Refrigerator Mafia - Post Game - The Eternal Soup

For your simulated organized crime needs.

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Sabrar
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Sabrar » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:27 pm UTC

@Peaceful Whale: any particular reason why bessie is more townie than yourself?

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:28 pm UTC

@Sabar No, not really. But Bessie has been more help than I have.
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:33 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:
heuristically_alone wrote:
plytho wrote:Yeah, but seriously, in the one nightless game I played (Dark Tower), scum completely outplayed town so I guess I'm looking for strategy tips?

This seems rather winey to me.

I agree with him, but not sure if it was an attempt to appear noobie. Also, that question mark makes me read it kinda weird.

Well, I am pretty new still. I played three games before this one and I did not make it past D1 in my second game. So I have almost no experience with nightless games.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Sabrar » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:49 pm UTC

@Peaceful Whale: for future games, assuming you are Town you know this because the mod told you so in the official role-pm. Technically there can be no way that you should consider bessie as more townie than yourself (list should not describe how much each person helped Town, rather who has the higher percentage of being Town).

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:51 pm UTC

Okay
modded list:

TOWN FOR SURE
Peaceful Whale Whale

I'M NOT SURE
everyone else
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:52 pm UTC

Oops, put Whale twice.
*faceslap*
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - Pregame

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:04 pm UTC

The family was home. They'd be cooking soon. Fingers pointed in every direction but no one moved. The refrigerator door would open at any moment and the food knew. Whoever was closest to the door would be grabbed first. And then the remaining food would know, had they chosen well? Were they good food or spoiled?

Current vote totals:

(1) moody7277 - flicky1991
(1) LaserGuy - Sabrar
(1) flicky1991 - plytho
(1) plytho - bessie
(1) Znirk - moody7277

Not voting - Peaceful Whale, heuristically_alone, LaserGuy, Znirk

9 Players Alive, 5 votes to reach majority and lynch.

Deadline is Tuesday 11am PDT in about 25 hours.


I highly recommend submitting your night actions now if you have any. You can always send a change later before deadline.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:12 pm UTC

Vote: Plytho for all the reasons I said before
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:30 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:Vote: Plytho for all the reasons I said before

Could you repeat those reasons please? From what I read in your reads list you think I'm scum because you think town would have moved on without explaining it's a misunderstanding? It's not entirely clear to me what exactly you're saying.

(see, your vote puts pressure on me to respond :D)
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:34 pm UTC

@flicky: I see you're online, working on that reads list I suppose?
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:36 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:2. plytho - Has been a help to town with scum reads. However he did push on Bessie, and I feel he may not understand what Bessie was saying still, and I think he realized what he was doing could be seen as scummy tunneling, mentioned it (WIFOM?), and then made sure every one knew it was a mistake, I feel like town would have just moved on. And then this I missed, but huery pointed it out.
heuristically_alone wrote:
plytho wrote:Yeah, but seriously, in the one nightless game I played (Dark Tower), scum completely outplayed town so I guess I'm looking for strategy tips?

This seems rather winey to me.

I agree with him, but not sure if it was an attempt to appear noobie.
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:38 pm UTC

There is more to that than just you not moving on. There's the Bessie push, and the WIFOM
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby flicky1991 » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:49 pm UTC

plytho wrote:@flicky: please provide a reads list and a town-to-scum list.
plytho wrote:@flicky: I see you're online, working on that reads list I suppose?
Yeah, there is more content now than there was when I failed to make one before.

In a few of these I'm going to reference what I'm seeing as an argument "triangle" between Sabrar, bessie, and plytho where all three have been picking at small details. I'm not going to say that participating in those arguments makes anyone scummier or townier, but focusing on those arguments to the expense of the game outside of it is scummy.

  • Sabrar - Lots of good content. Lots of arguing and poking at people, which is normal for him. He's part of the triangle, but he has made plenty of judgements outside of that. Neutral-to-townie.
  • plytho - So much of his content so far focuses on bessie's initial setup spec that I can only think of it as intentional. There's no issue with arguing about something if you think there's been a misunderstanding somewhere, but it feels like that's been most of his content and I'm finding it hard to notice anything else notable about him. Fairly scummy.
  • moody7277 - Little content. More posts than Znirk but (and this is the more important thing) not really saying anything in those posts. Haven't had time to check how typical this is of him but for now it doesn't look good.
  • Peaceful Whale - Genuine newbie townie. I can't imagine her asking so many basic questions in-thread if she had scumchat. If she's scum, she's brilliant at it. Tempted to think the fruit references are merely part of an ability rather than anything suspicious.
  • Heuristically_alone - His game has improved since previous games. I am liking the effort he's putting into putting forward ideas and questions, even if I don't always agree with them. Quite townie.
  • Znirk - Not much content at all, but what's there is not terrible - I just wish he was online more. Neutral but could sink if he doesn't contribute again soon.
  • LaserGuy - As mentioned before, he is playing very similarly to when he was town in the game we shared. He looks townie for now but if I get time I'd like to compare with some of his scum games.
  • bessie - Lots of good speculation and discussion. I'd say she's in the middle where the three in the triangle are concerned - more other content than plytho but not as much as Sabrar. Neutral.

TOWN
Peaceful Whale
heuristically_alone
LaserGuy
Sabrar
bessie
Znirk
plytho
moody7277
SCUM

moody7277 wrote:@flicky: I see you're voting for me. Any thought on who my "scummate" might be? Any other possible scum teams?
In terms of reads on who is scummy, you and plytho are scummiest, so you'd make a logical team. I'd try to give a possible scummate based on your interactions with other people too, but you're not really interacting with anyone enough to judge from that.

I'd be happy voting plytho or moody.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Znirk » Mon Aug 14, 2017 7:37 pm UTC

Quick "i'm here" ping after an unexpectedly busy weekend and a long work day. I'll be reading and forming an opinion over the next couple of hours.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Aug 14, 2017 7:38 pm UTC

bessie: Looking much townier now than earlier in the game. I feel her initial comment about plytho active lurking was a bit aggressive for Page 2. In the Rule #2 discussion with plytho/Sabrar, I feel that bessie explained her thought process well enough at how she arrived at her setup conclusions quite well after the initial clarifications, and her replies into the increasingly lengthy discussion feel like a frustrated townie. Throughout, she continues to scum hunt, looking at myself, heury, among others. Her reads look okay and nothing seems particularly suspicious. Interactions don't really lead me to believe that she has chat. On the whole, play looks solidly townie.
Notes:
Spoiler:
-Setup commentary. Comments that moody's IGMEOY seems a bit harsh, retracts immediately.
-Calls out plytho for active lurking (too early, IMHO, but I see where she's coming from)
-Explains how tied lynch is marginally favorable to town which leads her to think two mafia. Calls out plytho for active lurking again.
-Explains a bunch of stuff about rule #2. Calls out heury's meta read on her as suspect, meta reads heury in return. Helpful to Peaceful Whale.
-Argues Rule #2 with Sabrar, comments to plytho that she had expected Sabrar to ask her to explain her meta read. Goes on to explain the read. A little thin, maybe, but seems okay. Notes apple comment.
-Gives some examples of simple/complex setups, gives cagey reply to heury's "Who would you kill tonight" comment. Will come back to this on heury read. Calls me out on reading her as "less townie than usual"
-Argues a bit with Sabrar re: Rule #2, meta.
-Discussion of read lists vs summaries with Sabrar. Notes possible collusion between plytho and Sabrar on their attacks on her. Extensive reply to Rule #2 questions. Lots of townie pings in this post.
-Reads list. Null on flicky, needs more content. Town lean heury, needs more content. Doesn't care for my replies about why I found plytho's interactions with her off. Scum lean. moody, meta reads as town. Reading as indie. plytho tunneling looks scummy. Sabrar looks townie on meta. Znirk town lean.
-More Rule #2 discussion, some discussion of daychat advantages. Helpful to PW. Votes plytho for tunneling.



flicky: Content is still very light, reads are still mostly non-existent. Marginal improvement in his play since I last read him: he's expressing a few opinions and asking some questions at least. Would like to see more engagement and some updated reads. Moving him to scum lean.
Notes:
Spoiler:
-Joke votes, jokes around with Sabrar a bit.
-A bit of setup spec, defends me from Sabrar.
-Comments on getting a similar meta feeling re: heury as bessie did.
-Reads list. Sabrar/bessie unlikely to be scum/scum. PW apple comment best ignored since it's probably townie. Agree with both of these. Minimal commentary otherwise.
-Helpful to PW. Starts asking some questions. Votes moody for low content.


heury: Fairly quiet overall, especially recently. There's been a couple of things that have pinged me, such as the rolefishing attempt, and he asks a question to bessie that I find a bit skeptical of: "Who would you kill if you were scum tonight", a type of question that was discussed extensively in bin Chicken mafia. This is never followed-up on, so I'm curious to see what his intention was. On the whole, putting him as a scum lean.
Notes:
Spoiler:
-Votes "unvote" as a joke.
-Defensive about my comment that he didn't respond to early wagon. Produces some early reads that seem okay. Reaction here looks townie.
-Comments that Znirk reads look to be mostly rehashing of what has already been said. PW apple comment might be breadcrumb, but doesn't see what it could mean.
-Doesn't think both Sabrar and bessie are scum. Asks bessie "Who would you kill if you were scum tonight". A bit odd that heury would ask this since he correctly recognised the potential dangers of these kind of questions in bin chicken. Never follows up on this.
-Role fishes PW.
-Challenges flicky on moody vote


moody: Not too much content, though the posts that he has made are all pretty decent. Would love to see more out of him. Leaving him as neutral.
Notes:
Spoiler:
-Reaction to early wagon on heury feels townie. A bit of setup spec.
-Early reads terse and short on scum reads, ultimately settling on flicky and Znirk as scum mostly by default.
-Suspicious of plytho for Rule #2 discussion.
-Reads Sabrar/bessie/PW as town. Probes flicky, heury.


Peaceful Whale: Seems to be putting in an honest effort to trying to play. Definitely still has a newbie vibe to him... a lot of his reads feel more like he's taking the reads of two or three other players and kind of mashing them together, rather than coming up with his own conclusions. I feel like if they had a chat partner, their posts would be a bit more polished than they currently are. I'm pretty sure he's town.
Notes:
Spoiler:
-Some early newbishness on the starting wagon, consistent with earlier game.
-Posts some reads. Suspicious of lurkers. I feel like PW is borrowing heavily from other players here, with comments like
[Sabrar] seems to be acting like he always does. A townie, I can't really read him. More than likely town.

this almost feels like he's stuck together my early Sabrar read (I can't read him) with someone else's (feels townie). Mentions the infamous apple here as well.
-Explains his reasoning regarding the Sabrar quote above.
-Correctly reasons out why heury's "Who should you kill if you were scum" question isn't a particularly helpful.
-Some setup speculation. Muses about alternate chat channels.
-Posts town-to-scum list. Looks okay.
-Explains his moody read, suspicious of bessie. Very worried about mislynching.
-Moody/bessie looking better, plytho looking scummier. flicky looking scummy.
-Reads: Sabrar might have chat with plytho, but maybe not. plytho tunneling suspicious. moody neutral lurker. heury lurky, might have seen breadcrumb by PW himself (the way this is phrased is a bit weird). Znirk townie lurker. LaserGuy a bit weird but maybe town. bessie town. flicky scummy for low content. Puts plytho/flicky as scummiest, bessie as towniest (above himself).
-Votes plytho.


plytho: Lack of content is definitely not a problem here. Unfortunately, the bulk of his content is swamped by the weird discussion with bessie about "Rule #2". plytho describes this as tunneling, but it isn't even really that, since as he helpfully noted, he wasn't really trying to make the case that bessie was scummy here, whereas tunneling is usually attempting to scumread someone excessively. What he's actually been posting is basically fluff--trivial discussion that isn't really relevant to the game at all, which he goes on about at great length. This looks scummy in and of itself, and, as I've noted earlier, plytho has done something similar (though not as extreme) in his last scum game.

In terms of his actual content, it's a mixed bag. His scumread on bessie isn't really supported by his arguments; his comment here about daychat is really weird. Most of the reads look okay or at least plausible. Looks scummy. Lots of links to Sabrar.

Notes:
Spoiler:
-Makes the "good question" remark (on Sabrar's post) that induces bessie's active lurking comment. Comments about unique roles.
-Questions bessie about Rule #2, active lurking comment.
-Post on Rule #2.
-Reads post where he comments to a bunch of players. flicky null. My content looks okay. heury defensive. moody lurky. PW newbie. Sabrar null. Znirk null. bessie some stuff on Rule #2. Wants a follow up from bessie on Sabrar's point about her meta read on heury. bessie, heury scum. PW, LaserGuy town.
-Helpful to PW, explains defensiveness read to heury.
-Post on Rule #2, some help to PW.
-More on Rule #2.
-Reaction post. bessie needs to answer questions. flicky scummy. heury fishing. LG townie, but wrong. moody needs more scum reads. Sabrar case on me seems weak. Znirk lurky but content is okay.
-More on Rule #2, replies to Sabrar about his case on me.
-More on Rule #2.
-Weird post that includes this comment about asking for tips on daychat. Votes flicky.
-4 more Rule #2 posts.
-Replies to me that he wasn't using this as a scum read. Then talks about Rule #2 again.
-Replies to my comments about him being scummy.
-Explains that he was reading bessie as townier than his posts seemed to imply. Doesn't agree with Sabrar about indie hunting.
-Updated reads: flicky scummy, needs reads. heury somewhat suspicious. Scum lean. LaserGuy townie despite argument with Sabrar. moody lurking. PW town. Sabrar neutral, doesn't agree with his case on me. Znirk lurky. bessie town lean.
-Helpful to PW.


Sabrar: Nothing too objectionable about his content for the first half of D1. Second half he puts together a case against me. I've explained previously (here and here why I think each point of his case is based on flawed assumptions and premises. I think that this is more likely scum-driven, as I don't think Town!Sabrar would be so lacking in solid scumreads as to need to produce this kind of nonsense.
Notes:
Spoiler:
-Response to early wagon is okay, though I don't agree that scum would hammer here.
-Bunch of setup spec, asks me about my read on bessie/plytho.
-Flicky defending me; heury ignoring joke votes.
-A bit of Rule #2 discussion with bessie.
-Questions bessie's meta read on heury.
-bessie seems scummy to start, now probably town.
-PW town, apple comment irrelevant.
-Explanation to PW about WIFOM.
-Znirk a bit scummy.
-flicky scummy.
-Others town, I feel off.
-Puts together a weak case on me as scum. Jester. plytho/bessie. plytho. Apple.
-Explains scum read to Znirk.
-Explains his case to plytho.
-A bit of Rule #2 discussion with bessie.
-Votes me.
-Responds to bessie needling him about coordinating with plytho.
-flicky less scummy. Asks flicky what he means when he says I'm playing the same as usual.
-Responds to my reply about his case on me.
-Responds to me again.
-Helpful to PW


Znirk: Still very lurky, only four posts with actual content (6 in total). Between this and the fact that his reads are limited in terms of the original content they've actually produced, there's really very little here of substance. Scum lean.
Notes:
Spoiler:
-Joke votes no lynch, some setup spec.
-Reads list, mostly summaries, a bit of commentary.
-Responds to some commentary on him, addresses why he is mostly summarizing at this stage.


Town
LaserGuy
Peaceful Whale
bessie
moody
heury
Znirk
flicky
Sabrar
plytho
Scum

I feel that Sabrar/plytho are roughly interchangeable; Znirk/flicky/heury are roughly interchangeable.

Vote plytho

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Sabrar » Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:02 pm UTC

@LaserGuy: so you're declining to explain why you've lied about finding bessie townie previously, why you're sheeping her and why you're using straw man argument. You continue to throw out wild accusations like plytho having lots of links to me but you're unwilling to provide proof. Oh well. My D1 tunnels are usually wrong but this time you've convinced me.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:12 pm UTC

flicky1991 wrote:[*]plytho - So much of his content so far focuses on bessie's initial setup spec that I can only think of it as intentional. There's no issue with arguing about something if you think there's been a misunderstanding somewhere, but it feels like that's been most of his content and I'm finding it hard to notice anything else notable about him. Fairly scummy.

I think I have more content in my non-bessie posts than some people have all game so calling me out for lack of content is weak.

LaserGuy wrote:plytho: Lack of content is definitely not a problem here. Unfortunately, the bulk of his content is swamped by the weird discussion with bessie about "Rule #2". plytho describes this as tunneling, but it isn't even really that, since as he helpfully noted, he wasn't really trying to make the case that bessie was scummy here, whereas tunneling is usually attempting to scumread someone excessively. What he's actually been posting is basically fluff--trivial discussion that isn't really relevant to the game at all, which he goes on about at great length. This looks scummy in and of itself, and, as I've noted earlier, plytho has done something similar (though not as extreme) in his last scum game.

See, flicky, it's not lack of content!

It's also not entirely trivial. Clearly nobody has been reading my posts, which is immensely frustrating. As I've asked twice for feedback without any response.

In this post I asked bessie if she thought rule #2 favored scum, it took her until this post to answer that she didn't.

That’s all I wanted to talk about. But I couldn’t until it was clear that that’s what I wanted to talk about. It’s a small (not fluff, or trivial) thing but by the time we got there there was no more point to discuss as the game had moved on. It would have been nice if anyone had tried to read my posts and given some feedback on the understandability of them. Just say “plytho, we have no idea what you mean” or “plytho is *this* what you mean, it’s not entirely clear to me” so I can adjust my explanation.

Yeah, by those last posts I wasn’t looking for scum tells anymore and just trying to clear up the whole misunderstanding, which I explicitly stated.

Also as I've noted, last game I was as convinced that Gopher was scum as you were that bessie was scum.

LaserGuy wrote:In terms of his actual content, it's a mixed bag. His scumread on bessie isn't really supported by his arguments; his comment here about daychat is really weird. Most of the reads look okay or at least plausible. Looks scummy. Lots of links to Sabrar.
Yeah, back when I called bessie scum in my reads list it was supported with arguments. When I moved her towards town it was supported by different arguments. Read my posts please.

LaserGuy wrote:his comment here about daychat is really weird.

Why is it weird?
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby flicky1991 » Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:48 pm UTC

plytho wrote:I think I have more content in my non-bessie posts than some people have all game so calling me out for lack of content is weak.
That's why I said I was struggling to find anything else "notable". Amount of content is only worth townie points when it's useful or meaningful.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:55 pm UTC

plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:plytho: Lack of content is definitely not a problem here. Unfortunately, the bulk of his content is swamped by the weird discussion with bessie about "Rule #2". plytho describes this as tunneling, but it isn't even really that, since as he helpfully noted, he wasn't really trying to make the case that bessie was scummy here, whereas tunneling is usually attempting to scumread someone excessively. What he's actually been posting is basically fluff--trivial discussion that isn't really relevant to the game at all, which he goes on about at great length. This looks scummy in and of itself, and, as I've noted earlier, plytho has done something similar (though not as extreme) in his last scum game.


See, flicky, it's not lack of content!

It's also not entirely trivial. Clearly nobody has been reading my posts, which is immensely frustrating. As I've asked twice for feedback without any response.


I think the feedback that you've received has mostly been that you've spent way too much time unproductively on this.

Also as I've noted, last game I was as convinced that Gopher was scum as you were that bessie was scum.


I'm not sure I follow where you're going with this. I agree that you tunneled as scum in Shakespeare, and that I did as well. Do you think that I'm tunneling you this game?

plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:In terms of his actual content, it's a mixed bag. His scumread on bessie isn't really supported by his arguments; his comment here about daychat is really weird. Most of the reads look okay or at least plausible. Looks scummy. Lots of links to Sabrar.


Yeah, back when I called bessie scum in my reads list it was supported with arguments. When I moved her towards town it was supported by different arguments. Read my posts please.


As I noted, you were reading her as scum for most of the game. You wouldn't have said you were okay with voting for her if she was even remotely a townread.

plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:his comment here about daychat is really weird.

Why is it weird?


Well, it kind of sounds like you're jokingly/WIFOMingly asking for strategy tips to play more effectively as a scum with daychat.

Sabrar wrote:@LaserGuy: so you're declining to explain why you've lied about finding bessie townie previously,


I found her town consistently in Diablo; I found her town in D1 of Shakespeare and only read her as scum after she started deliberately acting scummy. In Dark Tower I had her as neutral, though as a whole we found her sufficiently townie and accurate with her reads that we had her nightkilled on N1.

Sabrar wrote:why you're sheeping her


I'm not. The one comment that I said I wasn't going to respond to yet is because I want to hear from bessie first.

Sabrar wrote:and why you're using straw man argument. You continue to throw out wild accusations like plytho having lots of links to me but you're unwilling to provide proof. Oh well.


Very well, here's some examples.
plytho sheeping Sabrar
Sabrar defending plytho
plytho sheeping Sabrar
plytho sheeping Sabrar (bessie read)
Sabrar reads plytho as very townie with no justification
Sabrar attacking me for finding plytho scummy
plytho distancing from Sabrar (LaserGuy read)
plytho distancing from Sabrar
coordination of plytho and Sabrar noted by bessie

Sabrar wrote:My D1 tunnels are usually wrong but this time you've convinced me.


I fear you're bound for disappointment, then.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Sabrar » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:09 pm UTC

Comments inside the quote because it's midnight.

LaserGuy wrote:Very well, here's some examples.
plytho sheeping Sabrar: okay.
Sabrar defending plytho: nope, again you're confusing me attacking bessie with something else entirely. That comment is not at all about plytho.
plytho sheeping Sabrar: okay
plytho sheeping Sabrar (bessie read): okay
Sabrar reads plytho as very townie with no justification: as I did with heury and moody. Was late at night (as noted) but you don't care about anything that would contrradict your 'theory', right?
Sabrar attacking me for finding plytho scummy: established before that this is not a defense of plytho. But you should know that already.
plytho distancing from Sabrar (LaserGuy read): if plytho agrees with me that's a link. If plytho disagrees that's a link as well. If only I knew that it would be that easy to have links to people... :?
plytho distancing from Sabrar: see above
coordination of plytho and Sabrar noted by bessie: so if I say that you agree with bessie about plytho that's suddenly a proof of you two being scum-buddies? Good to know.

You've successfully established that plytho sheeped me. Great. You've shown nothing else other than some really weird sense of logic.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:25 pm UTC

Honestly Sabar you're the one who likes weird logic games. Though I think plytho distanced himself from you becuase it will implicit you as scum if we kill him and he is scum, it seems something that a scum team would do, but I doubt you would let your scum buddy be so obviously scummy, do you still have plytho at the top of your townie list?
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:29 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:I think the feedback that you've received has mostly been that you've spent way too much time unproductively on this.
Sure, I'm clearly asking if you understand me or if I'm minsunderstanding things and you think reasonable feedback is: 'you're spending too much time on this'. That's not an answer to my question and it comes across as 'whatever, we don't care, just shut up'. Yeah, that's not feedback.
LaserGuy wrote:
Also as I've noted, last game I was as convinced that Gopher was scum as you were that bessie was scum.


I'm not sure I follow where you're going with this. I agree that you tunneled as scum in Shakespeare, and that I did as well. Do you think that I'm tunneling you this game?
Seriously? I'm saying I tunnel when I hunt for scum. It's right there. Do you not see me saying that?

LaserGuy wrote:
plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:In terms of his actual content, it's a mixed bag. His scumread on bessie isn't really supported by his arguments; his comment here about daychat is really weird. Most of the reads look okay or at least plausible. Looks scummy. Lots of links to Sabrar.


Yeah, back when I called bessie scum in my reads list it was supported with arguments. When I moved her towards town it was supported by different arguments. Read my posts please.


As I noted, you were reading her as scum for most of the game. You wouldn't have said you were okay with voting for her if she was even remotely a townread.

As I replied to your note:
plytho wrote: While I didn't actually call her town yet, I was starting to think it was all a misunderstanding here and I said I wasn't adamant about her being scum here. In that post where I said I could vote for her I was under the impression that bessie was avoiding my questions and figured a vote might pressure her into answering.
So, repeating myself: I changed my mind. I explained what I found scummy at the time:
1. the early active lurker comment
2. the meta read on heury
3. the refusal to answer my question
I found these sufficient for an early scum read. You at least partially agreed about the first point calling it 'off'. Are you saying this isn't sufficient for an early D1 scum read?

LaserGuy wrote:
plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:his comment here about daychat is really weird.

Why is it weird?


Well, it kind of sounds like you're jokingly/WIFOMingly asking for strategy tips to play more effectively as a scum with daychat.

Ha! I can understand bessie and heury's interpretation that I'm implying I don't have chat by saying this. But thinking I'm fishing for tips to play as scum, that's funny.

My point was that daychat is a strong scum power. bessie agrees with that here.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:31 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:Comments inside the quote because it's midnight.

LaserGuy wrote:Very well, here's some examples.
Sabrar defending plytho: nope, again you're confusing me attacking bessie with something else entirely. That comment is not at all about plytho.
Sabrar attacking me for finding plytho scummy: established before that this is not a defense of plytho. But you should know that already.


Attacking the person who attacks your scumbuddy is the same as defending them, just slightly better disguised.

Sabrar wrote:Sabrar reads plytho as very townie with no justification: as I did with heury and moody. Was late at night (as noted) but you don't care about anything that would contrradict your 'theory', right?


You read him as "very" townie. You didn't read the others that way.

Sabrar wrote:
: if plytho agrees with me that's a link. If plytho disagrees that's a link as well. If only I knew that it would be that easy to have links to people... :?


A link is a connection. The fact that plytho specifically chose to comment on that particular read, as opposed to others, is a link. Doesn't mean it's an important one, but links can be useful to establish patterns of behaviour.

Sabrar wrote:
: so if I say that you agree with bessie about plytho that's suddenly a proof of you two being scum-buddies? Good to know.


Proof, no. Would I expect you to use it as evidence? Sure.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:32 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:Honestly Sabar you're the one who likes weird logic games. Though I think plytho distanced himself from you becuase it will implicit you as scum if we kill him and he is scum, it seems something that a scum team would do, but I doubt you would let your scum buddy be so obviously scummy, do you still have plytho at the top of your townie list?

That's actually a good point :D If I had a buddy to chat with I'm sure they'd have stopped me a long time ago. Alas, I'm on my own, screaming into the void as I believe your sig used to say.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:44 pm UTC

plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:I think the feedback that you've received has mostly been that you've spent way too much time unproductively on this.


Sure, I'm clearly asking if you understand me or if I'm minsunderstanding things and you think reasonable feedback is: 'you're spending too much time on this'. That's not an answer to my question and it comes across as 'whatever, we don't care, just shut up'. Yeah, that's not feedback.


It's not useful feedback to answering the specific question that you're interested in. But when multiple players start telling you that they don't understand why you're still going on about this, maybe it's time you start asking yourself the same question.

plytho wrote: Seriously? I'm saying I tunnel when I hunt for scum. It's right there. Do you not see me saying that?


Yes, but in that game you were scum. You didn't do this in Dark Tower, where you were Town, or in Diablo, where you were Town.

plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:In terms of his actual content, it's a mixed bag. His scumread on bessie isn't really supported by his arguments; his comment here about daychat is really weird. Most of the reads look okay or at least plausible. Looks scummy. Lots of links to Sabrar.


Yeah, back when I called bessie scum in my reads list it was supported with arguments. When I moved her towards town it was supported by different arguments. Read my posts please.


At the time of this post did you think bessie was town?

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:49 pm UTC

Plytho is VERY scummy to me...
I thought he was before it was mainstream. 8-)

(Just worried about voiceing it, in case everyone agrees with me, we lynch him, and he was the doctor :( )
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Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Znirk » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:09 pm UTC

Rereading in a player-by-player manner:

What about Sabrar?

I like that he asks questions about details that stick out, and responds to questions. I don't like that there is a whole series of virtually content-free "This and that happened in such and such game last year" posts in the first phase.

Drills into Bessie on a perceived inconsistency that hinges on understanding the very last sentence before a conclusion as that conclusion's only supporting argument. May be a genuine misunderstandig, but may be a pretext to generate noise. They resolve it and move on.

AFACIT the first person who proposed specific lynchees (Laserguy or Flicky). I'm willing to give him townie brownie points on this, even though pre-reread my last impression of Laserguy was town. (Pre-post-edit: Still is.)

Generally: active player, attentive to detail. Experienced, expected to be hard to read. On the whole I'll carefully assume town.


What about Plytho?

Takes a moment and a few posts to warm up, which I called and still call not necessarily scummy.

Joins in on Sabrar's bessie-poking over the underexplained setup, and will not let go of it. Admits that this probably won't help decide on anyone's scumminess (which raises the question of what else, other than sheer curiosity, may be going on here.)

Reminds us that scum will have daychat. On balance, I'm liking the reminder though it should be common knowledge.

Goes into detail, asks for clarifications, focused. I guess this mainly demonstrates him a good player, but not necessarily one on the side of Good.

A good impression overall, but there's something potentially dodgy about his stringing out the Bessie débâcle.


What about Moody?

OMGUS alert: Moody doesn't seem to like me.

Not a whole lot of content: somewhat regular posting, but it's mostly very terse nudges. One reads list - Moody, care to update, elaborate or reconsider anything here?

I don't like that he votes me (since I'm obviously town), and I don't like the low information density per post; but gut feeling wise I'll still go with "busy town" rather than "scum lying low".


What about Whale?

New player, takes a while to move beyond note-to-self clarifications on what just happened.

The "apple" thing, which he himself hasn't ever commented on or acknowledged in any way as far as I can see.

First reads list pretty early on, but later comment says it's early days and most people are looking fairly townish.

Whale feels distinct from ordinary town, but possibly just because some of his comments are in learning and clarification mode. In a way that speaks against his being in the mafia chat though. Do we perhaps have an indie after all?

It's a logic vs. gut thing. I'm very, very undecided about Whale right now.


What about Heury?

Ah yes, the "haha" issue that pinged me in my first big read. I should probably clarify that it's not the "haha" itself, and it's not that he used "haha" in preference to "lol": it's the whole rushed appearance of that one post, and the fact that there even was any sort of "lol" synonym present. But in Heury's favour, he wasn't really under a whole lot of pressure that I can see; so maybe he was simply in an extrinsic rush and I was overreacting to phone fingered overly colloquial posting there. Letting that one go for now.

Odd comment about "town players should be stubborn about their opinions". I disagree with that, a lot. I asked one of my few questions on that matter here, with no concrete result that I can see. Admittedly I never pushed for an answer either. Heury, care to comment now?

Calls Plytho's post winey because ... Plytho posted from the point of view of a town player, I think? But that's kind of the expectation. I say I'm town, you say you're town, everybody says they're town. So really this is Heury taking a cheap shot at Plytho for nothing more nor less than playing the game. Heury, am I misinterpreting you there? What exactly did you find winey?

No, Heury still doesn't feel right.


What about Laserguy?

Oscillates between chatty/conversational posting style and very terse two-word comments.

In the "apple" context, warns against town players claiming anything. He is of course right, and I really should have said that myself when bringing up the apple, given that the issue involves Whale who seems to be unsure about some aspects of Mafia.

Gets into a debate with Sabrar, and comes out looking pretty good to me. I'm not necessarily convinced with everything he says, but he brings up good points.

Overall: no real change, looks like town to me.


What about Bessie?

Begins with a bit of setup speculation that half the players call her out on. Calls Plytho out for early-game minimalism.

According to her explanations she's more of an impressionistic player than a Constructor of Logic Superstructure, which is a trait I can get behind.

Like Sabrar, Bessie has some early-game meta and past games discussion, none of which is immediately helpful to my mind.

Spends a lot of text arguing with Plytho and, at first, Sabrar about phrasing from her first post-confirmation post. On balance, not primarily her fault I think.

Several occasions of lampshading her own wine and active-lurky posts. A matter of personal style perhaps (point out flaws instead of editing them out), but the flaws are still there.

Relatively high on the words-per-idea index, but I read this as forgivable since she does long posts which end up with reasonable levels of content each (rather than shotgunning near-meaningless sentence fragments all over the thread).

Mostly posting on details and reactions. One overview reads post, which looks entirely fine to me.

All in all, likely town.


What about Flicky?

Slight sympathy point for a distinctive avatar, making him easier to find in the thread than the Shared Shades of Brown of Sabrar, Plytho and Bessie.

Asks specific questions, but doesn't produce a whole lot of material of his own. There's that post "mentioning everyone", which does little more than mention in many cases, and a recent broader reads post.

It may be because it's 1am here now, but given that some people have Flicky on the scummy side of their list, his contributions feel more oriented towards pushing the attention elsewhere than responding to concerns. Scummy side of neutral for me.


TOWN
Bessie, Laserguy
Sabrar, Moody
Plytho
Whale, Flicky
Heury
SCUM

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:11 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:
plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:I think the feedback that you've received has mostly been that you've spent way too much time unproductively on this.


Sure, I'm clearly asking if you understand me or if I'm minsunderstanding things and you think reasonable feedback is: 'you're spending too much time on this'. That's not an answer to my question and it comes across as 'whatever, we don't care, just shut up'. Yeah, that's not feedback.


It's not useful feedback to answering the specific question that you're interested in. But when multiple players start telling you that they don't understand why you're still going on about this, maybe it's time you start asking yourself the same question.
Yeah and I did that.

You say something about it here, flicky says something about it here. I’m in the process of changing my mind a couple of posts later here.

This is after I’ve explicitly asked twice to give me feedback. If I explicitly ask: what do you guys think of this and your feedback is to write “plytho’s acting weird with those posts” that’s frustrating and it feels like you don’t want to engage with me.

LaserGuy wrote:
plytho wrote: Seriously? I'm saying I tunnel when I hunt for scum. It's right there. Do you not see me saying that?


Yes, but in that game you were scum. You didn't do this in Dark Tower, where you were Town, or in Diablo, where you were Town.

Yeah, that’s true, but Diablo was my first game and I barely played in the Dark Tower. Also, I wasn’t misunderstood in either of those games.
LaserGuy wrote:
plytho wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:In terms of his actual content, it's a mixed bag. His scumread on bessie isn't really supported by his arguments; his comment here about daychat is really weird. Most of the reads look okay or at least plausible. Looks scummy. Lots of links to Sabrar.


Yeah, back when I called bessie scum in my reads list it was supported with arguments. When I moved her towards town it was supported by different arguments. Read my posts please.


At the time of this post did you think bessie was town?


I was in the process of changing my mind. I definitely wasn’t certain she was town but I was becoming less sure she was scum. In that post I was clearly waiting for an answer from bessie (point 3 of my scum read in my previous post). The threat of the vote was to draw out a response. In my next post I say I’m not adamant she’s scum.

So yeah, I was entertaining the idea that she might be scum, but the odds of her being town were starting to grow. I don’t know why that specific post is so important to you.

Time to sleep now.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:53 pm UTC

Maybe I'm being dazzled by his style but I really like Znirk's reads post.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby bessie » Tue Aug 15, 2017 4:47 am UTC

I had a situation today and just got home a little while ago. Reading through today's content now. I will be at work at deadline, so if anyone has anything they want me to reply to please post it before 8:00 am PDT.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Sabrar » Tue Aug 15, 2017 5:39 am UTC

@bessie: you like ordered town-scum lists or so I've heard. How about you make one? :)

And before anyone asks I will present mine once I get to work.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Znirk » Tue Aug 15, 2017 5:56 am UTC

vote heuristically-alone

... not because I read him as extremely scummy, but because there's currently no one I'm reading scummier.

I suppose I could also get behind lynching Flicky. Out of the bottom three off my ordered list, I would prefer to leave Whale alive for now: not only to give the new guy a chance to actually play the game, but also because my read on him has the longest error bars and is potentially indie-flavoured.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby BoomFrog » Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:06 am UTC

12 hours until deadline. I'm a little busy sorry if someone else could post unofficial vote totals that would be nice, thank you.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby bessie » Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:24 am UTC

Picking up where I left off.

LaserGuy wrote:
plytho wrote:Sabrar: I’m not convinced by Sabrar’s case on LaserGuy.

And Sabrar doesn't agree with you on bessie. Fortunately you both have flicky as your second scummiest read and will reluctantly agree to him as a compromise lynch.
I thought this was really funny and I’m not sure why.

LaserGuy wrote:
Sabrar wrote:So you're openly contemplating the possibility of me and plytho being scum-buddies twice and then you're wondering why I'm reacting to it. Sure.

I have a feeling that I've seen this happen before. Was it jimbob in Dark Tower, bessie?
This comment did concern me a bit. I think the intent is to point me toward my super scummy read of jimbob in that game and SDK’s deflection away from jimbob and back toward me, which was disappointingly missed by everyone else. The concern is because I’m not sure yet if LaserGuy is trying to influence my read, or if he is just making a note.

LaserGuy wrote:
plytho wrote:EBWOP: at this point I just want to understand bessie and make myself understood. I'm aware this won't lead to a scum read and it's all a big misunderstanding but I really really want to clear this up.

So... why are you using this as a scum read on bessie?

And if it's just a misunderstanding that is completely irrelevant to what's actually happening, why are you investing so many words in it? I didn't think you were active lurking at the start of the game, but this is practically the definition of active lurking.
+1, QFT, blah blah blah. I have a feeling I will probably return to this at some point in this post.

Sabrar wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:For someone so obsessed with logic I'm surprised your logic has failed so badly here. Scum has daychat. Therefore if Peaceful Whale is trying to signal someone here, it isn't a scum partner.
moody said that the first thing he thought of when he saw the 'signal' was Lyncher. bessie agrees with him. I don't but that's irrelevant. You are basing your argument on the assumption that it must be a 'good' signal when in theory it could just be a hook to see who the target is. Lyncher is usually anti-town, so catching him is a townie thing to do. But you're dismissing any possibility that does not fit your pov.
I agree with this, I think (what do you mean by a “good” signal?). My first thought was that it was a lyncher fishing for a slip from the target. It wasn’t my only thought, but it was my first. And I can’t see how anyone would think it was mafia signaling a partner with whom they have chat (except plytho, who forgot mafia has daychat :) ).

plytho wrote:@all: did anyone get that this was my point?
Yeah, I think we’re done here.

plytho wrote: bessie isn't my scummiest read, flicky is, hence my vote. If you still think I'm reading bessie as scum you haven't been reading my posts. I disagreed with bessie on one specific point and took three days to explain that. My initial scum read referred to other things and if I thought bessie was scummy because of that specific point I would have mentioned that. Saying stuff like "yeah, I'm convinced bessie is scum because..." I didn't because I wasn't.
Oops, spoke too soon.

plytho wrote:In that post where I said I could vote for her I was under the impression that bessie was avoiding my questions and figured a vote might pressure her into answering.
I think one of the problems is that, except for an initial poke at plytho, I didn’t avoid this question. I did my best to answer/explain it. Here. Here. Here. Here. Here. Here. And here. I have spent most of D1 composing posts explaining a misreading of my first post, which have included self-deprecating explanations of my thought process accompanied by flow diagrams. And I’m still discussing this. What did you want me to say? Oh shit you caught me because of course only scum would base their entire setup speculation on an obviously misleading interpretation of Rule #2?

Peaceful Whale wrote:8. bessie - Attacked by Sabar and plytho. Has posted a lot, mainly defending themselves. I believe she's town, thinks PW is and indie. I feel like they haven't scum hunted as much. (Pause to glare at plytho and Sabar for taking up all of Bessie's time) and she's on my top townie list.
Dude you read my mind.

And Peaceful Whale, you don’t need to make a post just to correct a typo, like this one. We all make typos and can’t correct them, and we’re used to reading through them. You only need to correct it if the typo changes the meaning of the post (like if you said “can” instead of “can’t”).

flicky1991 wrote:Heuristically_alone - His game has improved since previous games. I am liking the effort he's putting into putting forward ideas and questions, even if I don't always agree with them. Quite townie.
I agree with you in that I think heury’s content has improved a lot over his previous game, but I’m curious as to what in particular has earned your strongest town read (not including Peaceful Whale because part of that is a newbie read).

Oh wow a long reads list from LaserGuy. I might need to come back to this later.

plytho’s still talking about me me me!

plytho wrote:That's actually a good point :D If I had a buddy to chat with I'm sure they'd have stopped me a long time ago. Alas, I'm on my own, screaming into the void as I believe your sig used to say.
Thanks for the reminder that you don't have chat, I had forgotten your previous reminder!

Znirk, I like your post and your posting style, a lot. I would like to find some specific things to pull out and discuss, but I’m running out of steam. Maybe in the morning. On D2, please post earlier and often!

me me me

Sabrar wrote:@bessie: you like ordered town-scum lists or so I've heard. How about you make one? :)

And before anyone asks I will present mine once I get to work.
Someone did ask!
Peaceful Whale wrote: do you still have plytho at the top of your townie list?


List coming soon, let me organize my thoughts.

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby bessie » Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:31 am UTC

Unofficial votals:

plytho (3) : bessie, LaserGuy, Peaceful Whale
moody7277 (1) : flicky1991
Znirk (1) : moody7277
flicky1991 (1) : plytho
LaserGuy (1) Sabrar
heuristically_alone (1) Znirk

Not voting: heuristically_alone

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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby flicky1991 » Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:58 am UTC

bessie wrote:
flicky1991 wrote:Heuristically_alone - His game has improved since previous games. I am liking the effort he's putting into putting forward ideas and questions, even if I don't always agree with them. Quite townie.
I agree with you in that I think heury’s content has improved a lot over his previous game, but I’m curious as to what in particular has earned your strongest town read (not including Peaceful Whale because part of that is a newbie read).
He's the strongest read because I didn't read anyone as stronger. I didn't specifically think "heury's content looks so good he is townier than everyone else", I just rated everyone independently then ordered my results.
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Sabrar » Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:59 am UTC

LaserGuy wrote:Attacking the person who attacks your scumbuddy is the same as defending them, just slightly better disguised.
Except I don't have a scum-buddy.

LaserGuy wrote:You read him as "very" townie. You didn't read the others that way.
Oh yes. Let's pick at specific words like scum!plytho did in Shakespeare. Brilliant tactic.

LaserGuy wrote:A link is a connection. The fact that plytho specifically chose to comment on that particular read, as opposed to others, is a link. Doesn't mean it's an important one, but links can be useful to establish patterns of behaviour.
LaserGuy distancing heury
LaserGuy sheeping heury
LaserGuy coaching heury (so it appears as though they don't have chat)
LaserGuy distancing heury again

I could do the same with bessie or plytho or Peaceful Whale (with even more links) it's just that I'm pressed for time and grabbed the first person you interacted with.

LaserGuy wrote:Proof, no. Would I expect you to use it as evidence? Sure.
You don't seem to get it. You're using a comment from player A to show a link between B and C. If you don't understand how that's inherently wrong then it's really no use talking about it any further.

By the way you read-list contains 2 town-reads, 1 neutral and 5 scum-leans. Another classic scum-tell.

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plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:08 am UTC

bessie wrote:
plytho wrote:@all: did anyone get that this was my point?
Yeah, I think we’re done here.

Right, I was looking for that third time I asked everyong if they understood me without getting an answer :D

bessie wrote:
plytho wrote: bessie isn't my scummiest read, flicky is, hence my vote. If you still think I'm reading bessie as scum you haven't been reading my posts. I disagreed with bessie on one specific point and took three days to explain that. My initial scum read referred to other things and if I thought bessie was scummy because of that specific point I would have mentioned that. Saying stuff like "yeah, I'm convinced bessie is scum because..." I didn't because I wasn't.
Oops, spoke too soon.
Yeah, this is me clarifying myself after being misunderstood.

bessie wrote:
plytho wrote:In that post where I said I could vote for her I was under the impression that bessie was avoiding my questions and figured a vote might pressure her into answering.
I think one of the problems is that, except for an initial poke at plytho, I didn’t avoid this question. I did my best to answer/explain it. Here. Here. Here. Here. Here. Here. And here. I have spent most of D1 composing posts explaining a misreading of my first post, which have included self-deprecating explanations of my thought process accompanied by flow diagrams. And I’m still discussing this. What did you want me to say? Oh shit you caught me because of course only scum would base their entire setup speculation on an obviously misleading interpretation of Rule #2?
I'm not saying you were avoiding it, I'm saying I was under that impression.
I was asking questions about X, you were answering questions about Y. Big misunderstanding. For example: a couple of those posts you mention are in between this post with my questions and this post where you answer them.
Also, I'm not convinced I was misreading you since you confirmed what I initially thought here. I no longer think you're scum.

What I initially expected:
bessie: I think X
plytho: you're wrong to think X
possible responses:
A: plytho, you're right, I'm wrong about that :arrow: townie points
B: plytho, you're wrong, here's solid reasoning why :arrow: townie points
C: plytho, you're wrong, flimsy reasoning :arrow: scummy points

what I didn't expect:
D: plytho, you're wrong about Y
plytho: yeah, but X
repeat until frustrated

In response to questions!

bessie wrote:
plytho wrote:That's actually a good point :D If I had a buddy to chat with I'm sure they'd have stopped me a long time ago. Alas, I'm on my own, screaming into the void as I believe your sig used to say.
Thanks for the reminder that you don't have chat, I had forgotten your previous reminder!
you're welcome :wink:

bessie wrote:
me me me
Responding to people's motivation to vote for me. I'm not bringing this up to make any point about you anymore. Just trying to defend myself.
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Sabrar
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby Sabrar » Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:09 am UTC

@plytho: I fully understand your frustration from personal experience, however I should note that I was almost always scum when I found myself in your shoes.

TOWN
Peaceful Whale
bessie
heury (due to WIFOM)
flicky (pending reread)
moody (don't like his vote being the 5th wagon)
Znirk (haven't played with town!Znirk too much, I misread him in MMM II, don't like his vote being the 6th wagon)
plytho (should LaserGuy not be scum, otherwise much higher)
LaserGuy
SCUM

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plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 176
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Re: Refrigerator Mafia - D1 - The Purge Begins

Postby plytho » Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:12 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:You read him as "very" townie. You didn't read the others that way.
Oh yes. Let's pick at specific words like scum!plytho did in Shakespeare. Brilliant tactic.
I hear scum!plytho did quite wel in Shakespeare :D

bessie wrote:I had a situation today and just got home a little while ago.
Is everything ok?

Sabrar wrote:@plytho: I fully understand your frustration from personal experience, however I should note that I was almost always scum when I found myself in your shoes.
Thanks!
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Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie


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