Crossover Mafia | Game!

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Sabrar
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Sabrar » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:20 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:He's scum leaning mpolo because of his claim.
And it was important to you to defend mpolo even though Maven's the only one to find him scummy? Why the rush?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby heuristically_alone » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:22 am UTC

Why do things have to be significant? It was beginning of d1 where players are grasping to find content to build off of.
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:38 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:He's scum leaning mpolo because of his claim.
And it was important to you to defend mpolo even though Maven's the only one to find him scummy? Why the rush?

Huh? I don't care about any of that, I care about Maven's response.
heuristically_alone wrote:Why do things have to be significant? It was beginning of d1 where players are grasping to find content to build off of.

So regardless of which answer I gave, you would have gotten nothing out of it?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby heuristically_alone » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:41 am UTC

Do you think it is unimportant when a player orders their reads from most scummy to least scummy, or works you rather have reads put in groups, town and scum?
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:47 am UTC

You thought that was important a page into the game?

Chuckling at your inability to just give me a straight answer.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby #HBC | Red Ryu » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:54 am UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:What does playing up my posts mean.

Not scum, you'll regret lynching me.

Seriously though, I can roleclaim if that helps.

What's with the woofs and barks?


Nah we should lynch you.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby #HBC | Red Ryu » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:55 am UTC

BoomFrog wrote:Lots of fun stuff going on. I just started a new job this week so I'm a bit busy but I'll catch up soon. I haven't even read the last few posts above this one.

@Sabrar: It's too early to be clarifying things. That's not how we catch scum.

@Moody: :D

vote Peaceful Whale


Why is clarifying bad?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby #HBC | Red Ryu » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:57 am UTC

moody7277 wrote:
#HBC | Red Ryu wrote:What makes you think of a jester or a cult?


It seems like we have more than our fair share of jesters, and I find the role distasteful in the extreme. Fortunately, I am allowing myself to be convinced by FrozenFlame that there won't be any. As for cult, that is purely based off of game size. In a small game, they've already won by the time you know what's happening. It's also distasteful, because you basically have to make a deal with the devil in order to get rid of them.


So people use that role here? Wow sounds fun though

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby #HBC | Red Ryu » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:58 am UTC

plytho wrote:Mpolo’s claim is weird. I think it makes more sense for town to claim than for scum though.

Gamma Emerald wrote:Also mpolo's role sound Nexus/Mass Redirector-y. Maybe a decent lynch?
Gamma Emerald wrote:@moody: it's more "this is a safe lynch if we need one", as it's not a super-vital role, like Cop.
I don’t understand what you mean by ‘safe lynch’, could you explain?

#HBC | Red Ryu wrote:Is whale playing up his posts?
What do you mean? I don't understand the expression.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:
Peaceful Whale wrote:
What's with the woofs and barks?
It's doggo. I took a bit in high school, but I'm not completely fluent. It's a tonal language so words can mean different things depending on how you say them. For example, "Woof!" means "yes", but "Woof!" means "no".
As per fundamental rule 8 “you must post in English when typing a post” :wink:

I'm not getting any strong scum vibes from anyone for now.


Playing being dumb.

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Maven89
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Maven89 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:02 am UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:Honestly, I don't want to kill anyone, if I really had too, it would be one of the lurkers, becuase they're lurking. I don't know which one.


Right now I don't want to kill anyone either, there's not enough to comfortably say what anyone's alignment is. But we have to, and I'm trying to get you to give a read. Plenty of people have made posts against people, including myself. You haven't commented on any of them, and that makes me suspicious. Your'e active, but at the same time you're not here. That's the perfect spot for scum to be in, if they can get away with it (as you seem to know based on how you said your previous game went), so I don't want you to be in that spot. For example, how do you feel about Zynth? How do you feel about Boomfrog? How do you feel about the roleclaims that have already happened? If you don't think anyone has given off town or scum vibes, then why haven't they? Expand on it. I'm not asking you to give us a wall, but at least one or two points on a few people that have been discussed.


BoomFrog wrote:I agree with Sabrar after Sabrar posted his extra evidence. Frozenflame agreed with Sabrar before the extra evidence. When Frozenflame agreed, it was with no real reason and feels jumping on a wagony. Did that explain my seeming contradiction?


No. if you thought Sabrar was scummy for his push, why did you go along with it? Why not vote Sabar, or ask him about it? If Whale is scummy, then why would Frozenflame be scummy for jumping on his bandwagon? Scum jump on bandwagons for townies, not fellow mafia members. You can't hold the opinion that Whale is scum and Frozen is scum for wanting to lynch him.

With that said, I will admit that I didn't remember this thread correctly. I thought Sabar had voted Whale, and Boomfrog had voted with him, then Frozen voted, and Boomfrog jumped off and is throwing shade at Frozen. Sabar and Frozen never voted for whale, they just mentioned suspicion of him. So this isn't nearly as suspicious as I first thought, but Boomfrog voting with someone he thought suspicious for reasons he didn't agree with "to add pressure" still is, as is him holding both frozen and whale scummy.

moody7277 wrote:
Maven89 wrote:[questions about my opinion of mpolo's claim]


Basically, mpolo's claim looks to be a "statement against interest", meaning that he's claiming a role that at this point doesn't look useful for town. Without a good info base you could give a cop a false town reading on scum instead of bouncing scum's NK back onto scum. As far as what I would expect to see if it were deployed, I figure there would be some confusion among the reactions of actors and targets. Since we haven't had any reports of results more than "I did nothing N0", mpolo's statement is not likely to be corroborated. I'm willing to put this aside now, was only answering now since you brought it up.

ETA: Yeah, what Zyth said.


My question was "Why do you think people would reveal the evidence" and how would most of them even know? I'm not arguing that he did use his role, far as I can tell there's no evidence either way, but you seemed way too easy to believe him, on the basis that no one claimed their roles were redirected. Regardless, I got what I wanted from this question.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:I like it. I don't think it is the claim that a mafia member would make, which would leave town or indy. I think it would be a really bad play to make as indy. No one wants their abilities redirected, especially scum. Scum would want to get rid of a town/indy polo as soon as possible. So as indy, this move wouldn't make much sense. Also as someone else stated (moody, I think), if he did indeed use his ability n0, this would have a high chance of eventually coming out as we progressed through the game. Furthermore, if mpolo did use their ability n0, they would have no idea which abilities they were redirecting, so lying about it d1 would be a huge risk because their n0 targets could easily call bs.

@Maven, what do you think of this reasoning?


I feel you jump over the part where you explain it's not a gambit scum would make. But as for the rest

Maven89 wrote:I don't want to lynch mr.polo for it (yet), I want him to respond and explain himself.


emphasis added

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Maven89 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:04 am UTC

Also there's no reason to assume Madge has a negative role that can only target people that vote for him. Just throwing it out there

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Sabrar » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:08 am UTC

Maven89 wrote:Also there's no reason to assume Madge has a negative role that can only target people that vote for him. Just throwing it out there
Where does this observation come from? What prompted it?
And btw Madge prefers she/her.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Maven89 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:10 am UTC

Maven89 wrote:Also there's no reason to assume Madge has a negative role that can only target people that vote for him. Just throwing it out there


No reason to not* assume

Re-reading, Heuristically_Alone seems way too shaken up by Zynth calling him scum so early. It was definitely pushing Zynth as scum then backtracking while defending Whale. I know other's have brought it up but I see it as well

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Maven89 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:13 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:And btw Madge prefers she/her.


Apologies.

heuristically_alone wrote:Do you think it is unimportant when a player orders their reads from most scummy to least scummy, or works you rather have reads put in groups, town and scum?


I'm not the person you asked, but I don't see how it could be important.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Maven89 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:18 am UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Maven89: Only one post, with nothing much worth commenting on (although see my earlier question directed at him). Actually, never mind, I'm shouting role-fishing here - his question at mpolo assumes a role that mpolo might or might not have based on mpolo's limited claim, then asks for why he claimed that role so early. An obvious response to that would be "I did/did not claim that role - I am more such and such a role" or whatever. Small scum lean as a result.


Just saw this. That's not what I asked. I asked why he claimed, and brought up also that a redirect role (what other redirect roles are there other than a bus driver?) is normally a scum role. I was not asking for more information on his role, in fact I don't really care. I'm still curious why he claimed and why he claimed he had a redirect. I'd really, really appreciate it if people would let polo respond on his own, because at this point, if he is scum, lying, or any other possiblity, he could just pick one of the answers everyone in this thread have so nicely provided for him.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Evil George Washington » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:24 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:He's scum leaning mpolo because of his claim.
And it was important to you to defend mpolo even though Maven's the only one to find him scummy? Why the rush?


If you believe a person is trust worthy, do you withhold your thoughts on it or do you give it as soon as possible? Why wait?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Sabrar » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:32 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:If you believe a person is trust worthy, do you withhold your thoughts on it or do you give it as soon as possible? Why wait?

I'm absolutely the wrong guy to answer this because personally I never wait (can link a really funny example later if you're interested).
However as some players already mentioned people should generally let others defend themselves first (same way as they shouldn't answer questions not posed to them). Plus if there's no immediate rush to lynch someone then you can learn a lot on how others react to the situation before you defend that player.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Evil George Washington » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:36 am UTC

I would love seeing the funny example. Also I think you have a point. Question though, why do you personally never wait?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Evil George Washington » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:36 am UTC

Should I be concerned that Sir Gabriel has viewed multiple times without any post yet? I still have a question to him.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Sabrar » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:47 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Question though, why do you personally never wait?
Because I love playing this game and playing means posting for me. I simply cannot sit and wait in peace.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby bessie » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:16 am UTC

More reactions, starting with page 4.
Evil George Washington wrote:We are pretty direct and aggressive, yes. I get the feeling you guys prefer to give read lists instead of vote. I don't have solid reads on the whole cast yet. I want people to put out a vote. Voting is our tool for finding scum, so I don't believe we should be neglecting it. Currently we have 11 people not voting right now. I want that to improve.
What heury said in the following post. We tend not to vote until closer to deadline. Also, I don’t think I’ve played a game in the four years I’ve been here where a majority was required for a lynch, so we don't always hammer (after which posting is forbidden), especially on D1, so that we can have the maximum amount of discussion time. But we are playing by different rules now so I will try to have a vote down within the next day.

Zyth, thanks for the information re Overswarm’s games in this post, it was extremely helpful. I’m still thinking about the setup (because as already stated I like setup speculation), but I’ll refrain from dragging down the D1 discussion with it, since the majority of players who have played Overswarm’s games believe it would be a waste of time, at least on D1.

Sabrar wrote:Re: my vote on FrozenFlame (never explain the joke)
Ok, this makes sense in an odd way, but I’m not completely following you because there were other games with DGamers in them, or did you mean just the ones in this game?

plytho wrote:
Sabrar wrote:
plytho wrote:I came to the conclusion that it was a throwback because I remembered it from the last game, I hought it was a funny response then. So when I saw it again here I thought 'joke'. So I don't think he thought much about it either.
Same mindset leads to same joke. Not sure I can explain it more clearly.
I'm thinking it's more same person, same joke rather than same alignment, same joke.
Noted.

Peaceful Whale wrote:Honestly, I know not to post that joke anymore. It was a reference to last game. (Not becuase I'm scum). It's gotten everyone worked up, not that much, so I think it's fine to ignore.

To those who realized I said you'd regret killing me. Just realized that it could be seen as breadcruming a suicide bomber role. I'd like to clarify that I am not trying to breadcrumb. Last game I tried to with all my apple mentions... and I failed. I'll leave that to the veterans.

Scum don't read:

(I am a kinda power role, kinda)
(At least this doesn't give scum information, I told them not to read.


You can read again.
Hmm, I wasn’t even thinking suicide bomber. What made you think suicide bomber? And good job pointing out what part of your post scum shouldn’t read so they know to skip it. By the way, did you even read what you signed up for? This will be the second time I’ve quoted the opening post for you.
#HBC | YOLOSWAG wrote:Bastardry: There are NO Vanilla Roles!


Sabrar wrote:
Evil George Washington wrote:We generally encourage wagoning and having 2 wagons. (We call that competing wagons, maybe you guys do too) There won't be two hammers, just one but we still have plenty of information from those that were on it and those that gave a position off of it.
Good to hear. I've been trying to get players to abandon completely hopeless wagons and making them take sides in one of the leading ones, usually with little success.
I still don’t agree with this. Sabrar, sometimes you can still analyze a vote that’s not on a wagon. :P

plytho wrote:Peaceful Whale: as I said, there’s a possible scum tell in this post. Other than that I’m not seeing the scumminess. I feel like he’s becoming the easy D1 lynch target because of his posting style and I don’t like that.
You don’t think that his lack of scum hunting or failure to post any other useful content might be a factor in people reading him as scum?

Interesting. BoomForg says this:
BoomFrog wrote:scum mpolo would have assumed that revealing his ability would lead to people finding him scummy so would be inclined to secrecy. Revealing his secret info is coming from a place of bring helpful and open. However, I think mechanically just saying "I would like to declare that I withheld N0" would be sufficient to clear up any potential confusion if he died and we started wondering about how he used his power. Therefore he revealed a little too much detail so was slight tactically poor.

However, he earned townie points from me and since my opinion is the most important thing in the game it was a good choice overall. Actually, typing this out I'm leaving more town then Indy on him.

And one minute later Peaceful Whale says this:
Peaceful Whale wrote:Btw, I did not use my ability last night.
In my opinion, Peaceful Whale is trying too hard to act in a way that he thinks town is supposed to act.

Maven89 wrote: I also want to ask everyone else that's not from dgames: are bus driver's normally town here? On the mafia wiki, it says they're a pro-town role, but on dgames they're almost always scum. Hence, the player could think he could safely claim a "pro-town" role early on.
I can’t remember ever seeing this role used where the alignments weren’t randomized (for example there was a town bus driver in Secret Santa 2016, but the RNG could have assigned the role to scum). I wouldn’t see this role as inherently scummy, so I’m thinking that there must have been a town bus driver in a previous game and I’m not remembering where.

Madge wrote:So I need 6 votes at the end of the day today. (In practise I think this is going to be a hard thing to do, because it basically requires 25% of players to be voting for me instead of someone who is actually scummy).
:lol: :lol: :lol: ... Oh, right. You never act scummy. :) ... :D ... :lol:

heuristically_alone wrote:Another reason I think PW is town. As scum, he put on the appearance of wanting to learn to scumhint and asked lots of questions and actually put forth quite a few reads. PW looks more lost here than he did as scum and now that he has to try to do real reads as town, doesn't know where to begin.
Interesting. I like this post, regardless of whether or not I agree with it. It is a well thought out and supported defense of Peaceful Whale, and is everything Plytho’s many many posts defending Peaceful Whale are not.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:@moody what does SDK mean?
SDK is a player. Ask FrozenFlame if he remembers him. SDK and jimbobmacdoodle worked town over in Dark Tower mafia, perfect mafia game (and bessie picked the entire scum team out on D1 and was killed N1 for her awesome reads!).

Sabrar wrote:@bessie: you know I reserve my righteous indignations specially for you (especially when you threaten to NK me). :lol:
I shall do my best to remain worthy of this great honor. :D

I’ll pick this up again later on page 6.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Evil George Washington » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:45 am UTC

Sabrar, tell me more about your thoughts on Moody.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Sabrar » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:49 am UTC

This will as well have to wait until later. It's unlikely I'll have the chance to post in the next 11-12 hours.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Evil George Washington » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:52 am UTC

moody7277 wrote:Well, I guess I'm violating that whole "absence of evidence is not evidence of absence" deal.


Why are you violating that deal? Can you expand on this?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Evil George Washington » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:52 am UTC

Fair enough, Sabrar. Have a good night. I'll be sleeping soon too, then I have work.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby SirGabriel » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:14 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Should I be concerned that Sir Gabriel has viewed multiple times without any post yet? I still have a question to him.

No, that's pretty typical for me. It generally takes a lot more time to compose a good post than to read through the new posts.

Evil George Washington wrote:
SirGabriel wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:For example, Peaceful Whale is scum

Interesting. Is Zyth serious about this, or is this just an SDK-style gambit?


What is your motivation in posting this post? If it was a gambit, why would you point it out before he's produced any results?

Just about everyone around here knows how SDK plays, but it still works. I was asking people who have played with Zen before about his play style, and you have all completely ignored the question just because it doesn't have your name on it.

So let's try again. Evil George Washington, was Zyth serious in the post I quoted or not?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby plytho » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:23 am UTC

Madge’s claim: doesn’t sound like something made up by scum. So either she’s scum with a mechanic that requires votes to activate or town with that mechanic. I’m inclined to believe she’s town. It seems dangerous for scum to out themselves like that.

I’m not sure we should follow along and get six votes for Madge though. I feel this would harm the vote analysis.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:@plythos why do you think that line you bolded of Whale is scummy rather than misguided?
Could be either in his case. I just felt that that was the most scummy thing he posted. It’s a possible scum ping rather than a strong scum ping. Definitely stronger than his reads list joke.

Maven has a good point though in the spoilered quote below.
Spoiler:
Maven89 wrote:
plytho wrote:
Znirk wrote:-> Peaceful Whale: We played together recently. You were scum using your youth and newbitude as a bit of a smokescreen. Now that you can no longer claim to be an utterly confused newbie, what would you say are the most important things you have learned (to do, how to act, what to look out for) over the course of your first couple of games?
Peaceful Whale wrote:I think the most important thing is not looking like scum, it can distract from actual scum hunting, and maybe become a mislynch. Post good read lists (that one was a joke) and be helpful. Try to scum hunt, use your ability wisely.
The bolded (by me) part is the most important for scum, not for town. Town need to find scum and lynch them.


I am not a fan of Peaceful Whale's play, but in this post Zynth specifically asked him what the most important thing he learned from his previous game was, not what the most important thing for a townie in general. Since he followed up his "don't act like scum" line with "because you might get mislynched" (which, btw, is an incredibly important part of being town), I see whale's response to be null (dunno if that's slang here, it means neither towny nor scummy)


@Maven89: you seem to be conflating Znirk and Zyth there

bessie wrote:
plytho wrote:
#HBC | Red Ryu wrote:Is whale playing up his posts?
What do you mean? I don't understand the expression.
Deliberately misleading us by pretending to be more naïve than he is.
I parsed this as bessie calling me out for deliberately misleading people by pretending I didn’t understand the expression :D
Thanks.
@Red Ryu: I don’t think he’s playing up his posts.

bessie wrote:
heuristically_alone wrote:Another reason I think PW is town. As scum, he put on the appearance of wanting to learn to scumhint and asked lots of questions and actually put forth quite a few reads. PW looks more lost here than he did as scum and now that he has to try to do real reads as town, doesn't know where to begin.
Interesting. I like this post, regardless of whether or not I agree with it. It is a well thought out and supported defense of Peaceful Whale, and is everything Plytho’s many many posts defending Peaceful Whale are not.

:roll: pointing out my defense of PW is fair but pointing out my clarifications and answers to questions as more defense of PW is less fair. Can you point out why my points about PW are unsupported and badly thought out?

bessie wrote:
plytho wrote:Peaceful Whale: as I said, there’s a possible scum tell in this post. Other than that I’m not seeing the scumminess. I feel like he’s becoming the easy D1 lynch target because of his posting style and I don’t like that.
You don’t think that his lack of scum hunting or failure to post any other useful content might be a factor in people reading him as scum?
Sure, that’s clear from your posts and from some other’s and I’m not saying you’re definitely wrong. Note that I haven't been attacking your points on PW. I think Sabrar is wrong to think the reads list joke is a scum tell and that others might be jumping on PW because of his style. Like, for example, Red Ryu, who hasn’t really posted anything besides PW is scum and no supporting reasoning.
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Evil George Washington » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:28 am UTC

SirGabriel wrote: I was asking people who have played with Zen before about his play style


No you weren't. Address us next time you have a question for us. Communication is key.

Now that you clarified that it was an actual question (for us) and not a rhetorical question, I can answer. Zen was being semi-serious, to get the ball rolling. It is not uncommon for us to try to spearhead the early game so we can get talking and not dilly dallying in early game.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby moody7277 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 3:06 pm UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:@moody what does SDK mean?


SDK is a player who had been here a while who also did the "Player X is totally scum. Vote" thing. He also had a very good read on most players (amusingly, he always said I was one of his harder reads).

@moody what did you mean by the bolded bit here: "14-4-1(SK)-1(survivor) is my guess on setup, based on Sabrar's numbering. Maybe the survivor position is a jester, or one of the town places swinging over to that. " Town converting into a Jester?


No, in that case I meant that the setup could be 14-4-1-1 or 13-4-1-1-1. In light of FrozenFlame's intel on the mod, I had discounted a jester until Madge's statement (and she's ususlly honest about such claims). Anyway, setup spec is a little old for this point in the game.

@moody why did you base your setup numbering on Sabrar's instead of using your own?


Sabrar's numbers looked like one's I would have thought of on my own, and I've never given much deep thought on balance never having modded a game.

@moody is there a reasong you didn't consider the possibility of two scum teams?


I have never played in a game with two scum teams, although I may have suggested it once or twice. We've only had a couple of games recently that had the size to support them.

@moody was your guess on why I initally scum read h_a correct?


My guess was you found the mention of two scum teams in h_a's first post as possibly extra info town shouldn't have. Since a lot of other people are talking about it, it may not be as suspicious.

@EGW: As BoomFrog said, I'm not actually that new, been playing on and off for a couple years. Off hand, is English a second language for you? Just means I'll have to be careful with colloquialisms if so.

As far as updated reads (mostly on those who I hadn't previously made one), you're doing that lots of pointy questions thing that screams town. Maven also has been doing some of that, but to a lesser extent. Madge's claim is kind of weird, and it also goes against what FrozenFlame had been saying; could just be the "half" part that makes it okay. jimbob's still neutral because what content he's had seems a bit bland. Spak's only content post was mostly reactive, so I put them at about neutral.

Maven89 wrote:My question was "Why do you think people would reveal the evidence" and how would most of them even know?


Glad we could finally get to the heart of that. I guess that properly paranoid town power roles wouldn't out themselves. Without talking about what powers were used and on whom, there of course isn't a way to tell.
The story of my life in xkcdmafia:

Tigerlion wrote:Well, I imagine as the game progresses, various people will be getting moody.


BoomFrog wrote:I still have no idea what town moody really looks like.

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Gamma Emerald » Sat Sep 09, 2017 3:34 pm UTC

@Zyth: I've played with Ranmaru 3 times on mafiascum, including the game with Frozenflame.
As for Madge's claim it looks interesting. Madge, do you gain a shot of an ability each time or the ability to use it for the rest of the game?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby plytho » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:02 pm UTC

Shower thoughts on people in order of how much I remember about them:

People I’m definitely aware of:

Peaceful Whale: I’m thinking newb town. He should listen to bessie and maven, they’re asking the right questions. Should focus on helping town rather than looking like town. Unhelpful townie.
Bessie: pushing PW on the right points neutral-townie
Maven: I like his pushing on moody, Sabrar and PW getting a town vibe from him
Evil George Washington: I like how he's playing, very active and pushing.
Red Ryu: not liking what I'm seeing. There’s no content, just a vote on PW
Dark Horse: The only one that hasn’t posted so far. I’m fine with lynching this lurker.
Mpolo: one post with a claim that I think makes more sense for town than scum. Has explained his absence so is getting more leeway than Madge
Madge: similar to mpolo, claim that makes more sense for town than scum but less of an excuse for lack of content. Mpolo posted too early for opinions on other players. Madge posted after everyone else so should have been able to form at least an opinion on some players.



People I know are in the game but I’m not sure where they’re at, so I need to take a closer look:

Zyth: I have some trouble getting a strong read on him. I look forward to his reads list. Neutral read for now.
Moody: pretty neutral as well. After taking a second look at that reads list it’s not that strong.
Znirk: still only one post? I must have been confusing him with someone else because I thought he was more active. Needs to start providing more content. Has a tendency to lurk if I remember correctly from previous games. I don’t remember if that lurking was when he was scum. Either way lurking helps scum so on the scummy end of neutral.
Boomfrog: Seems to have some similar thoughts to mine but I feel he’s too good a player to solidly read D1.
Sabrar: I kind of feel like Sabrar is less aggressive than he usually is. I may be wrong about this because I can not really point out why. I’ll try to get back to this later.
Jimbob: described my position on PW more eloquently, which I like.
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:I cannot say for certain that his play style is definitely his "scum play style" or his "town play style" as opposed to his "how he always plays play style".
The rest of his posts are bits of reads lists with little new insight. More posts are needed. neutral
Heuristically_Alone: Is on the same page as I am regarding Peaceful Whale. Most of the rest of his content is back and forth with Zyth. Would like to see some opinions on other players. Neutral to townie.


People I kinda forgot about (sorry, 20 people is a lot):

Gamma Emerald: a bunch of short posts, few of them related to this game. Looks active lurky, scummy side of neutral
FrozenFlame: Three pretty big posts but aside from helpful info about OS setups very little original content. A couple of thumbs up on other posts which bessie might call active lurking. Neutral end of scummy.
Spak: not much there yet. Nothing’s pinging me so in the neutral bunch
SirGabriel: Pretty lurky. I don’t like this answer:
SirGabriel wrote:
Evil George Washington wrote:Should I be concerned that Sir Gabriel has viewed multiple times without any post yet? I still have a question to him.

No, that's pretty typical for me. It generally takes a lot more time to compose a good post than to read through the new posts.

While I understand that it takes time to compose a good post (this post has been taking me hours) it shouldn’t take much time to see the questions addressed to you and answer them. Scummy end of neutral.

Oh, and I may miss questions addressed to me so don’t hesitate to point them out.

I think I have everyone?

Town to scum:
plytho
Evil George Washington
Maven89
Peaceful Whale
Bessie
heuristically_alone
mpolo
Madge
BoomFrog
Sabrar
Spak
jimbobmacdoodle
moody7277
#HBC | Zyth
Frozenflame
Znirk
Gamma Emerald
SirGabriel
Red Ryu
Dark Horse

I haven't really looked at my previous list so things may have changed compared to that, that is me changing my mind (or forgetting about things). Positions are very likely to change based on new info, this is D1 after all.

moody7277 wrote:@EGW: As BoomFrog said, I'm not actually that new, been playing on and off for a couple years. Off hand, is English a second language for you? Just means I'll have to be careful with colloquialisms if so.
It is for me, but I'll ask for clarifications when I need them.
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Sabrar » Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:21 pm UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:I would love seeing the funny example.
The game is Shakespeare. I already got called out once about not being able to shut up. So we arrive at a situation where people are suspicious of Madge who I strongly meta-read as Town. I make a post in Gojoe about showing the willpower not to defend her just yet. This is me 40 minutes later because I was bored at work.

bessie wrote:Ok, this makes sense in an odd way, but I’m not completely following you because there were other games with DGamers in them, or did you mean just the ones in this game?
True, I forgot about Bard in Shakespeare. But it's not really relevant as he's not present in this game.

bessie wrote:I still don’t agree with this.
Duly noted, I've stopped trying to convince you some time ago.

on moody:
- don't like the FoS, it takes the joke one step too far. In the past it was often a sign of scum.
- already expressed my reservations about his acceptance of mpolo's claim. His later explanations do not clear up those issues entirely, especially this part. It tries to make a joke of it.
moody7277 wrote:I figure that Sabrar making sure I'm careful about assumptions is a good idea.
I read this as a subtle attempt at trying to appear not defending himself. I wasn't really 'making sure' that he should be careful about his assumptions, I questioned his mindset.
- moody has a habit of making read-list early, though having one less than a day in must be a record even for him. The thing that stands out to me is that IIRC he usually has more town- or scum-leans and doesn't put more than half of the players into the neutral/insufficient data pile. It feels more like forcibly imitating a habit but rushing it.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Sabrar » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:06 pm UTC

plytho wrote:I haven't really looked at my previous list so things may have changed compared to that, that is me changing my mind (or forgetting about things). Positions are very likely to change based on new info, this is D1 after all.
Defending yourself already? This pings me a lot.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby plytho » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:22 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
plytho wrote:I haven't really looked at my previous list so things may have changed compared to that, that is me changing my mind (or forgetting about things). Positions are very likely to change based on new info, this is D1 after all.
Defending yourself already? This pings me a lot.

Can you elaborate why that statement is bothering you?
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby bessie » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:31 pm UTC

Continuing on page 6.
heuristically_alone wrote:Do you think it is unimportant when a player orders their reads from most scummy to least scummy, or works you rather have reads put in groups, town and scum?
Is this a question for Zyth? If yes, Zyth, I would be interested in hearing your answer.

#HBC | Red Ryu wrote:So people use that role here? Wow sounds fun though
If you’re talking about jester, we occasionally see one, and most people don’t like the role and consider it an annoyance. Many people have much stronger feelings about cult and refuse to knowingly sign up for a game with a cult. If a mod includes a cult in a game, it is considered a bastard game, and the mod is expected to advertise the game as such. It is common in open, semi-open, and newbie-friendly games for the mod to include something in the game specific rules like “there are no alignment changing roles in this game” or “your win condition will not change”.

Agree with Maven89 points re Peaceful Whale and moody in this post.

Also agree with his observation re Madge. I’m not a big fan of townies role claiming on D1 (I’ve said this before and can dig up examples if needed). In theory, I guess this game is a little different than what I am used to because of N0, but there have been no night action claims, only power claims. In general, I have a slight suspicion of the person claiming, but more often a suspicion of all those who are willing to unquestionably accept that claim as true.

Sabrar wrote:
Evil George Washington wrote:Question though, why do you personally never wait?
Because I love playing this game and playing means posting for me. I simply cannot sit and wait in peace.
Then it’s a good thing you didn’t get randed Dark Horse’s role. Because he must have a posting restriction that doesn’t allow him to post on D1. :P

plytho wrote:Madge’s claim: doesn’t sound like something made up by scum. So either she’s scum with a mechanic that requires votes to activate or town with that mechanic. I’m inclined to believe she’s town. It seems dangerous for scum to out themselves like that.

I’m not sure we should follow along and get six votes for Madge though. I feel this would harm the vote analysis.
Why wouldn’t scum claim a townie power? It obviously gives them lynch protection. And I find your reason for questioning activating Madge’s claimed power interesting.

plytho wrote: :roll: pointing out my defense of PW is fair but pointing out my clarifications and answers to questions as more defense of PW is less fair. Can you point out why my points about PW are unsupported and badly thought out?
I’m not ignoring this question; I’m just going to put it off until later today because this will take me more time to answer than I have right now.

Ok, almost caught up reading the thread and my initial reactions! I will take all my observations and try to get some reads out of it today.

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Gamma Emerald » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:36 pm UTC

@plytho that's kinda how I play though, although I take issue with you saying the majority of my posts are off-topic. You don't know me well enough yet.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Maven89 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:56 pm UTC

Heading to work, won't be able to post until after 10pm CT. But before I go

Gamma Emerald wrote:As for Madge's claim it looks interesting. Madge, do you gain a shot of an ability each time or the ability to use it for the rest of the game?


Image

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby plytho » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:02 pm UTC

bessie wrote:
plytho wrote:Madge’s claim: doesn’t sound like something made up by scum. So either she’s scum with a mechanic that requires votes to activate or town with that mechanic. I’m inclined to believe she’s town. It seems dangerous for scum to out themselves like that.

I’m not sure we should follow along and get six votes for Madge though. I feel this would harm the vote analysis.
Why wouldn’t scum claim a townie power? It obviously gives them lynch protection. And I find your reason for questioning activating Madge’s claimed power interesting.
You have a point about the lynch protection. But that only goes so far. This is going to be a long game. There is a lot of time for people to use their investigative powers and confirm or deny the claims so fake claiming early is dangerous for scum.


Gamma Emerald wrote:@plytho that's kinda how I play though, although I take issue with you saying the majority of my posts are off-topic. You don't know me well enough yet.
Could be. But for now I see you turning out a lot of posts with little scum hunting. I look forward to seeing the results of your play style.
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby plytho » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:06 pm UTC

I like maven :D
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | 9/13

Postby Sabrar » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:10 pm UTC

plytho wrote:Can you elaborate why that statement is bothering you?
It's a "here is what people might find scummy about my post but it really isn't" kind of remark. That is more indicative of a scum-mindset.


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