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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:03 am UTC

I'm back to asserting Znirk is town, along with being hella infuriated with Bessie quoting the WAY WRONG THING FROM ZNIRK.
PEdit: no I just blew my stack in rage at Bessie for fucking up the connection for Znirk being cleared. Although maybe it's just me being a dumbass thinking about it because she was replying archivally.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:11 am UTC

mpolo wrote:I think we're overcomplicating on the whole Judgment thing. I don't think it's necessary to have everyone unvote, just make sure that whoever we want to "hammer" unvotes and re-votes. Otherwise, we get the thing down to a couple of votes, and a scum team could use the situation to (1) judge a townie (assuming LaserGuy is town for the argument) (2) Tree-stump another townie (assuming Madge is town for the argument) and then get their night-kill in, making a trifecta of fail for town. I don't want to make something like that easy.

Ninjaed by the hopefully non-cryptographic post from Gamma Emerald.
Are you seriously arguing against free scum?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:16 am UTC

I have to say that plytho's lack of defense and the way he's been responding these last couple of pages comes off to me as a deer caught in tbe headlights, the same way moody reacted.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:20 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:I have to say that plytho's lack of defense and the way he's been responding these last couple of pages comes off to me as a deer caught in tbe headlights, the same way moody reacted.
Where am I lacking?
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:32 am UTC

plytho wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:I have to say that plytho's lack of defense and the way he's been responding these last couple of pages comes off to me as a deer caught in tbe headlights, the same way moody reacted.
Where am I lacking?
Stop agreeing with ppl that you're playing to your scum meta and show us how it's different.

Stop trying to continue the back and forth with bessie when the points have already been summed up. It doesn't look genuine any more.

Have a better scum read than gamma.

Give us the names of your partners.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:39 am UTC

I was on the verge of defending you until you made the you vs bessie thing more of a bickering thing than a bessie is scum thing.

Also the word-for-word parotting of Laser wrt your view on my slot :?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:41 am UTC

Big townie points to Sabrar for these two posts. It’s a townie thing to try and break up a townie fight. I just don’t see scum making an effort to do that. A town on town fight is great for scum. Sabrar vs Gopher of Pern is what got scum the win in shakespeare.

Zen: His defense is somewhat plausible. Part of it is ‘that’s just how I play’ (the 100% claim, the late counter wagon). These were my two biggest issues and it’s hard to just accept the ‘this is how I play’ defense when it’s quite different to the styles I’m used to. It’s also very different to my own: be open about what you do and why you do it style.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:I never addressed you directly D1, but I thought it was clear from my jimbob push that he was the one I was referring to. I guess I can see how you thought I had some elaborate plan? That's not the case though. I just like to pretend that my reads are stronger than they actually are so that scum feels a sense of impending doom and more likely to screw up.
Well, it wasn’t clear. I don’t see how you could think that it was. Seeing as you said you changed your mind about it here.
You also admitted
#HBC | Zyth wrote:My jimbob case was super weak
. Which doesn’t match the 100% claim. I get that scum might get nervous when townies make claims like this, but it’s also making it hard for me to trust you. I keep wondering what the hell you’re planning and what your reasons could be for keeping back information. Those reasons end up looking scummier the less information you share.

At this point I’m still not entirely sure where exactly you stood on jimbob. Some questions to find out:

From what you’ve told us, your main scum read was jimbob all along?
You changed your mind to lurk lynchers over that main read?
You go back to your main read to push an alternative wagon?
You start your push with a weak case on jimbob?
You know it’s weak but you still intend to go for a lynch? (It’s not just a fake wagon to see how scum responds.)

The ‘well, it was jimbob all along’ and ‘I chose to lynch jimbob for competing wagon reasons’ claims are a bit strange in combination.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:It is also the reason why I built up the Jim wagon near the end of the day. I wanted competing wagons, particularly one that would be difficult to build. You don't get as much from easy wagons, because scum can easily justify joining one or the other. Ryu and Gamma were both really easy alternatives to moody.
This is a bit that I don’t really understand yet. But I’m trying:

You push a relatively weak scum read to see who hops on with good/bad reasoning so when your read flips town you see that the alternative wagon was probably scum and the weak reasoners probably too? If they flip scum you see who stayed on the alternative with good/bad reasoning. Hmm, that makes sense. You’re putting yourself at risk too by pushing a weak read that might flip town but town gets a load of info. More than if we just go for two of Gamma,Red Ryu and moody.
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:06 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:Stop agreeing with ppl that you're playing to your scum meta and show us how it's different.
Luckily, after this game it won't be my scum meta anymore :D
#HBC | Zyth wrote: Stop trying to continue the back and forth with bessie when the points have already been summed up. It doesn't look genuine any more.
I made my final point (+why I continued), consider it stopped.
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Have a better scum read than gamma.
Working on those. Are you saying Gamma is an easy scum read or a weak scum read?
#HBC | Zyth wrote:I was on the verge of defending you until you made the you vs bessie thing more of a bickering thing than a bessie is scum thing.
:(
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Also the word-for-word parotting of Laser wrt your view on my slot :?
I just found myself agreeing with him. I don't think that's too odd. We both had you as scum and made lengthy posts with our arguments. We were probably both thinking we had you locked. Then you came back with solid arguments and kept playing a good game. Leading us both to that 'changing our mind' place where we're still in part convinced by our own arguments but at the same time starting to buy into yours.
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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:28 am UTC

Plytho can you explain to me why you dropped your Zen push? What's your read on LaserGuy?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:01 am UTC

Ignore the first question, you answered that already.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:02 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Plytho can you explain to me why you dropped your Zen push?
I feel Zen has given reasonable defense to my points. Where at first I failed to see the townie reason for his moves now I can see it. He's no cleared super townie now. There's still some weirdness about his 100% read and his power claim. But I feel those aren't solid enough for a big push.f

Evil George Washington wrote:What's your read on LaserGuy?
I had a good impression of him at the start of the day. I haven't seen anything scummy enough to stand out without a reread. He seems kind of overconfident. His read on Gamma in particular requires huge confidence in his own reads. The judgement seems like a strange power for scum to have if LaserGuy is scum and kills a townie with it he gets lynched the next day. And if scum did have a power like this it would be a lot more useful in the late game, messing up lylo. So I'm saying LaserGuy is likely town now.
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Sabrar
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Sabrar » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:05 am UTC

plytho wrote:It’s a townie thing to try and break up a townie fight.
You said here that you don't have a good read on bessie. Why are you so sure that she is town now?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:06 am UTC

I'm not sure. I think that's what you're trying to do.
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:08 am UTC

LaserGuy's entrance is entirely null and I have seen nothing to change that. I agree with you that his reads have been pretty lazy and quick as opposed to long and thorough. I have replaced into a slot before, thinking I'd be town, writing up a case and reads, and then finding out that the two 'townies' I felt were being abused were the scum. So keep that in mind, it can be done. Thing is, I slipped as scum through out the game and people noticed. The question is, is Laserguy's content and play here lately matching up with his reads and entrance? What do you think of his switch from Zen to FrozenFlame?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:09 am UTC

I'll look into those as I read him.
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby mpolo » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:15 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:
mpolo wrote:I think we're overcomplicating on the whole Judgment thing. I don't think it's necessary to have everyone unvote, just make sure that whoever we want to "hammer" unvotes and re-votes. Otherwise, we get the thing down to a couple of votes, and a scum team could use the situation to (1) judge a townie (assuming LaserGuy is town for the argument) (2) Tree-stump another townie (assuming Madge is town for the argument) and then get their night-kill in, making a trifecta of fail for town. I don't want to make something like that easy.

Ninjaed by the hopefully non-cryptographic post from Gamma Emerald.
Are you seriously arguing against free scum?


My point is that with 1-2 people voting on the Judgment, it would be easy for 1-2 scum to change the outcome in a way that is not positive for us. Maybe it's not an issue because it would be extremely scummy to do so, guaranteeing that we lynch them on a future day, but I don't see the real benefit to even opening this possibility.
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:20 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:Regarding Madge
Spoiler:
There are players who take Mafia seriously, constantly thinking about it even at work, having a compulsive need to check the thread every 5 minutes to see if there's new content. Then there are those who are just looking for a nice game to play, who enjoy the lying/deception/drama around it but otherwise don't take it too seriously. A subset of this second group does not even care about getting better at the game and does not change their play-style. Guess what group Madge belongs to.

Madge (by her own admission) is bad at reading people. She likes to have actual claims and night-results to compare and analyze. She has nothing like that on D1 therefore she active lurks, not knowing where to start. She occasionally would sign up only as a replacement, not because she doesn't have the time to play but because she hopes that any replacement would be after D1 therefore she can avoid the part of the game she doesn't like.

Madge normally does not vote D1, when she does it's out of self-preservation or in one case because she wanted the indie to come totally clean.

This is Madge not knowing what to do as SK. She makes her claim on D3 only, offering no help to Town before that, especially mentioning not sharing info. By the way she misread her role in that game as well.

The only way Madge knows how to help Town D1 is to share some aspect of her role that she thinks might be relevant.
Here is Madge talking about her power in WoT2 (replaced moody at the start of D2).
This is from another game, very little info but better than nothing, explained later (also Town).
This is her opening as neutral indie.
Town again.

Contrast Secret Santa where she is scum and therefore doesn't mention her role at all.

That takes care of D1. The rest will have to wait.


I will reluctantly back down on this, then. It's not going to be fruitful if we continue any further. I like having fun, but I like to win as well. I hope you could see my frustration towards her at least, in thinking that if she won't use her vote, at least proxy it. If she truly distrusts people simply because she doesn't know us, so be it. Thanks to the meta you have shared I am fine with dropping this. Thank you.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:38 am UTC

Gamma Emerald wrote:PEdit: oh LaserGuy found the original post. Goddammit Bessie WHY DO YOU HAVE TO MAKE EVERY THING CONFU RGSLBDS;OVNBMKLZGNFJVBSK V,'ANV'BKTDGNVGZVNXB AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


I don't understand. Why is it Bessie's fault here? This seems over the top.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 12:02 pm UTC

I'm almost done with my reads list. It's time to start thinking about our top 4's.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Peaceful Whale » Fri Sep 22, 2017 12:09 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:Hmm... I think the boomfrog “wagon” is kinda interesting, I’d really like to know what alignment boomfrog is, I’d say one of them is bussing him if they’re scum, and one is still probably scum if boomfrog is town... let’s wait and see.

I’m watching the plytho wagon and seeing how this unfolds, it feels like something scum could jump on easily, unlesss of course plytho is scum...


I feel if boomfrog flips scum, EGW would be more likely to her scum partner, I feel like he’d be one of the people who would try and separate himself earlier from his partner, if he thought they looked scummy. Just becuase I feel like he’s a better player tjan red Ryu, this of course depends if anyone else actually votes boomfrog and future/past votes.

I still think red Ryu is scummy... anyone else?
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 12:14 pm UTC

Why is Red Ryu scummy?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Peaceful Whale » Fri Sep 22, 2017 12:23 pm UTC

Because he was before, he’s not on my lynch list, but he is scum leaning for early scumminess
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 12:28 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:Because he was before, he’s not on my lynch list, but he is scum leaning for early scumminess


What do you think of his recent play and content?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:04 pm UTC

Reads:

Red Ryu - Town-lean. Ryu was low content in the early game and had weak reads, which set me off. Yet that happens to Town Ruy when he is busy, as Zen has said. As the game progressed, his content has become much better. I like the Gamma push, I like the questioning, scumhunting when times allows.

Gamma Emerald - Gamma has been active lurking especially a lot more lately. His latest quip towards Bessie feels over the top. He originally gave a town reads list which is an easy thing to do regardless of alignment. I don't like his omgus vote. He can go for today. In the previous game he also lurked quite a bit. Earlier I gave him a pass due to school as Fall has started, yet still I see no effort to scum hunt. I also just realized that Moody was lynched due to his response to Gamma. It is likely that Moody was trying to interact with Gamma when it actually became an awkward interaction. Scum.

Spak - Null. I don't really see much effort from him. His content is seeming to get better, yet he still isn't really doing much and that concerns me.

Frozenflame - Null. As I said, I didn't get as much reads from him but I'm not open to lynching him today, I'm not convinced he is scum. I expect him to hang back a bit, if he's scum he'll out himself via POE.

heuristically_alone - Null. The only thing that shows town intent is his question to Moody, which spirals down to Moody being questioned and him dodging it. Otherwise I couldn't really get a bead on him. I tried reading the previous game he was in (with Peaceful Whale) and I was surprised to see him as scum there. It turns out he's pretty open and passive as scum. I have no data from his town game though.

BoomFrog - I originally took his comment towards my Moody vote the wrong way. Plytho actually helped me to understand what Boomfrog was seeing. I could see why he would have a problem with that, when to me it just seemed like he wanted to move me off of Moody. I can see why it would be weird for him to see me vote Moody when I only gave reasoning for Ryu. (I felt I didn't need to re-state it) I find him to be very wrong on most of his reads though. Slight-town.

Sabrar - My town read of Sabrar was solidified D1 post Moody flip. He questioned Moody, wagoned him and even asked me to re-join. Half claiming his role at the start is also townie along with that. Only way I’d doubt him if he was an opportunist who intended to bus Moody for the town cred. Saber asking Zen to clarify in early game seems townie. He didn’t notice he was interrupting Zen’s progress yet scum would not break things up on purpose like that simply for town cred. Too risky, and it’s gained him some heat. There were some things I found questionable, but his explanations made sense. For example, him asking me about Boom.

Peaceful Whale - I read Fridge Mafia, and was surprised to see Plytho and HA flip mafia there. I had the knowledge that PW was scum thanks to Crossover. He tried to be very helpful, to seem town. So he knows how to seem town. This game, he doesn’t have the need to seem town, yet he knows that tactic has been over-used. The only way I can see him as scum is if his scum mates told him to act dumb to fool us into thinking he is different than before and therefore not scum. Smart play. Individually, I see him posting in early game, but then after all this he has quite a fall off. I don’t really see much trying. This is a minus for me. It makes me wonder what he truly wants to do. In his last few posts, he has been wishy washy, and giving general opinions of a wagon without being specific. He is being a bit reserved. Noob scum.

Bessie - Null. I found her initial push on Peaceful Whale convincing. Such as him taking reads in her style. I did find it weird that she changed her mind due to my reasoning, as I feel it wasn't that convincing. Especially when Boomfrog commented on the same reasoning with a different conclusion. (That he did the same as scum before so we shouldn't take that for granted) I also found it weird that she had not been engaging me D1, and then popped up with this Jimbob push at a convenient time. I also feel like I have seen a lot less of her lately. She also had Moody as 'would not like to lynch', so Moody's flip doesn't reflect positively on her.

Laser Guy - Null. His entrance is entirely null (A+ for effort though), and it doesn't match up to his current play. I have replaced into a game with the mindset of being town, writing up reads, and turning up as scum, so it can be done and we shouldn't give town points for that especially if you see differences in his play now then his opening post. He seems to have a problem with my push against Boom and Znirk, yet he hasn't engaged me on it nor has he defended them, which is odd. There is also the problem that his slot lurked out through a whole day. His reads are lazy and his switch from Zen to Frozenflame is also weak.

Znirk - Znirk's first post seems good. Yet the rest don't match up. This makes it apparent that he was making that first post for appearances sake, rather then to shake things up. He never actually followed up on that post, so it shows he didn't really intend to do anything with it. He states he is a gut reader but doesn't really do anything with it this game. Lurking scum. In one of the last games I have seen him give a full reads list and he was town cop.

jimbobmacdoodle - Null. I don't have a problem with him, and don't see why people want to lynch him. He is posting content and reads, much better then Znirk or Gamma.

plytho - Slight-town. I like him clarifying things and coming from a place of 'giving understanding'. I like that he points out Laserguy is being lazy with his reads.

Madge - Due to Sabrar's meta read of Madge, I'll put this as Null.

mpolo - I don't really get any read from him either way. I tried reading his ISO, all I get is content that seems like he isn't read up. Null.

#HBC | Zyth - He’s been proactive in the early game, which I liked. He asked me to take a harder look at Moody, which I did. He also asked Moody questions, and found him weird. I do agree with Sabrar that he didn’t let MPOLO come back to defend himself. His response to Sabrar isn't satisfactory. He hasn't really been working with me, or trying that hard to find scum. Usually I'd expect a big case with all these sub-categories. I do expect him to be anti-town, and wait and observe regardless of alignment. I don't expect him to skim as often as he has, and not go into detail in his scumreads. His Jimbob read wasn't as convincing as his Spak or Ryu reads. D2, his entire focus was his defense. His latest posts come off as opportunistic. I don't like the tone of them. He's bearing his mafia teeth. It is true that he would not bus, but do consider that as scum, he would interact and distance. Also consider that he rarely even used our 'bro relationship' at all. I did not like him also stating he'd retire until the day of deadline, there is no purpose in doing that. It shows he truly does not care to find scum.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:05 pm UTC

Gamma - Zen - Znirk - Peaceful Whale

Unvote; Vote: Gamma

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:07 pm UTC

Amrock wrote:Ran do you want me to vote with you this period??


Vote Gamma please. :)

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:18 pm UTC

Red Ryu: I think the reads list should answer some of your questions. Zen doesn't match up with his town self. Especially his D1 Jimbob push. Ask yourself if Zen has given any convincing read and pushed them to death or near death. No, I only see a defense and a turtling playstyle right now. If he were town I would expect a hard push on his for sure scumread no matter what way he could get it. (Necromafia is a good example, instead of casing Kary, he just stated he copped her, which was a lie, we were both confident she was scum though) I would expect him to make a bizarre claim as mafia. I feel his fake claims as mafia are not up to par. He claimed Tracker one time as mafia when Orbo was clearly obv town and tracker. I don't expect you to see eye to eye with me on Peaceful Whale, but I think he is noob scum. (Mostly due to falling off after early game pressure and wishy washiness.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:19 pm UTC

I’m going to try to build my reads list off the wagon analysis. This post has the wagon analysis. It has a rudimentary reads list based almost entirely on the wagons. More elaborate reads based on content will follow, scummiest looking players first. I don't know how far I'll get by when.

General thoughts on the wagons: At the point where Zen switched from jimbob to moody these were the people not on the moody wagon:
Madge (2): Madge, SirGabriel,
BoomFrog (1): Spak
Red Ryu (1):moody7277
jimbobmacdoodle (5): Frozenflame, #HBC | Zyth, Bessie,Peaceful Whale, #HBC | Red Ryu
Gamma Emerald (1): mpolo,
Spak (1): Gamma Emerald

Not Voting (2): heuristically_alone, Dark Horse

The point where Zen switched was moody’s death warrant. There may have been some hope that moody might live before, but after that switch it was over. So who are the people possibly hoping to save moody:

Madge: was going to hammer whichever wagon won if necessary
SirG: not relevant
Spak: doesn’t vote moody when he can. Moves vote from BoomFrog to Madge after being caught up late at that point moody is at 9 votes. States that he wants to have a FAIR vote down by deadline. To me this feels like dodging the vote. Even if you’re not caught up you could put down a temporary vote of at least an opinion on the four lynch targets based on what you’ve read so far. Spak doesn’t do that and waits until the last minute to not vote moody.
Moody: not relevant
FrozenFlame: The second to move to moody after Zen. Even more than Zen’s his position looks bad.
Zen: He’s the one calling the jimbob wagon dead. Bringing LaserGuy and FrozenFlame with him. I’m not convinced that Zen had the power to force mislynch there. Peaceful whale would have come over to moody for sure after a while, Frozen and bessie as well. Their cases against jimbob and pro moody weren’t strong enough to stubbornly defend their position to no-lynch.
Bessie: Bessie gets some leniency for showing up late (she announced she wouldn’t be online before) so doesn’t look nearly as bad as the others.
Peaceful Whale: The first to move after Zen. He’s just trying to follow town consensus.
Red Ryu: Claims not to care about neither moody nor jimbob, but he’s the only one (other than moody) still voting jimbob at days end. Despite saying he’d be around to switch. Really not looking good.
Mpolo: hospitalized
Gamma Emerald: Similar to Spak: he shows up late and votes jimbob long after that wagon is dead (moody gives up around this point).
Heuristically alone: not present
Dark Horse: not present

Likelihood of being buddies with moody:
More likely:
Red Ryu
Spak
Gamma Emerald
FrozenFlame
Bessie
Zen
Madge
Peaceful Whale
Less likely

Not relevant/available: SirG, heuristically_alone, Dark Horse, mpolo

People on the moody wagon:
moody7277 (7): BoomFrog, jimbobmacdoodle, Sabrar, Evil George Washington, plytho, Znirk, Maven89


These people get townie points for being on the right wagon.
BoomFrog: quite early on the wagon
Jimbobmacdoodle: was on this wagon before his own started, he wasn’t trying to saeve himself
Sabrar: I said before that Zen’s switch killed moody but it was Sabrar, with EGW (and me) that put his head on the chopping block. Solid town points there.
Evil George Washington: See Sabrar.
Plytho: See Sabrar
Znirk: said his vote was pretty much blind, but he voted at 5-6 to make it 5-7 instread of 6-6 which pushed the balance sufficiently towards moody to make his lynch the most likely. voted at 5-5 to make it 5-6 (at which point our senior wagonomist Zen seemed to realise it would be moody) So still a pretty good look.
Maven: I almost didn’t put maven on this list, making it look like Znirk was the 7th vote. instead he was 6th, making Znirk looking slightly less good)

Likelihood of being buddies with moody:
Very unlikely:
Sabrar
Evil George Washington
Jimbobmacdoodle
Znirk
BoomFrog
unlikely
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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | N1 | 9/16

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:21 pm UTC

BoomFrog wrote:5) I was trying to undermine your Moody lynch, it was suspiciously strong. The underlined was not my justification for my 70% read. My read came from Moody's read list. Roughly the point when I asked Bessie to reread Moody is the point I had decided to switch to Moody. Your willingness to change was just a nice reassurance that kept my confidence high.


Fair enough, I think I can see your perspective. Especially with how you reacted to my Moody vote. I think you read my moody vote / ryu statement wrong, and I apologize for the miscommunication. I meant to say that I didn't feel the need to re-state my read on Moody, so I had him as first to go. I just asked myself "Does Boomfrog feel *werd* at the time?" and thought no, and felt Moody did. His awkwardness showed, and I stuck to that. You can ask Zen, I try to look for the scum intent. I don't agree with some of your reads though. We must talk through these, you and I.

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plytho
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:27 pm UTC

@Evil George Washington: You seem to have a lot of nulls in your list. Can you order your list from town to scum please?
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:37 pm UTC

Town

Sabrar
Red Ryu
Boomfrog
Plytho
Jimbob
Heuristically Alone
Madge
Frozen Flame
Bessie
Mpolo
LaserGuy
Spak
Peaceful Whale
Znirk
Zen
Gamma

Scum

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:57 pm UTC

I'm going to sleep now. Good night thread. Make sure to list out your Bottom 4's! :)

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:17 pm UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:
Gamma Emerald wrote:PEdit: oh LaserGuy found the original post. Goddammit Bessie WHY DO YOU HAVE TO MAKE EVERY THING CONFU RGSLBDS;OVNBMKLZGNFJVBSK V,'ANV'BKTDGNVGZVNXB AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


I don't understand. Why is it Bessie's fault here? This seems over the top.

Because it was Bessie's post that made me aware that a slip existed

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BoomFrog
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby BoomFrog » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:26 pm UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Town

Sabrar
Red Ryu
Boomfrog
Plytho
Jimbob
Heuristically Alone
Madge
Frozen Flame
Bessie
Mpolo
LaserGuy
Spak
Peaceful Whale
Znirk
Zen
Gamma

Scum

We really do disagree a lot.

A) Do you understand my read of gamma's "town slip"? All of gamma's other content is terrible, but it's blatantly terrible, like gamma is just bad at reading people. But that town slip feels genuine.

B) I'm starting to agree on plytho. The lynch vote analysis looks good, and honestly, shamelessly sticking to his "scummy meta" is a bold move for scum. I'm leaning more town on him.

C) PW isn't on the possibilities today but I agree he needs to put out more opinions on specific people, otherwise he's going to slide down everyone's lists just from process of elimination.

D) My Zen read is old (I've been giggling to myself about the cajones line for two days on my bus rides home from work). But you raise some very good points. I'm not for lynching her but I've got some questions. (Next post).

E) You and plytho's points about Sabrar are good. My only strong ping is his read on me being wrong. @Sabrar: Do you find me scummy still? why, specifically? If not, what convinced you?
"Everything I need to know about parenting I learned from cooking. Don't be afraid to experiment, and eat your mistakes." - Cronos

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:28 pm UTC

Also wrt you current read on me, "no effort to scumhunt"? I've been trying to scum hunt and town hunt so what the hell are you ACTUALLY saying? And everyone seems to think my FF vote is an OMGUS vote when it's me voting within a group where I figured scum would be. I've noticed this trend where people will shout Oh me yarm Oh IT'S OMGUS OBVSCUMZZZZZZZZ whenever someone votes someone closely after they were voted by that person. Put some forethought into your analysis guys.

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:30 pm UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:
Amrock wrote:Ran do you want me to vote with you this period??


Vote Gamma please. :)

Nah fuck that, read me yourself, you have more experience with me than her, and you were good in FWiaB

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BoomFrog
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby BoomFrog » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:37 pm UTC

@Zen: Why have you not delved into the votes you put so much effort into generating D1?

What is your opinion of JimBob right now?

Why did you push Dark Horse so late and so weakly D1? You should have known at that point that you wouldn't get any support for it.

#HBC | Zyth wrote: @Boom, when you get back. Updated read on h_a?
How could I possibly update my read on him? He's fallen off the map.

Do you have a large home collection of magnificent brass balls?
"Everything I need to know about parenting I learned from cooking. Don't be afraid to experiment, and eat your mistakes." - Cronos

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:45 pm UTC

mpolo wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:
mpolo wrote:I think we're overcomplicating on the whole Judgment thing. I don't think it's necessary to have everyone unvote, just make sure that whoever we want to "hammer" unvotes and re-votes. Otherwise, we get the thing down to a couple of votes, and a scum team could use the situation to (1) judge a townie (assuming LaserGuy is town for the argument) (2) Tree-stump another townie (assuming Madge is town for the argument) and then get their night-kill in, making a trifecta of fail for town. I don't want to make something like that easy.

Ninjaed by the hopefully non-cryptographic post from Gamma Emerald.
Are you seriously arguing against free scum?


My point is that with 1-2 people voting on the Judgment, it would be easy for 1-2 scum to change the outcome in a way that is not positive for us. Maybe it's not an issue because it would be extremely scummy to do so, guaranteeing that we lynch them on a future day, but I don't see the real benefit to even opening this possibility.
My point is that if they did that, we would in the process be getting free scum. You do realize that by doing this, they would be outing themselves? You don't think that is positive? I'm confused as to why past Zen ever had a town read on you.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:55 pm UTC

plytho wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Stop agreeing with ppl that you're playing to your scum meta and show us how it's different.
Luckily, after this game it won't be my scum meta anymore :D
#HBC | Zyth wrote: Stop trying to continue the back and forth with bessie when the points have already been summed up. It doesn't look genuine any more.
I made my final point (+why I continued), consider it stopped.
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Have a better scum read than gamma.
Working on those. Are you saying Gamma is an easy scum read or a weak scum read?
#HBC | Zyth wrote:I was on the verge of defending you until you made the you vs bessie thing more of a bickering thing than a bessie is scum thing.
:(
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Also the word-for-word parotting of Laser wrt your view on my slot :?
I just found myself agreeing with him. I don't think that's too odd. We both had you as scum and made lengthy posts with our arguments. We were probably both thinking we had you locked. Then you came back with solid arguments and kept playing a good game. Leading us both to that 'changing our mind' place where we're still in part convinced by our own arguments but at the same time starting to buy into yours.
Hmmk. I'm still looking over you and bessie, and haven't fully come to a decision yet. I probably will later today. It just seemed like you were giving up these past few pages. My overall feel of your play is still positive at the moment though (which will be seen in my following post on Spak).

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Red Ryu » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:08 pm UTC

mpolo wrote:I think we're overcomplicating on the whole Judgment thing. I don't think it's necessary to have everyone unvote, just make sure that whoever we want to "hammer" unvotes and re-votes. Otherwise, we get the thing down to a couple of votes, and a scum team could use the situation to (1) judge a townie (assuming LaserGuy is town for the argument) (2) Tree-stump another townie (assuming Madge is town for the argument) and then get their night-kill in, making a trifecta of fail for town. I don't want to make something like that easy.

Ninjaed by the hopefully non-cryptographic post from Gamma Emerald.


This is also where I stand on the voting and inviting idea Btw.


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