Crossover Mafia | Game!

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Peaceful Whale
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:34 pm UTC

Sabar, doesn't wrong about Bessie, hunt actual scum!

Edit: oops, it's important I fix that error.
Sabar, doesn't worry about Bessie, hunt actual scum!
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Sabrar
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Sabrar » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:43 pm UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Sabrar: When you re-read, I want you to comment on the previous post. Do you agree or disagree with Laserguys's statement regarding Bessie switching gears due to my read on opinion on Peaceful Whale at the time? Please comment as to why.

I think I've already said that I don't remember bessie switching gears about PW. But sure, I'll get to it.

@Peaceful Whale: DON'T EDIT YOUR POSTS! At this rate you're going to lynch yourself. You can always make a second post and correct it that way.

Sleepy time for real.

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Peaceful Whale
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:47 pm UTC

*slaps self*

But I didn't even edit the original! I even did the "Edit:" thing! Does that still count?

I won't ever edit them again.
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:49 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale, I want you to answer Laserguy's questions.

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BoomFrog
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Re: Crossover Mafia | N1 | 9/16

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:49 pm UTC

Evil George Washington wrote: Key Points:

1. States scumread on Sabrar without further interaction, questions, or vote.
2. Weak justification for why he had a contridiction of reads via: scum!FF jumping on scum!Whale
3. Attempts to justify forced read of Mpolo indy read, given too early in the game.
4. No initial impression on Moody, is tasked to re-read for quite some time near early game.

I haven't read anything D2 yet except this first big post from EGW. I'm pretty busy irl for the next two days but I feel like I better respond to this early to allow more time for discussion.

1) You seem to have misunderstood why I found Sabrar scummy. I disagreed when he said "now that's scummy". But I didn't vote for Sabrar because I wanted to keep my vote and pressure on PW. By the time I had RL time to post again Sabrar had revealed his extra info which justified his vote so my opinion went back to pretty much neutral on him.
2) There's no contradiction. FF could be scum on a different team than PW, they could be the same team and FF overreacted to distance, or I could be wrong (at that time) and PW is town and FF scum. Finding someone scummy doesn't mean everyone who attacks them is town. Suggesting otherwise is ridiculous.
3) I stick by my assessment of mpolo.
4) At that time I didn't have a read on half the players in the game.
5) You didn't say this, but I dragged my heels at the end of D1 to change over from Red to Moody. I was concerned that you (EGW) were leading me to lynch a bad looking townie and saved your scum buddy Red. Then Moody had his terrible updated read list and offered to basically vote anyone besides himself and showed a complete lack of scumhunting. Actually, you trying to switch from moody to Spak or Red made me feel better about staying on moody.

Your whole post feels like you had a conclusion first then found the evidence second. What was it that made you pick me out of everyone else?
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Peaceful Whale
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:51 pm UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Peaceful Whale, I want you to answer Laserguy's questions.


Which one? I haven't seen it...
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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LaserGuy
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:54 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:
Evil George Washington wrote:Peaceful Whale, I want you to answer Laserguy's questions.


Which one? I haven't seen it...


In my giant post. Here they are:
LaserGuy wrote:@Peaceful Whale: You got very quiet in the last half of D1. What happened?
@Peaceful Whale: Please go through my content and ask me three good questions about anything that you don''t understand or need clarification on.
@Peaceful Whale: Can you post some updated reads? Who are the three scummiest players? Who are the three towniest?

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LaserGuy
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:56 pm UTC

FrozenFlame wrote:Also I say we absolutely take LaserGuy up on his offer to "hammer" Amrock in the judgement vote even though it doesn't seem like there really is such a thing. My guess is that LaserGuy is going to be the official "cause" of whoever dies to the judgement vote because he's claiming to be the person who activated the ability, so frankly, having him "hammer" IMO will be redundant, but it protects us incase my assumption here is wrong.


I tried asking YOLO a few questions about the mechanics of my role with respect to GlaDOS, but he isn't going to give me any information and I think my role PM could be read either way. Safest it to have me do the hammer, though, you're right, I may be dead either way.

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LaserGuy
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:00 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:
Peaceful Whale wrote:
Evil George Washington wrote:Peaceful Whale, I want you to answer Laserguy's questions.


Which one? I haven't seen it...


In my giant post. Here they are:
LaserGuy wrote:@Peaceful Whale: You got very quiet in the last half of D1. What happened?
@Peaceful Whale: Please go through my content and ask me three good questions about anything that you don''t understand or need clarification on.
@Peaceful Whale: Can you post some updated reads? Who are the three scummiest players? Who are the three towniest?


EBWOP:
Sorry, that link should go to the next post down. There are questions for every player in that post (except Zyth, who has questions in a separate post).

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Madge
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Madge » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:07 pm UTC

Whoever asked me how I can prove I become a tree stump if I kill anyone: let me hammer, turn me into a tree stump, and then when I try to vote my vote won't get counted. It's an irreversible way to test part of my claim, admittedly, but it'll beat y'all mislynching me. (Also, I guess it means I can hammer GLaDOS at the same time if you want me to prove it, since I would be the least valuable townie in that situation since I won't have any pro-town powers in future). Ditto for the judgement vote: I'll be willing to be a backup hammer voter. (I don't think the judgement vote will necessarily activate my tree stump power though, because it's not a hammer vote, it's a majority vote: so by just being part of a majority I'm not causing a death directly the same way I might be if I laid the vote that kills someone and ends the day)

I have a test in a couple of hours so this is a short one (who am I kidding, they're always going to be short). I was hoping D2 wouldn't be as hectic as D1 but it clearly is going to be. (THREE PAGES? SERIOUSLY?)

Didn't think indies are dangerous because in general on this forum they tend to be pro-town. SKs I don't count in the "indie" category in the same way as survivors and all the other different things as they SK's like, Mafia Jr. Even Jesters, who are bad for town, get their win and stop bothing the rest of the players. (I think in one game we negotiated with the jester, lynched them in exchange for them using their powers).

I take back all my stuff about indies not being dangerous: that apparently doesn't apply to this game's mod.

I'm interested to see what Zyth is hiding. I'm glad we're finally begining to get morsels of information about night actions and roles. Time to have something other than walls of text to examine!
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LaserGuy
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:16 pm UTC

Madge wrote:I have a test in a couple of hours so this is a short one (who am I kidding, they're always going to be short). I was hoping D2 wouldn't be as hectic as D1 but it clearly is going to be. (THREE PAGES? SERIOUSLY?)


Sorry, my fault. Since there's about a 98% I'm only going to be alive for one day this game, I intend to make the most of it and spam scum into submission :mrgreen:

Who is your top scumread at the moment?

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Madge
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Madge » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:21 pm UTC

I don't even know. Wine with moody and jimbob, zyth, glados... so much to keep track of. Add to that that there's people like EGW that I've never played with before and don't know how to read (again, who am i kidding, I don't know how to read anyone).
I'm writing a supernatural romance novel, it updates the first weekend of every month. You can find it here.

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LaserGuy
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:51 pm UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:Skimmed. I mostly just see a bunch of animal icons saying my name. I'll read plythos case and the rest of the posts in more depth later.

@Amrock did you get the results as well?

I'm sort of a weak comparison cop. Each night I give someone the ability to send me two names the next night, from those names I get an aligned or not aligned result. N0 I gave it to Sabrar, but the names he sent obviously got redirected to Amrock.


Why did you give this to Sabrar? Why not someone you knew?

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | N1 | 9/16

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:55 pm UTC

Boomfrog:

1) You seem to have misunderstood why I found Sabrar scummy. I disagreed when he said "now that's scummy". But I didn't vote for Sabrar because I wanted to keep my vote and pressure on PW. By the time I had RL time to post again Sabrar had revealed his extra info which justified his vote so my opinion went back to pretty much neutral on him.


You didn't vote Sabrar nor did you interact or question him either. There was no desire to sort him. You could have easily voted PW and either FOS Sabrar and/or questioned him. There is no thought progression there.

2) There's no contradiction. FF could be scum on a different team than PW, they could be the same team and FF overreacted to distance, or I could be wrong (at that time) and PW is town and FF scum. Finding someone scummy doesn't mean everyone who attacks them is town. Suggesting otherwise is ridiculous.


We have clues to see that there is a two scum teams for you to make such a confident assumption, especially near early game. Being wrong doesn't invalidate that you have a contradiction. While being wrong you would still have to for some reason believe scum!FF is jumping on scum!PW. So if you are offering that as a possibility. Did you think it was FF overreacting to distance?

3) I stick by my assessment of mpolo.


You are not going to comment on how it was too early in the game to make such an assumption? I want you to state why it was ok to base his tendency of 'being distant as indy' so early in the game without having time to notice him do that.

4) At that time I didn't have a read on half the players in the game.


Point is, you mentioned you were going to re-read a player you never initially read in the first place. Then you suddenly seemed to have a confident read on him.

5) You didn't say this, but I dragged my heels at the end of D1 to change over from Red to Moody. I was concerned that you (EGW) were leading me to lynch a bad looking townie and saved your scum buddy Red. Then Moody had his terrible updated read list and offered to basically vote anyone besides himself and showed a complete lack of scumhunting. Actually, you trying to switch from moody to Spak or Red made me feel better about staying on moody.


You seemed like you were trying to undermine my switch to Moody at the point, when there was no reason for you to say that I had said more negative things of Ryu then Moody. Underlined is a weak justification for your %70 confidence.

Your whole post feels like you had a conclusion first then found the evidence second. What was it that made you pick me out of everyone else?


I re-read the game as thoroughly as I could (Which included some questions to people). I had originally scumread you and dropped my push earlier yet I noticed more of the same problems from you. Less of an attempt to sort people (Sabrar, Moody, Jimbob) and reading with Moody's flip in mind helped as well. As I was reading I took notes, then I proceeded to make the case on you. So it's not like it came out of no where, I have had progression with you, and my concerns and points are valid. (Which I give you the chance to explain)

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:55 pm UTC

EBWOP: We have no clues to make such a confident assumption.

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:47 am UTC

plytho wrote:You know who doesn't need to check the flip?

Passive aggressive accusation noted.

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:06 am UTC

Also going to state Sabrar and PW have entered my townreads. I have 7 so far. My personal guess for amount of scum is 5-6, leaning towards 5, so these townreads could eventually help develop a rudimentary PoE for me to use.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:29 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Zen: I want you to expand on Spak right now, and I want you to comment on my Boomfrog case. I am wondering why you town read him based on your reads aligning, when you know I look for motivation behind the posting and not just who agrees/disagrees with me. You haven't looked into his intent.


Zen, I want to see an answer to this.

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#HBC | Zyth
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:26 am UTC

Dammit Laserguy, that was such a good post you made about me, and I can definitely see where you're coming from. I drew some of the exact same conclusions you made on me, but on someone else! I also have the exact same scum team reads as you, except replace me with the aforementioned "someone else".

Unfortunately, you're misinterpreting some of my posts and it's misleading you toward the wrong conclusion. Definitely get strong town from your post though. (Although I'm not sure how much of it was made before you got your role?) It just sucks that many of my strongest town reads so often read me as scum. In this game, you and plytho. And George on the fence. At least I still have Boom.

I'll address you and plytho fully in a bit.

--

I don't think amrock would have gotten the results. Looking at my role, it looks like I make the comparison after receiving the names. Since I didn't recieve them, no comparison.

--

Ran, your Boom post was beautifully composed as well. Seriously great format. Unfortunately, it's full of shit. Boom town.

Getting on computer now to go into things more.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:39 am UTC

LaserGuy wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Skimmed. I mostly just see a bunch of animal icons saying my name. I'll read plythos case and the rest of the posts in more depth later.

@Amrock did you get the results as well?

I'm sort of a weak comparison cop. Each night I give someone the ability to send me two names the next night, from those names I get an aligned or not aligned result. N0 I gave it to Sabrar, but the names he sent obviously got redirected to Amrock.


Why did you give this to Sabrar? Why not someone you knew?


Moody told me that Sabrar would be the way to go. If I gave it to a dgames player and they would likely deduce that it came from another dgames player. Would've been bad if they were scum.

Sabrar wrote:I would like Zen to fully claim the ability (ability name/flavour/whatever you can think of). After that I see no reason not to reveal what I received/sent.
I'd rather not reveal all that. There is one more ability that I have, but revealing it or my flavor (from which the ability could be deduced) would only benefit scum. I've left clues to it though so if I die you guys will be able to figure it out.

I have no idea what you're talking about regarding the ability I've claimed though? That's all there is to it. If you received anything other than the hidden message ability, it was from someone else.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Amrock » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:09 am UTC

Everyone wants to lynch poor amrock. Can't you just let me win with the town as an unkillable unlynchable and double vote giving townie?

:(

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bessie
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby bessie » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:13 am UTC

I just got home and there’s already three pages of content. I’ll reply to some D1 stuff I was working on over the weekend and come back in a while to reply to today’s content.
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Bessie
I'd like to see where she picks up, especially with regard to jimbob. Also curious to see what she disliked about Boom and plytho calling out Whale's claim. I honestly haven't seen anything from her that has given me a strong town vibe, but I haven't felt like her posts are malicious either. I think how she ends up voting throughout the game is going to give the best indication of her alignment. Ninja Edit #564, pg. 15: Still hasn't explained why she disliked Boom/plytho's call out. Just has an unwarranted "pissed off" reaction. How are they role fishing? Was hoping she'd utilize her time to go more in depth on her "interesting" reads. Negative reaction from this post overall. If any of the people higher up on this list are scum, this is where I would wager.


Quotes for reference:
Spoiler:
Peaceful Whale wrote:I've got a way to prove I'm town, who do we trust the most? Right now I'm think Bessie. (Bassicly who is the towniest, and who do we trust)

I'm worried about whoever I target will be killed by scum, and then my ability would be wasted.

Peaceful Whale wrote:Sorry Bessie, I thought GlaDos was suicide bomber, my fault. I am not a suicide bomber, or was an honest mistake and there's not much I can do to prove it. I'll try to be more helpful, I have a way of telling if someone is scum or not, which is why it's important for town to know I did not use my ability N0.

BoomFrog wrote:Peaceful Whale - From his play I'd say he is scum, but I'd like to see his method of proving he is town. He's painted himself into a corner if he's scum so no need to put him to the test D1.

plytho wrote:
bessie wrote:Quit fishing for information on Peaceful Whale’s role mechanics and targets.
I’m doing nothing of the sort.

I interpreted Peaceful Whale’s initial claim as an inventor-type role that could send something to another player, and he was asking advice about sending me, as a townie read, something overnight, but he also goes on to say that the person he sends something to might be killed and his power/gift would be wasted. Peaceful Whale’s second power claim quoted above made me think he might be sending someone (me?) a cop result. That’s why I advised him not to discuss his power anymore here.

As I am not the brightest or most clever player in this game, I’m sure that anything I noticed would also be noticed by everyone else. Town should have backed off of Peaceful Whale, or just offered some advice about keeping his targets to himself (like Zyth did here. ) Instead, BoomFrog fishes for Peaceful Whale’s role and he also points out to Peaceful Whale that he’s painted himself in to a corner if he doesn’t produce something. I accused Boomfrog of role fishing in this post. Then plytho says that he was going to scum read me for not pointing out Peaceful Whale soft claimed a power here. That’s when I made this post telling plytho that I wasn’t happy that he brought this up. Then he tried prodding me to discuss why here. And he continued here. To me, it seemed like plytho was trying to get Peaceful Whale to reveal more information about his targets by trying to get me to speculate about it. My thought was that if he could get enough of a confirmation from Peaceful Whale that he would be sending me something, then I would be a night kill target.

Zyth, does that address your post and my “unwarranted” pissed-off reaction? Ask if it doesn’t.

plytho wrote:
bessie wrote:Um, you know, scum probably has a kill. And they know who the claimed redirector is. They have a few chances to hit him before town has enough info to make a good guess on who to redirect to SirGabriel.
I know. What are you trying to say here?
I’m implying that you are active lurking.

plytho wrote:
moody7277 wrote:
plytho wrote:
moody7277 wrote: We've got several good candidates, so that you'll most likely be around to me eventually (points to sig) if not D1.
I don't understand this sentence. If there are several good (lynch?) candidates shouldn't it be less likely for us to get to you?


I figure that the set of {me, red ryu, gamma} is what is going to be the lynches for D1-3 (hopefully not in that order :P ) depending on coppings and viges of course.
It looks like you haven't been paying attention, or you know we won't lynch jimbob after you flip.
Why not?

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:@bessie - spoilered because not really relevant to this game:
Spoiler:
You mentioned my "changed the setup" comment from Dark Tower. Although I admit I was scum, I think this was not a scum-tell. I'd almost certainly have said the same thing as Town. I was comparing the game's setup to the previous one Sabrar had modded (Dollhouse, I think?), so changing the setup was in reference to that, i.e. take that game as the starting point, and change a few things about it.
Why did you waste your time replying to this?

BoomFrog wrote:Regarding Bessie: I'm suprised that she didn't pick up on the mpolo thing. She noted it, but she didn't feel it odd that mpolo's "data was lost". I'm leaning slightly scum which makes me sad. :( .
Please explain why I’m now leaning scum. Is it because I did not read moody exactly the way you wanted me to read him?

Madge wrote:I also just realised that I misread my role PM and - I am not kidding and can prove this if necessary - if I kill anyone, including with a hammer vote, I become a Tree Stump (can post but not vote or use abilities). So I can't hammer - well, I can hammer, but it kind of neuters me. But if the alternative is a no-lynch I will hammer and become a Tree Stump and hang my head in shame for not thinking of that detail.
Madge, I really don’t like this. You have discussed almost nothing except yourself for this entire game and a few hours before deadline, after multiple assurances that you will be available to hammer at deadline, you tell us that you can’t hammer because you just now read your role pm carefully?

Pick for scum partners at end of D1: plytho and jimbobmacdoodle.

Back in a bit.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:17 am UTC

bessie wrote:Boomfrog read


Hey Bessie. Have you gotten a closer look at Boomfrog yet like you said? I want your thoughts on my Boom case and our interaction in recent pages.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:20 am UTC

Sabrar thoughts on Madges Tree Stump thing she recently noticed as of end of D1?

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Sabrar
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Sabrar » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:32 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:I have no idea what you're talking about regarding the ability I've claimed though? That's all there is to it. If you received anything other than the hidden message ability, it was from someone else.
The wording of the pm did not suggest that anything mechanical would be attached to the 2 names I chose, instead it just asked me to pick my top 2 scum-reads (paraphrased).

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Sabrar
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Sabrar » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:46 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Sabrar thoughts on Madges Tree Stump thing she recently noticed as of end of D1?
I believe her missing it originally. I don't think we should test it because losing a vote is bad mechanically but if town consensus is that Madge can't be in the POE then we can do it at some point.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:17 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:Ran, your Boom post was beautifully composed as well. Seriously great format. Unfortunately, it's full of shit. Boom town.


Please explain. Also expand on Spak, and tell me your updated reads on Frozen Flame and Bessie.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:25 am UTC

I also was kind of hoping Bessie would have had analyzed a lot more so she could be more caught up by now even with the extended night we had.

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bessie
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby bessie » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:40 am UTC

First of all, thank you LaserGuy and Amrock for replacing!

George, I really should have prepared more over N1, but I didn’t for reasons (overwhelmed and knowing the playing field would thin out a little after N1, nervous I was going to be NKed and didn’t want to put too much in to it to lessen the disappointment, pretty sure some of my content would be suspect anyway because of my reluctance to lynch moody, and other reasons).

Re: Evil George Washington’s case on BoomFrog.

Note that I’m not feeling great about BoomFrog after reflecting on his D1 content, for two reasons discussed in my previous post. The first is his rolefishing Peaceful Whale on D1. The second is his slight scum lean on me just because my moody read didn’t end up how he wanted it. So my read of EGW’s case is already slightly biased.

Roller Coaster post: I also wasn’t seeing that link as a definitive scum tell, (discussed by me here), and BoomFrog’s seriousness about it I just took as an early game discussion tactic. [rereading that post, note BoomFrog’s assertion on mpolo’s townie helpfulness]

moody post: I agree with his description of moody’s meta, so I don’t really know if the “reread” wording is significant, but as I am a player that tunnels on nitpicky wording arguments I have noted it.

Maven89 response: I see your points, and you have given me something to think about (trying to avoid interaction with Sabrar). Thinking about it more, I agree with some of your points.

EGW scumread: I’m getting lost in the references (in this case the original jimbob quote referred to by BoomFrog). This quote was in my notes somewhere, because it draws another parallel with mpolo/safe and indie/safe.

Conclusion: Noted, reinforces the pings I had N1 as I thought about BoomFrog.

I wonder if LaserGuy is going to have time to catch up... Holy crap, back in a bit. :P

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby bessie » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:48 am UTC

plytho wrote:Why did nobody take up Madge's offer to prove the tree stump claim?
When? The tree stump revelation came too late in the day to think through.

plytho wrote:What’s up with bessie? She seems less present in this game than in previous ones. Could be due to the massive volume of posts. There was also a weird response to my SirG wagon issues.
Can you point to the response in question? I’m getting lost trying to hunt down stuff.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:55 am UTC

Thank you Bessie. I still want to test Madge's Tree Stump thing.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:16 am UTC

As Sabrar said, defending yourself always comes off as WIFOM. It makes it seem like the posts that a person is using to defend themselves were said purposefully, to be used for the very act of defending themselves. Nevertheless I will try, because 1) I am a very cooperative player. I really would prefer for my town reads to also town read me so that we can work together. It really gets under my skin when my town reads, scum read me. plytho and laser are two people high on my town list right now and I'd like to try and rectify their misguidance so that we can hunt actual scum. 2) No one is doing it for me! plyth, Laser, and Sabrar are completely overlooking the parts of my play that contradicts their speculation (confirmation bias). You guys are coming at me with a theory already in mind and then viewing my posts with that perspective. Again, this is keeping you from seeing the points that contradict your theory, which otherwise might be noticeable from an unbiased perspective.

Before I go into why I'm not likely scum mates with moody (using the term likely here because I'm going at it from a not-me perspective), let me say something regarding my voting style and wagon style compared to the general play here on xkcd. I said before that the differences between dgames and xkcd are fewer than the similarities. Nevertheless, they still exist, and our voting pattern is indeed one of them (as Sabrar mentioned). Wagons in dgames are good. Voting is good. Not all of us use our votes in the same way, but the majority of us use it as a scum hunting tool, not simply as the mechanic to lynch someone. Pressure (through votes) is good and often gets good Intel on the player being pressured and those joining in on the wagon. Wagon building is good, especially when they are between two alternatives. If one is of alignment_a (presumably town, but could also be indy or another faction) and of alignment_b (presumably mafia), this puts mafia in a position where they have to choose to either bus or risk defending their mate. As boom put it, it's a gold mine for reads.

Because I use my vote as scum hunting tool, it tends to be erratic. As town though, I do my best to land it on scum at the end of the day, which is what matters.

It is also the reason why I built up the Jim wagon near the end of the day. I wanted competing wagons, particularly one that would be difficult to build. You don't get as much from easy wagons, because scum can easily justify joining one or the other. Ryu and Gamma were both really easy alternatives to moody.



Anyway, why I'm not mates with moody:


X. I don't bus. This point isn't one that you guys would have gotten by reading the game as it's meta. But it is legit the ONLY thing about my meta that is absolutely true and consistent. (I totally lied yesterday about how I wouldn't defend my bud. I totally would. I just said that to see if Sabrar would switch to Jim. Sorry Sabrar I know you have a LAL type of policy ¯\_(ツ)_/¯). THIS META HOWEVER IS 100% LEGIT && I HAVE THE EVIDENCE. I have mentioned this multiple times elsewhere. And I'm slightly annoyed that George hasn't mentioned this, because I have spilled this philosophy to him on multiple occasions. I absolutely will never bus my mate. I hate bussing with a passion. It has so little strategic value. Most town players are super paranoid of bussing so the return on investment is almost always negative, because town will speculate that you bussed anyway. All you do by bussing is progress town's wincon. Your team has to play through more day phases and town thus has more time to smoke you out. You lose the abilities of your mate. You lose the voting power of your mate. You lose the voice of your mate. So many cons!

I always hard town read my mates as scum. I never bring attention toward the things they say, because scummates often see scummy behavior in their mates that town otherwise would not see. So fake scum hunting your mates is horrible, because you're likely to bring up legit points that town would have never seen. I could go on and on about this, but here are previous posts of mine that lay this meta bare:


¶ Ž said: ↑
Well don't bus [each other] either. If any if my partners die, I completely lose motivation to play. If you push each other, it has to be on things that aren't actually really that scummy, otherwise you just end up bringing attention to one another that town wouldn't have noticed in the first place.

Post

Xivii: "Xast you're being way too paranoid of me >_>. I am known for making gambits as town. I hate bussing and would never do it unless it would put scum at a mechanical advantage. If you look at any of my scum games you will see that I always keep my mates as town. Throwing your mate under the bus is foolish as it hardly ever pays off."

Post

Xivii: "No. I never bus my scummates. See: Fire Emblem."
Post

Dabuz: "Ranmaru pretty much has me, feel free to bus lol."
Xivii: "No way bro. We in this 'til the end. Ran is suspicious now, but it's not permanent. Xastrn is going to be the one killed today. Then the night is in our court and we can easily take out Ran (or kanty cause his towniness is annoying lol).
Post




Reasons I'm likely not scum mates with moody (based on in-game non-meta posts):

1. I am the one that initally brought attention to moody.
#HBC | Zyth wrote:I'm reading isos right now and will make a read post later once I get some questions answered. In the mean time, can you figure out moody's alignment for me? I'm having difficulty.


People began to give their input on moody in response to this post, and I think this is where players started to actually consider the read. There's lit. no point of scum!Zen making this post. All it would be doing is bringing unnecessary attention to his mate when there wasn't even any to begin with.

I am also the first one to have made a point of suspicion against him.
#HBC | Zyth wrote:
Sabrar wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:
bessie wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Scum can't be misguided because they'd know you aren't scum. Pretty straight forward.
Why? We could have two scum teams.
Fair enough.
@DGamers: how often do you have 2 scum-teams? Is it reasonable for Zen to forget this?
I didn't "forget", it's just not convention from my experience. I wasn't aware that it was such a common thing here, but seeing that multiple players from this site have stated the likelihood of there being two teams, I see it as reasonable for h_a to think so. I actually suspected that there were probably more than one team, but not because it's a large game, rather because of my previous experience in an OS game. h_a's hard stance on there being to teams is actually why he initially caught my attention. Seemed a bit too insightful. Now that I know that it's a common thing here, I can disregard that line of suspicion. Honestly now it seems more weird to me those from this site that didn't consider two teams in their setup prediction (i.e moody).




2. jimbob / Dark Horse would have been a really ridiculous counter wagons to a moody wagon. Ryu and Gamma were both really easy pushes. Especially gamma. The only way there is scum!Zen here is if Ryu and Gamma are also on the same team. My jimbob case was super weak and Frozen was the only other person looking at jim as a possible candidate at that time. Why the hell would scum!Zen choose jim, JIM as the wagon to save his scummate moody? Seriously, plytho / sabrar / laser you really need to answer this if your argument is going to hold any weight. It's really suspect that when Frozen brought this up, Sabrar simply brushed it off with a "maybe they're all scum meep moop".


3. I was always going to switch over to moody if jim didn't get the votes. And I was no way going to have the day end with a no lynch. I wanted counter wagons so that scum would have to choose between one or the other. When I felt the deadlock was reached, and we thus got all we could out of the competing wagons, I was going to switch over to moody and bring everyone on the jim wagon with me, and that is what I did. You can see this being conveyed through this progression of posts:

#HBC | Zyth wrote:
BoomFrog wrote:@Zyth: Moody is about 70% chance to be scum. This is as confident as I get D1.
I believe it.

I'd much rather lynch one of the other three I posted, but I have no reason to fight a Moody lynch. If it comes down to it, I'll support it over Gamma.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:George, we'll always be able to swing back to moody if need be.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:Vote jim and at least help me put scum in a position where they are forced to choose.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:Spak, choose a wagon.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:smh should've went for Spak.

Vote: moody

Let's mobilize.

(btw, here spak not voting on either of the top two wagons here was mad scummy. one of the things i was looking for)

#HBC | Zyth wrote:
FrozenFlame wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:smh should've went for Spak.

Vote: moody

Let's mobilize.

But...but... scumbob... :(

I tried, but it's not possible without either George or Boom, based on wagonomics.

I don't think I'll be able to make another post today. Moody is the play. Anyone not on that wagon needs to hop over immediately.

@ruy @spak @whale @mpolo


I think I clearly had town's interest at heart. Most of my "im so gud" crap is just silly bluster. I'm not actually that great at town. I do however think I have a genuine talent for wagonomics. I have a good instinct for when and which votes need to be moved for a wagon to form and a lynch to go through. If I didn't want moody to be lynched, he wouldn't have been lynched. If I didn't move my vote then and there, the day would have ended in a no lynch or a Gamma lynch. Which brings me to my final point.


4. Right before I switched to moody, plytho and Frozen were trying to get a last minute swing toward gamma. This is actually why I voted moody at that exact moment, cause Frozen made a post right before trying to make a play towards Gamma.

plytho wrote:
FrozenFlame wrote:So yeah I'll try to be as available as possible as deadline approaches. I'm stick with the Jim wagon but if people are that bent out of shape about it I think Gamma is a great alternative. This moody wagon gives me really bad vibes
If you're serious about the Gamma move you need to get that organized. This only works if you round up people willing to switch at a predetermined time, well before deadline. Everyone switches at the same time, if it's not enough, switch right back to something viable. Otherwise you might have people that switched but can't switch back because they're asleep.

FrozenFlame wrote:
plytho wrote:
FrozenFlame wrote:If you're serious about the Gamma move you need to get that organized. This only works if you round up people willing to switch at a predetermined time, well before deadline. Everyone switches at the same time, if it's not enough, switch right back to something viable. Otherwise you might have people that switched but can't switch back because they're asleep.

I'm seriously about being willing to move to Gamma if people prefer that lynch to Jimbob but obviously I'm not going to mobilize a shift off jimbob, who I would prefer to lynch, just to move to Gamma. I'm just saying that if Gamma becomes a wagon I'll be around to and will move to it if we end up deciding jimbob is definitively not a play.


Right after these is when I make my let's mobilize on moody post, because I was afraid of them swinging the lynch toward gamma. Looking back on it, I think this is the strongest evidence for town!Zen (or at least nonBudsWithmoodyZen). The only scenario that this is not the case is if Gamma is on the same team as Zen-moody.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:24 am UTC

@LaserGuy Case. My responses in blue.

Spoiler:
LaserGuy wrote:Case for Zyth:

The extremely short version: Zyth has too much information about the setup to be town. Based on interactions, it is extremely likely that he is a scumbuddy to moody, and it appears that moody’s ability gave Zyth’s team access to a huge amount of setup information that they were hoping to leverage by killing off the other scumteam for townie credit. This effort ultimately failed, and in the process, provided us with enough information both implicate his entire team, and also, indirectly, most of the members of the other team as well.

This is an entirely circumstantial case lol. It's founded on the basis that I have too much information, but you have not proven this! We don't actually know jim's alignment -- which I'm assuming is your basis for this whole thing because I came to the same idea, but with Frozen. Until we know jim's alignment or Megaman can confirm that moody did indeed have indy info on jim, this case is built upon glass pillars.



The long version:

I liked his playstyle in early D1, which was very effective at generating useful content. Spooks both heury and PW to good effect, ends up getting good intel on a number of other players. His play is quite “cagey” to use BoomFrog’s turn of phrase, making a lot of strong declarative statements to make an impact and seeing what kinds of responses he gets, without always revealing everything.

@Zyth: Was/is your 99.83% read on jimbob? Why did you never reply to this when asked by plytho, George, Sabrar, etc.?

The 99.83x% was jimbob. That level of surety was jokey bluster though (obviously I couldn't have a read with as much precision as to the one/one thousandth place).

@Zyth: Here, you say that you don’t like using meta as a basis for reads. Yet in your reads list here you rely a fair bit on this type of meta as alignment indicative, eg.
EGW: EGW is always very easy to read when he's not mafia. I don't think I really need to go into this read.

Why do you feel a meta read is appropriate here?

My Ran read isn't a meta read. I said he's easy to read when he's not mafia. That's not to say that my read is based on that fact. It would be kind of circular if it was (he's easy to read therefore I read him!). I just didn't give the details of my read because they were obvious and had been stated by other people. My reasons are that he's clearly engaged in the game, showing a lot of scum hunting intent, and asking lot's of clarifying and reasonable questions.

I was reading him as townie for most of D1, but when I went to read on iso, I encountered many, many problems with his play.

This about mpolo is weird:
Hm, are you not the protagonist from portal? If not, there may be another redirector whose purpose in the game is to get destroy GladOS. I was thinking by redirecting a night kill towards her.

@Zyth: Where did this come from? Why did you immediately think of him being the protagonist from portal based only on this:
mpolo wrote:My power involves re-arranging of targets and powers.


Honestly, because my deductive reasoning is beyond that of an orangutan (and they're pretty smart!). GLadOS is from portal. The protagonist from portal has redirection tech. mpolo is a redirector. I'm sorry if you can't see the logic here. Anyway, this is disproved as being "too much information" since I was wrong and mpolo isn't the gal from the game. I think one of your pillars just shattered.


Then there’s this one.
jim is the strongest scum player of the 3. We take him out and the rest falls apart. I just have a feeling about this.

@Zyth: Where did you get this from? How do you know that there’s three scum? How do you know jimbob is the strongest of them? Why didn’t you answer Sabrar’s question about this here?

You misunderstood. I'm referring to my 3 scum reads in this post. At the time of which was jim, spak, and ruy. I was stating why I wanted jim over the other two. Someone told me earlier in the game that jim was a strong scum player.



He makes a comment here implying he knows jim and Ryu are co-aligned.
Vote jim and at least help me put scum in a position where they are forced to choose.

@Zyth: How you know jimbob and Ryu are co-aligned scum? Why didn’t you answer EGW’s question about it here?

You misunderstood. The Ryu line above has nothing to do with the jim line. I was saying build a jim wagon so that scum has to choose between that wagon and the moody wagon.


smh should've went for Spak.

Vote: moody

@Zyth: Nice bus. Why do you think Spak would have been better?

I felt stronger on the inside about Spak being scum than either of moody or jim being scum at the end of the day. Him not voting on either of the wagons is what provoked that comment, as I found it really scummy.


How am I doing so far, Zyth?

Not well, but I really do respect the case. A few things that you thought were me having "too much info" were really just you misunderstanding my post. Others, I was actually just wrong on (mpolo's role) or have yet to be proven one way or the other (jim's alignment). The rest boils down to me having info on xkcd players. That's all just info I've gotten from this game.



@plytho case. My responses in blue.

Spoiler:
plytho wrote:My case on Zen, expanded:

plytho wrote:Things I don't like about Zen:
-the late DH push (particularly this near lie)
-the late reads list that had been promised for days
-the 4th wagon (it's not the jimbob part I'm bothered by)
-the SirG lynch plan
-the 100% scum read claim without any evidence


Going a bit deeper on this, line by line:

-the late DH push (particularly this near lie)
This is what triggered me to look into Zen’s motivations. Zen has been active all game and DH had been discussed multiple times. Pushing this point so late in the game doesn’t make sense. His evidence is also annoyingly misleading. Zen has experience with OS games, at least that’s what he’s saying here. I checked back on smashboards and the last 4 Overswarm games have that special rule 3 (and basically the same rules list). Clearly it’s part of the standard OS rules list.

Bro, I haven't played an OS game in 3-4 years. I didn't even play in the game you linked because OS was being a jerk and wouldn't let me use my hydra. I don't have a rule list memorized from 4 years ago in a game I didn't even play in. And even though this is an OS set up, I thought the OP was marshy's. That's why that line stuck out to me so much, because it didn't seem like something marshy would say unless there was something special about it. When he said that he had nothing further to say about DH after our inquiry, I went into full on conspiracy mode and thought there was something fishy going on with the DH spot. That's my bad.

--Oh wow I just checked the game on that date and it's actually been 5 years holy zargons time flies.


-the late reads list that had been promised for days
There were other people that took a lot of time to provide a reads list, but as I said, Zen has been active all game. He was around but didn’t post a list until he got a view on most people’s opinions.

Not sure what to say to this. It's a silly point.

-the 4th wagon (it's not the jimbob part I'm bothered by)
Starting an alternative Wagon to the 3 likely ones, with about 24 hours left in the game has town scrambling. Zen was active all game. If he wanted to push jimbob he could have done so much earlier.

Addressed above.

-the SirG lynch plan
Zen was one of the people supporting this. I explained earlier why this may be indicative of scum.

I'm the one that brought up the idea on redirecting the kill to SirG, silly. And I made certain that mpolo was aware of SirG's claim and this plan.

I'm starting to question whether or not you're actually being genuine here.


-the 100% scum read claim
The claim on itself is not necessarily a scum tell but extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence and we still haven’t seen the evidence. So: stellar evidence: good Zen. anything less: scum Zen, more dodging: scum Zen
Time for my after-run shower. I'll be back with some shower thougths on the implications of this judgement day on the GLaDOS possibilities.


jackie_chan_wut_face.jpg

I didn't realize how weak the points you were making on me were. I'm sorry, but I really don't know what you're saying here. My 100% thing was just me being sillyBoisterousZen. Were you fishing for a pr result or sumfin? Cause it seems like you were fishing for a pr result or sumfin.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby bessie » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:25 am UTC

With regard to LaserGuy’s case on Zyth, I will think about it as I read through other content, will post analysis later. I did not have a scum lean on Zyth at the end of D1.

LaserGuy wrote:
bessie wrote:Dark Horse – After what I’ve heard about DGames culture, I think his replacement is going to have a tough job.

Don’t worry, I brought my A game.

Noted. Tentatively confirmed. :)

LaserGuy wrote:@bessie: Of the early claimers, mpolo, SirG, Madge, and PW, who do you honestly see as having been an alternate lynch candidate?
Is this in reference to my rant about early claiming? I think all of them would have been tossed around as lynch candidates if they didn’t claim. The first three for lurking and/or active lurking, and lack of scumhunting. At the time I made that post all three had almost no content, aside from talking about themselves. The fourth not as much as the others for reasons, but possibly for scummy content and lack of scumhunting.

LaserGuy wrote:@bessie: You mention in your read that jimbob generally doesn’t lurk as scum. How many games have you played with him as scum?
Note that I also mention he generally doesn’t lurk at all. He was my D1 scumtunnel in Dark Tower. And jimbob and I have an ongoing disagreement regarding his alignment in Draculafia, which we still argue about (I wish I could remember where we had this out last, jimbob?). I maintain he was scum in that game. He disagrees. He was independent in Diablo. I think he was town in every other game we have played together. I followed Smalltown but don't recall details, he was scum. Can’t remember any others.

LaserGuy wrote:@bessie: You were reading Gamma, Ryu, and jimbob as your ordered scummiest reads. Why did you decide to vote jimbob here when Gamma was a better wagon at the time and you thought he was scummier?
There’s three pages of content between those two posts. jimbob’s posts did nothing to improve my read on him. And I felt that I didn’t have a concrete scum read on Gamma Emerald, more of a gut read, and it makes me uncomfortable to vote on a gut feeling. Upon reflection jimbob got promoted to my lynch pick.

LaserGuy wrote:I settled on bessie as third member of Zyth’s team for a couple reasons. First is the comment Zyth made about jimbob being the strongest scum on the team. This feels like bessie’s read to me.

Refer to this from the Zyth post:
LaserGuy wrote:Then there’s this one.
jim is the strongest scum player of the 3. We take him out and the rest falls apart. I just have a feeling about this.

@Zyth: Where did you get this from? How do you know that there’s three scum? How do you know jimbob is the strongest of them? Why didn’t you answer Sabrar’s question about this here?
I think either you or I are reading this wrong, I read it as the strongest of the three lynch candidates, not that all three were scum on the same team. And how can that be my read, as it is between jimbob and two people I have never played with before?

LaserGuy wrote:Bessie has, IMHO, an inflated evaluation of jimbob’s ability as a scum player that I’ve never seen any other player on these forums express. Jimbob has played scum about as frequently as bessie (ie. basically never), so most players probably shouldn’t have an opinion there, but bessie thinks quite highly of his scum play (I’ll try to dig out a quote from an older game if I can find it).
Yes, please find this quote, because I honestly don’t remember it, and would like to see it in context (did a quick skim of old chat logs, don’t want to risk a Gojoe search). Until then I’m going to say that I think you are remembering this incorrectly, because I tunneled him hard for being scummy scum in Dark Tower. But I think highly of jimbob’s play in general.

LaserGuy wrote:Bessie’s reasoning for voting here is uncharacteristically weak. It’s a big game with lots happening, but jimbob’s content is not so substantial (he only had 13 posts at this point), and I have a very hard time believing that if this were a proper read she wouldn’t have made the time to point out every little detail of her concerns with jimbob.
Read this post, then read Evil George Washington’s post immediately following. I was trying to alter my play to a more impression based approach until we made it through D1, and as I suspected, it is not a good playstyle for me. I’m a detail oriented nitpicker, and can’t do the type of behavior reads that others do (see SDK).

LaserGuy wrote:Later bessie produces a very detailed reread of moody that Zyth quickly (20 min later) turns around to try to move people off of moody. Note how much more effort and detail went into this than her lynch target.
That read was in response to a request from BoomFrog. I said ask me anything. He made but a single request. I was obliged to reply. And unfortunately it consumed more time than I expected.

LaserGuy wrote: I don’t think bessie really believes her read of jimbob.
Oh but I do.

I’ll go through LaserGuy’s other reads later, and analyze anything interesting.

Ninja'd.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:29 am UTC

Alright, now that that's out of the way, I can get back into the game.

Preread thoughts: Suspicious of Frozen and bessie. More so the former than the latter. Need to reevaluate plytho too. I thought his points on me were more valid before I actually addressed them. Spak is obv scum, though I still need to reread his end of day posts. jim is still probably scum. Ruy is Ruy. I wonder where Maven's vig shot went. Uhh yeah.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Sabrar » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:16 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:X. I don't bus.
We have different definitions then. You defended moody for the most part and only agreed to his lynch 'if need be'. I don't call that bussing.
#HBC | Zyth wrote:I am the one that initally brought attention to moody.

I am also the first one to have made a point of suspicion against him.
a) That is not bringing attention to him
b) You're very far from being the first.
#HBC | Zyth wrote:My jimbob case was super weak and Frozen was the only other person looking at jim as a possible candidate at that time. Why the hell would scum!Zen choose jim, JIM as the wagon to save his scummate moody?
What point of the timeline are you referring to? This? There was over a day remaining, you needed to stay consistent and go for jimbob first to see if he can be lynched. Also, if you truly believe that jimbob is the strongest among the three then you probably wanted to mislynch him first because you figured the others would be easier to do so later.
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Right after these is when I make my let's mobilize on moody post, because I was afraid of them swinging the lynch toward gamma. Looking back on it, I think this is the strongest evidence for town!Zen
I'll let plytho answer this first but this isn't that strong and you know it.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:18 am UTC

Zen I did say you don't like to bus on the top of page 25. Stop skimming bro. Also get at me wrt to my case on Boomfrog. I really need to see why you disagree with me.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:31 am UTC

Re: Peaceful Whale’s soft claim and my response vs bessies
bessie wrote:As I am not the brightest or most clever player in this game, I’m sure that anything I noticed would also be noticed by everyone else.
I disagree with this on principle. I think, especially in a game as large as this one (but also in general), that it’s very easy for this kind of public information to get lost to some townies.
Some numbers for clarity: (assuming 5 scum and 15 townies for easy maths)
If 1 in 5 people notice A, all scum will know A and around 12 townies will miss it.
If 3 in 5 people notice B, all scum will know B and around 6 townies will miss it.
If 9 in 10 people notice C, all scum will know C and 1 or 2 townies might miss it.

So making sure this information is known by everyone is the townie thing to do in. That’s what I was getting at.
bessie wrote:Can you point to the response in question? I’m getting lost trying to hunt down stuff.
This response:
bessie wrote:
plytho wrote:
bessie wrote:Um, you know, scum probably has a kill. And they know who the claimed redirector is. They have a few chances to hit him before town has enough info to make a good guess on who to redirect to SirGabriel.
I know. What are you trying to say here?
I’m implying that you are active lurking.
You're not implying I’m active lurking. If you think I am active lurking, you should say so (like you did last game). Here you’re engaging with my argument. Not really the thing to do if you think I’m deliberately avoiding posting relevant content.

Instead you have a sort of counter argument that doesn’t address the points I’m trying to make. I’m saying scum likes the lynch plan over the redirect plan. You’re saying scum isn’t that worried about the redirect? Why is that a counter argument to the points I’m making?

bessie wrote:
plytho wrote:
moody7277 wrote:
plytho wrote:
moody7277 wrote: We've got several good candidates, so that you'll most likely be around to me eventually (points to sig) if not D1.
I don't understand this sentence. If there are several good (lynch?) candidates shouldn't it be less likely for us to get to you?


I figure that the set of {me, red ryu, gamma} is what is going to be the lynches for D1-3 (hopefully not in that order :P ) depending on coppings and viges of course.
It looks like you haven't been paying attention, or you know we won't lynch jimbob after you flip.
Why not?
I don’t know, you’ll have to ask moody. He’s the one who’s not expecting a jimbob lynch the first three days.

bessie wrote:Pick for scum partners at end of D1: plytho and jimbobmacdoodle.
Did you consider moody’s flip when making this assessment?
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

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Sabrar
Posts: 42
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Sabrar » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:35 am UTC

bessie's evolution on PW.

IGMEOY and having lots of scummy posts
Trying too hard to appear townie
Conflict between inexperience and scumminess
Post in question
Undecided
Second post in question
Points out same thing as PW did inprevious game as scum, on the scummy side of her list

I don't see a huge push against PW early (at least not with bessie's standards). She consistently has him at the scummy-side of neutral but appears to be mainly undecided (something I can totally relate to). She constantly reevaluates him in light of new information.
Summary: I disagree with bessie switching gears.

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#HBC | Zyth
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2014 5:11 pm UTC

Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:39 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Disagreeing with everything

You're really tunneling/reaching at this point. Bussing is voting to lynch your partner. In a lighter sense, it is verbalizing against your partner. I usually use distancing for that latter meaning, but the two overlap. I can't take anything you say seriously anymore this game.


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