently. Last game I almost called Yoloswag's night action pseudo-immunity in scum chat, as well as Carlington's backup role (although not the specifics). I doubt that SDK is lying - I'd expect him to have not simply copied a previous role when fabricating a claim like that. I agree that there is likely 2 supernaturals and 3 guild overall. My 1-shot SK cop makes no sense if the supernatural faction is only one member. I've not been doing any in depth reads of everything else though to determine who is likely scum. One thing I would look at would be to see who mentioned supernaturals early Day 1. I suspect the first one or two players to have done so aren't likely from that faction (and are likely town), as it feels like they would try to keep the existence of their faction secret until people started suggesting it.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby #HBC | YOLOSWAG » Mon May 29, 2017 7:32 pm UTC

Shakespeare III

Spoiler:
Bah.

Our team has lost. Bard has outed himself to the other team by announcing that LaserGuy is confirmed Town to him.

Rooting for the other scum team. Nice effort at any rate Bard.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby LaserGuy » Mon May 29, 2017 7:35 pm UTC

Shakespeare III:

Spoiler:
So..... what's Bard up to? His claim... makes no sense. I guess he could be a Guardian Angel and is just lying about me being confirmed town in his PM. Otherwise... no idea? Read his role PM wrong? Insane pointless gambit?

bessie did note (correctly) that his character is loyal to King Lear (Gopher) not to the King of France in flavor.

So something really fishy is going on. Bad news is I'm going to NKed tonight by the other team.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby bessie » Tue May 30, 2017 3:07 am UTC

@Madge (traffic talk, etc)

Spoiler:
Madge, thanks so much for asking around about this! My best friend was there and we have been discussing it (he’s an ME and like me can’t shut it off when something catches his interest). Some clarification- this was at approximately 2:00 in the afternoon, it was a beautiful clear day, so visibility was not an issue. The power was off because there was a fire nearby so the transformer was shut down. For some reason, there was no backup power for the lights so they were dead, not blinking. I don’t know why (malfunction or by design?).

Madge wrote:I also find quality really interesting - one of the units in my CS degree was all about software quality and hearing about the Japanese quality revolution/etc was just so amazing. How do you actually become a quality engineer? It never seemed like a thing you could just... do, you know?

I don’t know if anyone starts out wanting to be a quality engineer. You just sort of get stuck there (for reference, my three college degrees are unrelated to my job: astrophysics, classics, and education). A lot of your job is looking for stuff other people are doing wrong (OK technically it is investigating occurrences where a product or procedure does not conform to the requirements blah blah blah). No one likes to admit they’re wrong or own up to a mistake so you end up clashing with your co workers all day. Your activities are not “value added” to the company’s actual products so in management’s view you are only there to fulfill a requirement. Seriously, most of the time my job is a real life game of mafia. I find mistakes, dig down for the truth, argue with people acting scummy, and end up as the lynch scapegoat to protect the power roles. It kinda suits me but the last part is getting old so I'm looking around.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Madge » Tue May 30, 2017 3:26 am UTC

@traffic talk

Spoiler:
this was at approximately 2:00 in the afternoon, it was a beautiful clear day, so visibility was not an issue.


Well sniff my nutsack and call me Barney. I'm at a serious loss to explain how that could have possibly happened, other than mere bad luck which is super unsatisfying.

For some reason, there was no backup power for the lights so they were dead, not blinking. I don’t know why (malfunction or by design?).
[/quote]

Some of our traffic lights have UPSes - "uninterrupterable power supplies" or something - but those are only at "high priority" areas where e.g. there's a lot of trucks or something. Without those, there's no power for the lights so they go off. Like, there's not even power for them to be able to flash yellow, you know? (We've had LED traffic signals for the past 5-10 years now, and they use a tiny fraction of the electricity, so I'd imagine solar batteries or similar might be on the horizon)

Your job sounds so interesting, if maybe a bit maddening. I love thinking I know better than other people and telling them they're wrong - except I'm usually the one who is wrong so it doesn't usually go well :P
Last edited by Madge on Tue May 30, 2017 3:31 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby LaserGuy » Tue May 30, 2017 3:26 am UTC

Shakespeare:

Spoiler:
Oh. I'm dense. Bard is on the other scumteam, isn't he? Yeah, I think that makes sense.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby mpolo » Tue May 30, 2017 12:39 pm UTC

Shakespeare:

Spoiler:
Town's best chance here is to lynch LaserGuy, since Bard is telling the truth about his lover condition. I think Guild have lost, as Bard cannot get rid of LaserGuy without dying himself. (If he had a teammate, the teammate could have killed him without Bard dying.)
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 3:01 pm UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
This is me showing restraint and not defending Madge in thread. I was right about SDK's case against BoomFrog, I think I'm right about Madge as well, though I have to be careful with her.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 5:52 pm UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
I so want to know what Sabrar posted above!
I think my team is doing pretty well. SDK was after me yesterday but I seem to have convinced him I'm not the guild he's looking for. (has there been a star wars theme? I look forward to playing I game with flavor I'm familiar with.)
LaserGuy has a guardian angel and it looks like Bard will be lynched before LaserGuy is considered. So that's pretty good. Dimochka has stayed under the radar so far it seems. I hope my latest post doesn't lead to prying by others. I was in full town mode when I wrote that and I almost made a case implying dimochka was a likely SK. Still not sure if I made the right decision by removing that part of the read.

I quite enjoy being scum. It's fun to see how wrong people are when you know better. I do think I'd be found out more easily if there was only one scum team. It's harder to make a strong case on a townie. See my move on Madge vs the one on Gopher. (This will look very silly if Gopher is scum and/or madge is town.)
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby kalira » Tue May 30, 2017 7:51 pm UTC

Shakespeare III:

Spoiler:
I kind of want to suggest we lynch LaserGuy. If I were town I would do so. LaserGuy and Bard have both seemed scummy to me. I feel like most people are reading one or both of them as scum, barring any scumbuddies. If Bard is telling the truth about his unreciprocated lover, killing LG could possibly net two scum deaths. If he's lying about the lover, then he's def scum and we know who our next lynch is, possibly mislynching LG. HOWEVER -- I'm still a survivor. If I suggest that and it ends up killing one or two scum, I know I'm going to be first on the NK list, and who even knows if there is a power to stop the NK at this point? I can't play as if I were townie because I am not expendable for my wincon.

Our/my best hope is that scum targets scum with the NK, but esp in light of Yolo's parting post, that seems unlikely. (I probably already said something like that in a previous spoiler, but I don't feel like looking through my previous post right now. Would just annoy me more that I didn't manage to put in any night actions.) I feel like there are too many obviously scummy scum hanging around at the moment for me to toss my hat in with them, so for now, I'm still acting as if I am on the town team. So I have to believe if there is a chance to kill two scummy birds with one stone, that I have to take advantage of it. Now how the heck do I make the suggestion without suggesting it? (I think I did kind of already plant the seed with the "hey what if they're lovers on different scum teams? do we normally get told our lover's alignment?" thing, but nobody seems to be interested in that atm.)
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby Gopher of Pern » Wed May 31, 2017 11:28 pm UTC

Shakespeare III:
Spoiler:
Just had a thought: If Bard is telling the truth, and they are both scum, it may be incredibly advantageous to lynch Laserguy, too remove both of them in one go. How likely is it that's the case? I don't know.

I think if I get two votes on me I'm going to claim, and try to convince people to leave me alive to pick out the supernatural scum.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby LaserGuy » Wed May 31, 2017 11:46 pm UTC

Shakespeare:
Spoiler:
I have a feeling that we've probably lost this game.

The last member of Guild is probably Bard. If we're super lucky, it's Madge, but I really, really doubt it. After Bard lynch, then I'll probably be next. Assuming we're at 6-3-1 right now, then Bard lynch puts us at 5-3, my lynch is 4-2, which is MYLO, sort of. We pretty much have to target SDK tonight. Tomorrow we hit Sabrar. Endgame is Gopher/Madge/kalira/SirGabriel vs. dimochka/plytho with SirGabriel confirmed. This isn't terrible for us, actually. Kalira/dimochka probably have more or less equal townie cred. Gopher and plytho are reasonably well-matched. If they hit plytho, then it's MYLO with Gopher/Madge/kalira vs. dimochka. Actually, feeling better about it now as long as town doesn't have any unexpected power roles.

No idea what dimochka is planning on fakeclaiming. We didn't discuss.

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby bessie » Thu Jun 01, 2017 6:17 am UTC

Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
So everyone thinks I was killed because of SDK? Well maybe that’s the truth but jeez it sure is discouraging that no one thinks it may have been because I can actually have a good scum read. I thought Sabrar might have figured it out but now I’m not sure. Oh and sorry I doubted you on D2 Sabrar, I finally figured out why your content felt different.

And pfft, I guess I even suck at acting scummy?
SirGabriel wrote:It wasn't because of her night chat. D2 she was intentionally acting scummy, hoping that would result in more suspicion on SDK and force him to full claim.


Even when she intentionally tries to act scummy, people still read her as town. I am amused :D

We are glad the Dauphin is so pleasant with us,
His present and your pains we thank you for.
When we have march'd our rackets to these balls,
We will, in France, by God's grace, play a set
Shall strike his father's crown into the hazard.
:P

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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby BoomFrog » Thu Jun 01, 2017 4:36 pm UTC

@Bessie
Shakespeare III
Spoiler:
D2 I read you as townie Bessie annoyed that everyone always sees her as Townie, trying to act scummy so she could see who wasn't really trying to read her. Which is a townie thing to do hence the:
"Sorry" when I read you as town.

I'm amused thinking about where this cycle is going to end up if you keep getting town roles.

I'm really not sure why I was killed instead of Sabrar.
I did find Bard scummy but I had specifically not made a big deal about it to try and avoid the NK. Probably for the best since sabrar's scumdar is better then mine these days.
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Re: The Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion Thread

Postby mpolo » Thu Jun 01, 2017 4:45 pm UTC

@BoomFrog
Shakespeare III

Spoiler:
I'm really not sure why I was killed instead of Sabrar.
I did find Bard scummy but I had specifically not made a big deal about it to try and avoid the NK. Probably for the best since sabrar's scumdar is better then mine these days.


It was Bard who decided to kill you (he sent Sabrar and then changed to you…) He said it was better to get rid of you sooner than later. Kalira has the right plan for town, but nobody wants to risk it, even though they find LaserGuy and Bard both scummy… And it's the best chance to get a town victory out of this. Lynching Bard might work, though. I guess I keep with the popcorn-eating…
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