The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
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- charliepanayi
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The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
Out next week, rave reviews (which I have to admit, I was not expecting) - who is planning to see it?
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
Planning to, but a bit of a backlog of late-summer releases still. Coincidentally, I found my copy of the game, the other day. Haven't tried to get it working on a modern computer, yet. Should at least work on an XP box.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
Surprisingly, I think I'm actually going to see this. I've been extremely skeptical about it for a few reasons, not least that the modern movie industry mostly just doesn't do any of the things that made the original so great these days (I mean, try to imagine modern Hollywood turning out anything so dreamily-paced without two dozen coke-addled executives complaining about how it's too slow! and oh, could it also maybe feature shakycam and speed-ramping?) but a combination of signs that the filmmakers have their hearts in the right place and some of the early raves have me convinced to at least give it a shot. If nothing else, the prospect of seeing the re-energized Harrison Ford who showed up in JJ-Wars in a movie that doesn't completely waste his best performance in twenty years is worth a gamble.
No Vangelis is total bullshit, though.
No Vangelis is total bullshit, though.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
No Vangelis? 
I'm still pumped.

I'm still pumped.
There's a certain amount of freedom involved in cycling: you're self-propelled and decide exactly where to go. If you see something that catches your eye to the left, you can veer off there, which isn't so easy in a car, and you can't cover as much ground walking.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
He's not even dead, fer cryin' out loud!
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
Well, surprised that I'm the first here to see this, apparently, given I have now seen this. (Had another film in my pending list as today's plan-to-watch, but the timings encouraged me to switch priorities.)
Visually, they've kept (and expanded upon) much of the much-loved original style. I believe it's the same world (and yet that it's not all just zee-rusted Coruscant/Trantor/Megacity One) with the same tech and society and the like (only moved on, and with hints of 'history').
The soundtrack works (except for some over-volume in one bit in particular, but that's a minor niggle given contemporary styles of movie making) and the rumbling chords and tuned percussion do their jobs.
The plot... I can't won't go into the specifics, yet, but I was worried I was being unintentionally telegraphed some details. I wasn't. I liked what they did. I did think they'd be inverting a very key part of original* canon, cleverly, but they actually... Yeah, not going there. There's still some departures. One of the bits is in the textual preamble explaining the film setting which, given the homage given in the very last scene, is notable. But I'll happily skip over that.
(* - Depending on which Cut you accept, of the original production. There are at least three, with different fan-interperetations/official conclusions to each.)
It feels a bit gratuitous, in places, pandering to both modern audiences (nudity, violence, explosions) and nostalgic ones (presenting scenes echoing ones from the original, not to mention in-universe replays), but that's what we've probably all come for.
I can't predict your collective reactions, but I thought it worked well. I may even see it again, if I can clear the rest of my backlog of films-to-see, just to catch more of the references - or perhaps try the 3d version (though I really don't like encouraging the practice of making those, on the whole). YMMV, but it's a solid production, IMO. I await your disagreements and refutations, of course.
Visually, they've kept (and expanded upon) much of the much-loved original style. I believe it's the same world (and yet that it's not all just zee-rusted Coruscant/Trantor/Megacity One) with the same tech and society and the like (only moved on, and with hints of 'history').
The soundtrack works (except for some over-volume in one bit in particular, but that's a minor niggle given contemporary styles of movie making) and the rumbling chords and tuned percussion do their jobs.
The plot... I can't won't go into the specifics, yet, but I was worried I was being unintentionally telegraphed some details. I wasn't. I liked what they did. I did think they'd be inverting a very key part of original* canon, cleverly, but they actually... Yeah, not going there. There's still some departures. One of the bits is in the textual preamble explaining the film setting which, given the homage given in the very last scene, is notable. But I'll happily skip over that.
(* - Depending on which Cut you accept, of the original production. There are at least three, with different fan-interperetations/official conclusions to each.)
It feels a bit gratuitous, in places, pandering to both modern audiences (nudity, violence, explosions) and nostalgic ones (presenting scenes echoing ones from the original, not to mention in-universe replays), but that's what we've probably all come for.
I can't predict your collective reactions, but I thought it worked well. I may even see it again, if I can clear the rest of my backlog of films-to-see, just to catch more of the references - or perhaps try the 3d version (though I really don't like encouraging the practice of making those, on the whole). YMMV, but it's a solid production, IMO. I await your disagreements and refutations, of course.

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Re: Blade Runner 2049
I enjoyed it immensely. Even the volume. The color palette was very nice. It was long! But that's okay; I like long movies.
I peed right before it started but I still had to Go by a third of the way in (I held it). Might see it again just to watch with a relaxed bladder that's not running away with discomfort.
I peed right before it started but I still had to Go by a third of the way in (I held it). Might see it again just to watch with a relaxed bladder that's not running away with discomfort.
There's a certain amount of freedom involved in cycling: you're self-propelled and decide exactly where to go. If you see something that catches your eye to the left, you can veer off there, which isn't so easy in a car, and you can't cover as much ground walking.
Re: Blade Runner 2049
I really liked it. It looked great, made a very good use of its soundtrack, had nice designs and SF ideas, and surprised me several times. I expected many cliché things to happen, and quite often they came and were very different from my expectations. The nostalgic moments are done right: they are either subtle or at least quite different from standards.
(On the other hand a few cliché things that I didn't expect did happen, and a few things feel like fridge logic to me).
Also I didn't think the nudity was gratuitous. I remember like two scenes, and I think both served a purpose.
Weird product placement: K's car is a Peugeot. But then Lieutenant Columbo drove a Peugeot as well, so maybe all the cool cops do that in California.
(On the other hand a few cliché things that I didn't expect did happen, and a few things feel like fridge logic to me).
Also I didn't think the nudity was gratuitous. I remember like two scenes, and I think both served a purpose.
Weird product placement: K's car is a Peugeot. But then Lieutenant Columbo drove a Peugeot as well, so maybe all the cool cops do that in California.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
Days after, the full nudities I still remember were the 'birth' scene (putting that in terms that are particularly obscure and misleading to those who haven't seen it yet), which relied on bodily obscuration of an obvious nude to keep it from being full-frontal, and the Joi 'advertisement' which had helluva lot of gratuitous nipple on show (and indicates a very relaxed regulation of the industry1). The 'threesome' was much tamer and cut away but seemed to go further than "it's possible, and probably this isn't the first time it has been done".
But gratuitous isn't continual. The violence was extreme in some circumstances (the impersonal fate of non-green-eyes, for example) but not every moment. The explosions (prior to "do your job", then again prior to the snatch team) seemed like a slightly unnecessary use of pyrotechnics when the plot could have progressed in other ways. I just saw each of those as made more like modern movies trend towards and not quite like the original flavouring (except maybe the violence, Zhora's glass-smashing and spasming upon 'retirement' in particular).
I was worried that my appreciation of the film would outpace that of everyone else, and it's nice to see that others do find it good. That leaves my small ifs and buts as looking far more significant than I intend. Don't take these as negatives, merely small scratches (perceived!) on an otherwise quite polished product.
1 Or the advanced AI clearly working in the drones and homes is trusted to self-censor based on the audience. Not that there are many city-kids running round that area at that time of night. Society is probably not that different to ours, just more pressure towards the middle and the edges.
But gratuitous isn't continual. The violence was extreme in some circumstances (the impersonal fate of non-green-eyes, for example) but not every moment. The explosions (prior to "do your job", then again prior to the snatch team) seemed like a slightly unnecessary use of pyrotechnics when the plot could have progressed in other ways. I just saw each of those as made more like modern movies trend towards and not quite like the original flavouring (except maybe the violence, Zhora's glass-smashing and spasming upon 'retirement' in particular).
I was worried that my appreciation of the film would outpace that of everyone else, and it's nice to see that others do find it good. That leaves my small ifs and buts as looking far more significant than I intend. Don't take these as negatives, merely small scratches (perceived!) on an otherwise quite polished product.
1 Or the advanced AI clearly working in the drones and homes is trusted to self-censor based on the audience. Not that there are many city-kids running round that area at that time of night. Society is probably not that different to ours, just more pressure towards the middle and the edges.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
One of the reasons it works so well is that it really is a sequel. Not like the current rash of Alien flicks. I also didn't realize it was the same director as Arrival and was comparing the throbbing synths of the two in my head.
Edit:
Edit:
Spoiler:
There's a certain amount of freedom involved in cycling: you're self-propelled and decide exactly where to go. If you see something that catches your eye to the left, you can veer off there, which isn't so easy in a car, and you can't cover as much ground walking.
Re: Blade Runner 2049
Visually the movie was excellent. The feel of the setting and everything was spot on. Acting was also quite good. There were a some plot problems though. They really are fridge logic on this one since they don't really seem to get caught immediately when watching just because there's so much going on visually, or audibly in the scenes. It was also a tad long, which I imagine is not helping its mediocre box office numbers. The theatre I went to only had an ~8 pm show not the usual ~7 and ~9 shows.
Plot stuff and some other comments (with spoilers, clearly)
Plot stuff and some other comments (with spoilers, clearly)
Spoiler:
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
Chen wrote:Plot stuff and some other comments (with spoilers, clearly)Spoiler:
My takes on those:
Spoiler:
Just seen my first actual critic's review of the film, as well. A film critic, by profession, that is, not someone criticising. Because he wasn't. He raved about it. And this from a guy I often find likes things far less than I do, and rarely shows so much enthusiasm. Bodes well for my own appreciation.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
Saw it. Liked it. Some things made me think.
Nitpick
Liked
Nitpick
Spoiler:
Liked
Spoiler:
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
CorruptUser wrote:Saw it. Liked it. Some things made me think.
NitpickSpoiler:
Spoiler:
There's a certain amount of freedom involved in cycling: you're self-propelled and decide exactly where to go. If you see something that catches your eye to the left, you can veer off there, which isn't so easy in a car, and you can't cover as much ground walking.
Re: Blade Runner 2049
Liri wrote:CorruptUser wrote:NitpickSpoiler:Spoiler:
Spoiler:
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
I was going to say "the heat signature", but then temporarily forgot ordinary thermodynamics.
Spoiler:
Re: Blade Runner 2049
I suppose the animated short movies might explain some of the history. The 2022 one for instance seems to be about the blackout.
Soylent Green related nitpick:
And since we are all mentionning the fridge logic and weird stuff:
Also I agree with Chen about coincidences; and there is more to say about the ending:
Soylent Green related nitpick:
Spoiler:
And since we are all mentionning the fridge logic and weird stuff:
Spoiler:
Also I agree with Chen about coincidences; and there is more to say about the ending:
Spoiler:
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
It is still an open question about Deckard, before you go to far into making that particular assumption.
Re: Blade Runner 2049
CorruptUser wrote:Spoiler:
I don't think it follows at all, even though it worked in Dragon Ball Z. Also intelligence and artistic competence are two different things.
When two intelligent people marry and have kids, their kids aren't automatically genius artists.
Re: Blade Runner 2049
Spoiler:
Re: Blade Runner 2049
I saw it last night. It was gorgeous, sound design and soundtrack was generally excellent, and it was perhaps the most misogynistic and violent towards women film I've seen in a long time. I was shocked at how terrible and flat its portrayal of women was.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
I didn't see an issue with the female characters myself (and I certainly don't think the film is misogynistic), but the nudey statues and billboard were pretty dumb.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
Spoiler:
I could go in, but I'm sure others have covered it better than I did.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
I think part of the point was that it dehumanized the sex to the point where it was no longer sexy. There's nudity everywhere, including the "look on my o-face ye mighty and despair" statues out in Las Vegas, but the only sexy scene in the entire movie is that robo-threesome where you don't see any nudity.
Question, does it pass the Bechdal Test? There's a scene where Killbot 9000 meets with the police chief, and while I think they were talking about Mr McGuffin I don't think they were talking about the relationship, so I think it passes.
Question, does it pass the Bechdal Test? There's a scene where Killbot 9000 meets with the police chief, and while I think they were talking about Mr McGuffin I don't think they were talking about the relationship, so I think it passes.
Re: Blade Runner 2049
Sure, make nudity unsexy, no problem. But other than those few shots we get at the corporate place, they are all nude shots of female bodies only. How surprising!
The most illogical part of the movie though is
The most illogical part of the movie though is
Spoiler:
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
The original movie had Deckard practically rape Rachael, or at best take advantage of a woman in an emotionally unstable state of mind, whereas Roy Batty was rather tender with Tris. Violence against women was prominent from the start.
Of course, I go by the theory that Roy was the hero of the first movie and Deckard was a murderer.
Of course, I go by the theory that Roy was the hero of the first movie and Deckard was a murderer.
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Re: Blade Runner 2049
Hmmm, what those points make me think of is a (only partially-supported) side-theory on the trans-apocalyptic world of Blade Runner, both movies, that there's a sort of Children Of Men scenario where women are artificially depleted. Perhaps prioritised for off-worlding, perhaps susceptible to some Colony Collapse Disorder influence where wives and mothers are overwhelmingly kept in filtered family homes, leaving just 'working girls' (unconcerned/actively against fertility) and professionals such as Madam Cop (career over biology) out there. The latter being out of the dating equation, the former filling part of the void with VR-tech covering most of the rest.
You just never see the kind of woman you should care about (they're off-Earth or 'happily' stay at home). And maybe that's also a further partial reason for Mad CEO to be seeking a particularly viable version of his product.
(Doesn't explain the extreme population densities (nor the quite obvious non-Children Of Men existence of neo:Dickensian orphanages that aren't groaning under the weight of continual rich patronage), unless it's only high-density in the likes of Megacity One, and surprisingly peopled even in the scrapyards, because most of the planet is unlivable except for (male) bug-farmers who tend their 'livestock' in a practically monastic lifestyle. - Though there's another reason why he wouldn't have a wife, of course.)
Yeah, multiple problems with that being passably usable as canon. Probably blame Central Casting for being man-heavy, then and now. (Or the Casting Couch being heavy upon women, as we're increasingly finding out...) But it does paint our dystopia with further shades that are similarly short on pink-and-rose hues.
You just never see the kind of woman you should care about (they're off-Earth or 'happily' stay at home). And maybe that's also a further partial reason for Mad CEO to be seeking a particularly viable version of his product.
(Doesn't explain the extreme population densities (nor the quite obvious non-Children Of Men existence of neo:Dickensian orphanages that aren't groaning under the weight of continual rich patronage), unless it's only high-density in the likes of Megacity One, and surprisingly peopled even in the scrapyards, because most of the planet is unlivable except for (male) bug-farmers who tend their 'livestock' in a practically monastic lifestyle. - Though there's another reason why he wouldn't have a wife, of course.)
Yeah, multiple problems with that being passably usable as canon. Probably blame Central Casting for being man-heavy, then and now. (Or the Casting Couch being heavy upon women, as we're increasingly finding out...) But it does paint our dystopia with further shades that are similarly short on pink-and-rose hues.
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Re: The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
It was... alright. Some parts were really good, but this movie felt really bloated and could easily have been a half-hour shorter. It seemed like every single scene had dramatic pauses for effect, with emotional music in the background and characters staring at each other. Which is fine if you do it once or twice in a movie, but by the second half I kept thinking "get on with it!"
Also the treatment of women was definitely a bit skeevy. The character of Joi really didn't have much impact on the plot, and she had basically zero agency. I guess she was meant to be a foil to the female replicants, to make them seem more human?
Nitpick:
Also the treatment of women was definitely a bit skeevy. The character of Joi really didn't have much impact on the plot, and she had basically zero agency. I guess she was meant to be a foil to the female replicants, to make them seem more human?
Nitpick:
Spoiler:
Re: Blade Runner 2049
Zohar wrote:Spoiler:
I could go in, but I'm sure others have covered it better than I did.
Some comments
Spoiler:
Re: Blade Runner 2049
Zohar wrote:The most illogical part of the movie though isSpoiler:
Did the movie really make that suggestion? I don't remember when.
Regarding K's instance of Joi being useless. That is made explicit during that gratuitous nudity scene (or was that fan disservice ?):
Spoiler:
Actually most things in this movie are quite useless, plotwise. If you consider what has been accomplished between the beginning and the end of the movie ~ nothing much really. So everything is only there to tell messages and have symbolic or mood value. Such would be the case of every scene Wallace appears in, for instance.
Last edited by Grop on Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:21 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Blade Runner 2049
Chen wrote:Some commentsSpoiler:
Spoiler:
CorruptUser wrote:The original movie had Deckard practically rape Rachael, or at best take advantage of a woman in an emotionally unstable state of mind, whereas Roy Batty was rather tender with Tris. Violence against women was prominent from the start.
Just because the original movie was violent towards women is not a reason to expect the second movie to follow suit.
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Re: The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
Joi was in the movie to make you question whether a computer program could be alive, in the same way people question if skinjobs are people.
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Re: The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
And ad-Joi was implicitly rejected as a replacement, just like re-Rachael explicitly was. I don't think it's entirely clear that the memory of either 'original' was downgraded from 'real' (nor that the memory of both were not) by the relative experiences. Though any attachment was non-transferable, either from true grief or from a determination not to fall for the 'trap' being set by the various levels of the corporation(s) concerned.
Re: The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
They left the ad-JOI at the end ambiguous particularly to bring up this kind of questions. The realization when she calls him Joe is there and clearly made the character also question whether or not the other JOI was really "alive" or just something telling him what he wanted and programmed to do so. Like much of the film's philosophy (like the first film) they leave it open ended without a firm conclusion on it.
Re: The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
I REALLY wanted to see this in theaters — especially after my whole family gave it good reviews. They’re all big fans of the original.
Unfortunately, they pulled this from the theater in town before I could see it (the disadvantages of going to school in a small town!) and I don’t think it’ll still be in theaters when I make it back home (which’ll be for thanksgiving).
:/
(I mean, I doubt my quizbowl team will want to waste time and get back super late next weekend,and I don’t drive, so I’m probably not going to be able to make it into the city)
Unfortunately, they pulled this from the theater in town before I could see it (the disadvantages of going to school in a small town!) and I don’t think it’ll still be in theaters when I make it back home (which’ll be for thanksgiving).
:/
(I mean, I doubt my quizbowl team will want to waste time and get back super late next weekend,and I don’t drive, so I’m probably not going to be able to make it into the city)
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Re: The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
Good movie, good reviews ... I wonder why it underperformed at the box office.
There have been a few movies like that lately. Alien Covenant, War for the Planet of the Apes. It must be maddening for the companies: we know it is a good movie, you know it is a good movie, why aren't many people going to see it?
There have been a few movies like that lately. Alien Covenant, War for the Planet of the Apes. It must be maddening for the companies: we know it is a good movie, you know it is a good movie, why aren't many people going to see it?
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Re: The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
Alien Covenant wasn't that great. Visually it was lovely though.
And I didn't see the new PotA because I haven't seen the previous ones in this trio(?) even though I'd heard good things. And I didn't see the earlier ones because I haven't finished the originals. It's missed opportunities all the way down.
And I didn't see the new PotA because I haven't seen the previous ones in this trio(?) even though I'd heard good things. And I didn't see the earlier ones because I haven't finished the originals. It's missed opportunities all the way down.
There's a certain amount of freedom involved in cycling: you're self-propelled and decide exactly where to go. If you see something that catches your eye to the left, you can veer off there, which isn't so easy in a car, and you can't cover as much ground walking.
Re: The 2048th sequel to Blade Runner
The new Planet of the Apes just looked like more of the previous movie, so it didn't really interest me very much...
Mighty Jalapeno: "See, Zohar agrees, and he's nice to people."
SecondTalon: "Still better looking than Jesus."
Not how I say my name
SecondTalon: "Still better looking than Jesus."
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