Newbie New Year Mafia - D5

For your simulated organized crime needs.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:23 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Isn't taking a balanced view a townie thing to do?
This feels like unusual wine coming from jimbob and is pinging me.
Also why do you immediately FoS HS because of misrepresentation before you hear his answer to your question? As with bessie, this is overreacting.
I knew somebody would call me out on this as I was writing it (I even considered putting a note to that effect in the original), but I genuinely am confused about it. I'm sure I've seen people award townie points to others for this, and I believe I have done the same, so this just felt like Hari trying to find excuses to give me negative points.

As for FoSsing him, why should I wait? It's an indication of how I feel before the answer. If he gives a good explanation, I might remove it, but otherwise, I think the FoS is justified.
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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby bessie » Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:27 pm UTC

Vicarin wrote:Because I feel that this thread would degenerate into me and a few other people talking to each other for ages. Also, I would really like some more info on some people to get a better read, mainly the ones that haven't got a vote going.
Perhaps but why shouldn’t I be suspicious that scum!you wants to know where everyone else stands before you commit?

LaserGuy wrote:I'm staring at this post by Suzaku answering whether mafia have daychat or night chat. PW posts his first post immediately before it; somitomi posts shortly after. I wonder if mafia could have had the same error in their role PMs and were delaying posting to try to get this sorted with the mod. Interesting. I'm curious to see where this goes.
See below response to somitomi, I’m now thinking about this.

LaserGuy wrote:Out of curiosity, any reason why you're voting somitomi instead of PW?
If I’m wrong about Peaceful Whale, I still have other reasons to suspect somitomi.

Sabrar wrote:Out of curiosity how is this any different from your attack on Madge in Secret santa?
Well, for one thing I have a different point of view than I did in Secret Santa.

Peaceful Whale wrote:Players who joke confirmed:
I posted that just because I thought (think?) scum players are more likely to joke confirm, as try just want to get something out there so they’re not lurking, and worried that whatever they say will be too tense they do a joke. I’m not so sure about this anymore, but it’s what I was thinking.
Please explain where you got the idea that it is more likely for scum to joke confirm than town. How did you formulate this theory?

***

Following section, refer to this post by somitomi.

Well now you’re approaching plytho levels of misunderstanding me. :P

Timeline for reference
Spoiler:
1/3/2018 12:05 pm UTC - Suzaku Gojoe post (almost ready)
1/3/2018 12:47 pm UTC - somitomi Gojoe post
1/3/2018 2:24 pm UTC - PW Gojoe post
1/3/2018 3:12 pm UTC - wam Gojoe post
1/3/2018 3:24 pm UTC - PW Gojoe post
1/3/2018 3:30 pm UTC - somitomi Gojoe post
1/3/2018 3:42 pm UTC - PW Gojoe post
1/3/2018 4:30 pm UTC - somitomi Gojoe post
1/3/2018 5:35 pm UTC - wam OP, confirmation phase begins
1/3/2018 7:16 pm UTC - PW Gojoe post
1/3/2018 7:24 pm UTC - PW Gojoe post
1/3/2018 7:32 pm UTC - PW Gojoe post
1/3/2018 9:54 pm UTC - somitomi confirm
1/3/2018 10:13 pm UTC - wam, game begins
1/3/2018 10:21 pm UTC - wam Gojoe post
1/3/2018 11:54 pm UTC - Suzaku post
1/3/2018 11:59 pm UTC - wam post
1/4/2018 12:19 am UTC - Suzaku post
1/4/2018 7:48 am UTC - wam post
1/4/2018 8:57 am UTC - wam post
1/4/2018 10:45 am UTC - Suzaku post
1/4/2018 10:55 am UTC - Suzaku post
1/4/2018 12:57 pm UTC - flicky post (day/night chat question)
1/4/2018 1:12 pm UTC - PW post (game started an hour after he was asleep, just woke up)
1/4/2018 1:14 pm UTC - Suzaku post (day/night chat answer)
1/4/2018 1:26 pm UTC - PW post (didn’t check his phone before he went to bed)
1/4/2018 1:44 pm UTC - PW post
1/4/2018 2:15 pm UTC - somitomi post (forgot game was about to start)

Timezones
wam UTC
somitomi UTC+1
Peaceful Whale UTC-4
Suzaku UTC+9

Summary of important points from my post that you quoted and (mis)analyzed:
1. Peaceful Whale did not confirm. Confirmation phase began at 12:35 pm EST (PW’s time zone). This is one of the important points from my early analysis. The Gojoe evidence was noticed at a later time, but is only supplementary evidence and you can ignore it if it is confusing you.
2. Peaceful Whale claimed when the game started (5:13 pm EST) he had been asleep for an hour. I don’t care how much he sleeps, it’s none of my business, but the timing of when he claimed to go to sleep was slightly unusual.
3. You keep refusing to acknowledge my point that it’s the 4:00 pm in the afternoon part, and keep going back to the why do you care if he sleeps 11 hours or 16 hours or whatever part.

somitomi wrote:You say you think it's unusual to sleep all day
No. I said it was an unusual claim for his particular circumstance (based on publicly available knowledge I have of him).
somitomi wrote:Until this point, your reasoning was about when and how long PW sleeps and I already revoked my skepticism about it after the math error was pointed out.
No. It was always about when, not about how long. This is the part I keep accusing you of pretending to misunderstand.

bessie’s speculation: Peaceful Whale claims he went to sleep an hour before the game started. Possible he is confusing this with waiting not for the game to start, but waiting for a reply from his scum partners in chat.

Additional information, see this post.
Peaceful Whale wrote: About the whole “game started and I went to bed thing”

12:00 I’m in school, 3:30 I get home. And for pretty much until 6:00 I had homework. Then dinner, and then I got portal 2 for $2 from a steam sale... can you guess what’s been taking up all my time?
So, confirmation that Peaceful Whale lied (or was confused) about why he didn’t post until 16 hours after the game started. There was no need to lie about going to sleep before the game started. I think it was a slip made perhaps because he hurried to get something posted.

somitomi wrote: The second I can see, but the first one is based on conjecture and I'm puzzled why you don't vote Peaceful Whale if you're so certain he's mafia.
Interesting, LaserGuy had the same question.

I have go out, back in a few hours, will pick up where I stopped.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Sabrar » Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:33 pm UTC

bessie wrote:Well, for one thing I have a different point of view than I did in Secret Santa.
Please give another reason. From an outside pov it looks like the same.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:35 pm UTC

Reads continued.

LaserGuy (previously scummy):
Spoiler:
Believes No Lynch increases town win rate for even numbers of players. Asks me why BF is in my townie group, despite my reasoning not indicating as such. Votes Sabrar after cemper responded to his concerns. Provides Maths for D1 no lynch. Sabrar is active lurking. Adds bessie to town leans and HS to scum leans, more confident in BF read (no explanation). Asks bessie about Sabrar. Follows up on cemper and unanswered question. Asks me about my reads (already responded to), and posts more theory about no lynches. Explains active lurking comment and Sabrar vote (low quality and volume of posts). Doesn't see a point in asking a barrage of questions. Refuses to give an ordered list. Brings up possible contradiction in Sabrar's responses. Explains reason for not giving ordered list. Misses that flicky is rereading to build a reads post.

Sabrar, cemper, HS are strongest scum leans. Thinks BF is town because of his gambit, and several team-mates not likely being willing to go along with it. Responds to the ongoing No Lynch discussion, and asks me about why I believe him to be scum due to his proposal. Finds HS point assignments arbitrary, and has other issues with him. Asks flicky about his town reads on cemper and Sabrar. Asks flicky why he hadn't engaged with previous discussions until now. FoS flicky for his reads list. Follows up on flicky's response, and asks for more reasons. Votes somitomi for possible interesting timing around the clarification of day chat. Asks bessie why she's voting somitomi over PW.
LaserGuy wrote:I don't see any value in asking a barrage of questions to people if I can't realistically follow up on any of them.
I'm confused. Why can't you follow up on questions you've asked of a range of people?
LaserGuy wrote:Why do you think my proposal is scum-wrong instead of Town-wrong? Why are you only commenting on my content from Page 1 and not anything else I've posted?
Because I am struggling to keep up, basically, and was commenting on an ongoing (in my eyes anyway) discussion. Also, just because you said something early in the day doesn't mean it's not relevant later on. As for it being scum-wrong, it felt to me like it was so badly thought through that it was a deliberate attempt by scum to get town to agree to a bad-for-them plan. I'm less inclined to think that now though, but I still believe it to be wrong (just not so clear-cut scum-wrong).

@LaserGuy - why are you consistently stating opinions on players but not explaining them until prodded?

I don't particularly like LaserGuy's style, but that's not a reason to scum read him. As hinted above, I'm beginning to feel that LaserGuy seriously believes in what he says about PR claims and No Lynches, and that it isn't specifically a scum plan. I agree with him over issues regarding Hari Seldon's points assignments. I feel it unlikely that scum would feel the need to bring up timings of posts around the day chat questions in order to justify a vote on somitomi, so I am tentatively leaning town here now.

Madge/moody (previously townie):
Spoiler:
moody - backs down over twitchiness of PW, but otherwise stands by his read of PW, providing post-by-post evidence to back it up.

Madge - has lots to say after replacing in, despite it being D1. Stream-of-consciousness thoughts on PR targeting. Advises vanillas not to claim. Doubts Sabrar would go along with any plan. Doesn't think woof!BF would do it as scum. Sees he's saying enough to be understood. Happy to No Lynch, but later discussion swings her away from it. Asks me about my thoughts on No Lynch. Likes bessie being on the warpath.

Puts idea of all PRs targeting one person to bed. Thinks about possible claiming schemes that could allow PRs to safely reveal results/test sanities etc. Explains why she is posting so much for D1 Madge (setup easy to analyse, and the day has been long enough for her to have opinions). Doesn't know why bessie thinks she's town. Defends PW's "sleep" comment. Doesn't think he'd hold back waiting for his scum buddies. Informs Vicarin about her D1 meta, and not generally voting.
Madge wrote:@Jimbob: If the statistics showed that on D1 town only got scum at chance levels (or only very slightly above chance levels), would that change your opinion on NL today?
No, for reasons stated elsewhere - the main use of D1 lynch is not so much about catching scum (obviously it's great if we do), but rather to provide a grounding to base D2 analysis off of, especially as the option still exists to No Lynch later in the game. Plus, the chance of a doctor save means that we might get an extra night without No Lynch.

My initial reaction was that Madge was posting far too much for normal!Madge, implying scum!Madge (Madge is closely catching up with bessie for a reputation for always being town, or at least indie), but after reading the posts a bit more carefully, it's clear that she's just posting stream of consciousness, which is pretty typical for her. Sadly, what is also typical, is her relative lack of opinions on people's alignments D1. She's been unusually vocal with her defence of Peaceful Whale, which has raised my eyebrows slightly. If PW or Madge flip scum, I seriously think that the other needs looking at. Looking back at moody's reads, which I previously liked, but others didn't, I too don't understand his BoomFrog read, since moody has been around long enough to know BoomFrog's playstyle, and it's hardly active lurking when he's actually posting useful content in the woofs. I'm also slightly suspicious of the town lean on Hari for posting math stuff, since I would definitely expect scum!Hari to do the same, for fear of getting called out on it otherwise. I'm okay with the PW and LG reads. Overall, I have a slightly scummy vibe, mostly carrying over from having reread moody's partial reads list. If it hadn't been for her predecessor though, I'd have a slight town lean on Madge.

Time to go to bed now. Reads of PW, Sabrar, somitomi, and Vicarin to follow later. Vicarin I'm pretty confident is town. Not sure about the other three yet.
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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby somitomi » Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:37 pm UTC

..sigh...
Are you seriously raking me over the coals for a surplus "and how long", because that's the difference I see between the quote and the line directly after.
bessie wrote:
somitomi wrote:Until this point, your reasoning was about when and how long PW sleeps and I already revoked my skepticism about it after the math error was pointed out.

No. It was always about when, not about how long. This is the part I keep accusing you of pretending to misunderstand.
bessie’s speculation: Peaceful Whale claims he went to sleep an hour before the game started. Possible he is confusing this with waiting not for the game to start, but waiting for a reply from his scum partners in chat.

and that second part looks pretty similar to what I said in my second to last post.
somitomi wrote:Okay hold on, you explained PW's excuse about sleeping doesn't feel right because it would mean he slept for 16 or so hours and you think he was waiting for something else (i.e. scum chat) here.


bessie wrote:The Gojoe evidence was noticed at a later time, but is only supplementary evidence and you can ignore it if it is confusing you.

It's not confusing me at all, you're misunderstanding me now. I was asking why you brought it up while explaining how (according to you) I got your previous post wrong when it wasn't mentioned in said post.
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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Peaceful Whale » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:06 pm UTC

bessie wrote:
Peaceful Whale wrote:Players who joke confirmed:
I posted that just because I thought (think?) scum players are more likely to joke confirm, as try just want to get something out there so they’re not lurking, and worried that whatever they say will be too tense they do a joke. I’m not so sure about this anymore, but it’s what I was thinking.

Please explain where you got the idea that it is more likely for scum to joke confirm than town. How did you formulate this theory?

Scum is scum, everyone else is hunting for them, they’ve got to watch their words otherwise they’re doomed. When they see the game starts what do they do? Run, hide, or do they post? He best option is posting, as it’s the towniest thing to do. In my mind, as they post they’ll be more likely to joke to relieve pressure or draw attention *towards* themselves. More often than not it’s a WIFOM joke. “Oh dang, scum again” everyone will discard as a joke. I feel like they’d be more likely to do something like this. However I could easily be wrong, it’s probable that all of our scum just gave a very simple “confirm”.

(Why am I being grilled on this?)
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Peaceful Whale » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:07 pm UTC

(And not other stuff that I should be grilled for?)
I can think of a lot..b :oops:
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby cemper93 » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:18 pm UTC

PeacefulWhale, in his first post, wrote:Also I’ve been cough*busy in scum chat*cough sleeping!

PeacefulWhale wrote:Scum is scum [...]. In my mind, as they post they’ll be more likely to joke to relieve pressure or draw attention *towards* themselves. More often than not it’s a WIFOM joke. “Oh dang, scum again” everyone will discard as a joke.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Peaceful Whale » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:21 pm UTC

cemper93 wrote:
PeacefulWhale, in his first post, wrote:Also I’ve been cough*busy in scum chat*cough sleeping!

PeacefulWhale wrote:Scum is scum [...]. In my mind, as they post they’ll be more likely to joke to relieve pressure or draw attention *towards* themselves. More often than not it’s a WIFOM joke. “Oh dang, scum again” everyone will discard as a joke.

Yep.
Scum, town, and then there’s me. As many people have (hopefully) realized, I don’t follow any of my own logic, meta, or really anything!
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby cemper93 » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:33 pm UTC

flicky1991 wrote:The parts you're quoting aren't a reads list, they're a content summary. The reads list self-admittedly does not contain much/any reasoning, but the bit in the spoiler was not intended to contain any information about who seemed to be scummy or townie.
Duly noted.

flicky1991 wrote:The reads list post was made because people were pushing me for content. In retrospect I probably should have just kept posting what I was thinking.
Does your analysis post contain what someone else is thinking?

I would like to talk about my attack on flicky again. Almost nobody has commented on this in either way, but I strongly read flicky as scum now, and therefore I'm picking this up again. As a reminder, this is my attack.

In case I didn't explain this clearly enough in that post, flicky is scum because the kind of information contained in his summary post is solely the kind of information scum is interested in. This points to him not having reading the thread from a town player's point of view.

Town!flicky would have been interested in how people reason, such that he can judge whether the reasoning is good or bad and whether the conclusions are valid. Town!flicky wants to try and read patterns out of people's behavior and is happy to report on any patterns he finds. Town!flicky is not an experienced player and wants to learn how better players than him scumhunt, for which purpose he needs to actively try and follow their trains of thought. However, scum!flicky is solely interested in who other players are willing to lynch, regardless of why. And that's exactly the kind of content in flicky's analysis post content summary.

The entire post is just one large scumslip. Flicky appears to at no point to have made an effort to extract information useful for town, and appears to have remembered no such information. I urge everybody to go back to re-read it and check how much content is in that post that is not more interesting for scum than for town.

BoomFrog wrote:@Flicky: I think your problem is trying to judge people based on their text, when to catch scum you must read subtext for discrepancies from what a townie thought process would be. Next time you read someone, only note when what they say seems odd or out of place to what you imagine they should be thinking in the current situation. Just summarizing posts is rarely useful.
Do you believe flicky's post to be bad town content rather than slippy scum content? If so, why?

MC Doodle wrote:I don't really see why people are giving flicky a hard time. It seems to me that he's trying to contribute as best he can. I do feel like he didn't put enough effort into understanding what BoomFrog was doing, since it felt to me like it was pretty clear, and there were various players (including me) he indicated that it was for testing reactions. Slightly townie overall.
Can you show me some examples for good attempts at contribution from flicky? You say he didn't put enough effort into understanding BoomFrog. In your opinion, in understanding what did he put enough effort?

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby LaserGuy » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:47 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:
cemper93 wrote:
PeacefulWhale, in his first post, wrote:Also I’ve been cough*busy in scum chat*cough sleeping!

PeacefulWhale wrote:Scum is scum [...]. In my mind, as they post they’ll be more likely to joke to relieve pressure or draw attention *towards* themselves. More often than not it’s a WIFOM joke. “Oh dang, scum again” everyone will discard as a joke.

Yep.
Scum, town, and then there’s me. As many people have (hopefully) realized, I don’t follow any of my own logic, meta, or really anything!


Woof, woof.
Vote: Peaceful Whale

I know I have some spending questions for me. Will get to them this evening.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Sabrar » Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:02 am UTC

@jimbob: you said you were okay with moody's read on PW. Why? Please analyze.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Vicarin » Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:33 am UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:
cemper93 wrote:
PeacefulWhale, in his first post, wrote:Also I’ve been cough*busy in scum chat*cough sleeping!

PeacefulWhale wrote:Scum is scum [...]. In my mind, as they post they’ll be more likely to joke to relieve pressure or draw attention *towards* themselves. More often than not it’s a WIFOM joke. “Oh dang, scum again” everyone will discard as a joke.

Yep.
Scum, town, and then there’s me. As many people have (hopefully) realized, I don’t follow any of my own logic, meta, or really anything!


You know that town wants to be easily readable as town right? Stacking barrels upon barrels of wine isn't exactly making this easier for anyone else to get a decent read on you. At least be consistent, so we don't lynch you early every game while you say you were just being random.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby bessie » Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:45 am UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:
Vicarin wrote: The lynch is the town's best weapon, it should be used early and often.

Hmm, I really don’t agree with you in this. In my mind, lynch should be postponed so we can have more content to analyze. More time for scum to trip, etc.
Basically I like more time. Having little time is normally a pro for scum.
Please clarify. Peaceful Whale, do you think we should no lynch, or are you referring to early hammer?

jimbobmacdoodle wrote: @bessie - you promised a reads list, but all I've seen from you are two post-by-post breakdowns. When do you plan on giving your reads of most other players?
Like with you, the content level in this game is wearing me down, and I’ve only been skimming a lot of the PR night action stuff. The post-by-post analysis that I did for my primary scum reads took me hours. I discovered during Crossover that the method that works the best for me is the one I currently use, where I go through every post in chronological order, pull out questions directed at me and anything else I find interesting, and compose my posts out of those notes. Hmm, I know I’ve had this discussion on my style with you and Sabrar and Evil George Washington and probably others before, but I’ll post it again anyway for the newbies. Anyway I think I’m going to do what I advised Peaceful Whale to do for my reads list in order to get something complete up tonight, and then decide if anyone warrants a post-by-post read, because this is a valid observation:
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:However, as with Secret Santa, there hasn't been many opinions from her outside the group of {Peaceful Whale, somitomi, Madge/moody}. This means that I have no idea where she stands on the rest of the group.


Sabrar wrote:
bessie wrote:Well, for one thing I have a different point of view than I did in Secret Santa.
Please give another reason. From an outside pov it looks like the same.
From an outside pov it maybe should. I thought played Secret Santa exactly the same way I would have played were I town. I attacked Madge for what I perceived was anti town behavior in Secret Santa (and in Crossover, Draculafia, Wot2, WoT1, and probably every other game I have ever played with her). Madge’s playstyle is pretty much polar opposite of mine, and I often find her scummy. So I’m not sure how to answer this question, but go ahead and prod if you don’t like this answer and I will give it more thought.

somitomi wrote:..sigh...
Are you seriously raking me over the coals for a surplus "and how long", because that's the difference I see between the quote and the line directly after.
No, I’m raking you over the coals because the crux of my argument is on the when, and the how long is almost superfluous. But perhaps this is my fault for not making myself clear.
Spoiler:
bessie wrote:I don’t want to come off as judgmental so I apologize in advance if this is out of line, but confirmation phase started at 12:35 pm EST, and the game started at 5:13 pm EST.

bessie wrote:You are misinterpreting my reason for finding Peaceful Whale suspicious. Look at the time stamps in context with his explanation.

bessie wrote:I’ve already corrected for Peaceful Whale’s time zone (EST). He’s in the east coast United States, the same time zone as New York City, Washington DC, and Florida. Confirmation would have started at a little after noon his time, not midnight.

bessie wrote:Anyway, Peaceful Whale claimed he missed the game starting because he went to sleep an hour before D1 start. This would mean he went to sleep at 4:00 pm in the afternoon.

bessie wrote:Summary of important points from my post that you quoted and (mis)analyzed:
1. Peaceful Whale did not confirm. Confirmation phase began at 12:35 pm EST (PW’s time zone). This is one of the important points from my early analysis. The Gojoe evidence was noticed at a later time, but is only supplementary evidence and you can ignore it if it is confusing you.
2. Peaceful Whale claimed when the game started (5:13 pm EST) he had been asleep for an hour. I don’t care how much he sleeps, it’s none of my business, but the timing of when he claimed to go to sleep was slightly unusual.
3. You keep refusing to acknowledge my point that it’s the 4:00 pm in the afternoon part, and keep going back to the why do you care if he sleeps 11 hours or 16 hours or whatever part.

bessie wrote:No. It was always about when, not about how long. This is the part I keep accusing you of pretending to misunderstand.

Nope, it’s you that is misrepresenting this argument. And your response to me is still focused on the how long:
somitomi wrote:and that second part looks pretty similar to what I said in my second to last post.
somitomi wrote:Okay hold on, you explained PW's excuse about sleeping doesn't feel right because it would mean he slept for 16 or so hours and you think he was waiting for something else (i.e. scum chat) here.

For the purposes of this argument, ignore Gojoe. We can come back to it if we need to figure out if you and Peaceful Whale were waiting for wam and Suzaku to answer a question about scum chat.


bessie wrote:Please explain where you got the idea that it is more likely for scum to joke confirm than town. How did you formulate this theory?
Peaceful Whale wrote:(Why am I being grilled on this?)
Your analysis of the confirmation posts was in an odd place, it was on P5, in your 20th game post, well after your first reads list. It would have been more natural in one of your early posts, and on the first day. Hmm, this may be complicated to explain, and it will be wine soaked, and additionally my ego may be gratuitously involved. But oh well what the heck I think that you are trying to act townie by using the play style of a townie player as a model.

I’ve accused a newbie of this before, and he was scum. I never did get confirmation that he was trying to act like a townie using a townie as a model though (so ego :P).

Back in a bit.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Vicarin » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:56 am UTC

bessie wrote:
Vicarin wrote:Because I feel that this thread would degenerate into me and a few other people talking to each other for ages. Also, I would really like some more info on some people to get a better read, mainly the ones that haven't got a vote going.
Perhaps but why shouldn’t I be suspicious that scum!you wants to know where everyone else stands before you commit?


I can completely understand that suspicion, but I feel as if I've put enough of my thoughts on various things out there when other people are haven't got enough suspicions on anyone to put down even a preliminary vote. Is there anything you think I haven't explained enough in particular?

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Sabrar » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:22 am UTC

@bessie: your explanation makes sense however it brings up a new issue. You collect notes on the players to be used in future games. That means you take past behavior into account when trying to read someone. Why do you make an exception with Madge?
You know it's a difference in playstyle. You know she behaves like this when Town. Why is the same behavior a scum-point against her here?
It's like finding her scummy because she doesn't vote D1. We all know that it's anti-town to do so but Madge has demonstrated multiple times that she doesn't care about that.
Given a player with unknown meta your suspicion would be justified. You attacking Madge on points where you're fully aware that those points are not scum-indicative in her case is wrong.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby bessie » Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:30 am UTC

Unofficial votals:

cemper93 (1) : BoomFrog
flicky1991 (1) : cemper93
LaserGuy (1) : flicky1991
Madge (2) : Sabrar, somitomi
Peaceful Whale (1) : LaserGuy
somitomi (2) : bessie, Vicarin
No Lynch (1) : Hari Seldon

Not voting: jimbobmacdoodle, Madge, Peaceful Whale


Vicarin wrote:You know that town wants to be easily readable as town right? Stacking barrels upon barrels of wine isn't exactly making this easier for anyone else to get a decent read on you. At least be consistent, so we don't lynch you early every game while you say you were just being random.
I’m pretty sure scum would like to be easily readable as town too. And I don’t think being consistent is going to be all that helpful either, if someone’s meta is to be consistently unhelpful.

Hmm…

Sabrar wrote:@bessie: your explanation makes sense however it brings up a new issue. You collect notes on the players to be used in future games. That means you take past behavior into account when trying to read someone. Why do you make an exception with Madge?
I am taking past behavior in to account. I think you’re misreading this situation.

From my read on moody/Madge here:
bessie wrote:Leaning scum on Madge, mostly based on moody’s questionable Peaceful Whale read (and to a lesser extent, BoomFrog and Vicarin), and lurking (hopefully there’s not a RL issue with moody), and whatever is going on with Post #4 (I think I need to ponder whether or not Peaceful Whale's and somitomi's responses are important).
I was already leaning scum on moody. The fact that moody was replaced doesn’t mean that his content doesn’t exist. It still counts.

Madge’s only other post since I made that read here. I responded to that post here. In my response, I have two pokes at her playstyle; these are among the meta things that I find scummy, will always find scummy, will always attack. I consider them valid points, and I will not ignore them, but in general are not enough in themselves to earn my vote.

These observations are more interesting, and I’ve noted them:
bessie wrote:
Madge wrote:I'm not sure why bessie says she thinks I know her alignment. I don't. I mean, I suspect town, but I suspect everyone of being town right now!
Aw, that’s cute, you’re pretending to be naïve, and not the clever genius you really are. I KNOW THE TRUTH!

Madge wrote:why do we care how much peaceful whale sleeps?
That’s not my point, read Post 16.

Madge wrote: I don't think the "he's scum waiting for his scumbuddies to come online" thing holds water.
Perhaps. But I wonder why somitomi didn’t say that, instead of pretending to misunderstand my point three times.


Sabrar wrote:Given a player with unknown meta your suspicion would be justified. You attacking Madge on points where you're fully aware that those points are not scum-indicative in her case is wrong.
No. I’m attacking her for scummy behavior. You’re confusing attacking and voting. I’m not voting for her, yet. Just like I’m reluctant to vote for moody on D1, because I always read moody as scummy on D1. I remember being attacked for not voting scummy moody, even though scummy is his meta. Now I’m being attacked for going after scummy Madge, even though scummy is her meta?

Questions for you:

Would you question me if moody was still in the game for scum reading his slot?

Do you think it’s valid for everyone in this game to count moody’s content in their reads and analysis?

Why do you always come back around to defending Madge?

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Vicarin » Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:37 am UTC

bessie wrote:
Vicarin wrote:You know that town wants to be easily readable as town right? Stacking barrels upon barrels of wine isn't exactly making this easier for anyone else to get a decent read on you. At least be consistent, so we don't lynch you early every game while you say you were just being random.
I’m pretty sure scum would like to be easily readable as town too. And I don’t think being consistent is going to be all that helpful either, if someone’s meta is to be consistently unhelpful.


Well, when I said be consistent, I meant the way he was scumreading people for the joke confirmations when he'd done one himself. And yes, scum would like to be easily readable as town too, that's why this game is interesting. If someone's meta is consistently unhelpful or random though, they're going to attract lynches no matter what side they're on simply because there's no way to tell whether something's a slip or just them being random. Which is the current problem we're having with PW. It's looking like unless a PR gets a definitive result on him, we're going to have no damn idea whether they're town or scum for the rest of the game.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Sabrar » Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:56 am UTC

bessie wrote:In my response, I have two pokes at her playstyle; these are among the meta things that I find scummy, will always find scummy, will always attack. I consider them valid points, and I will not ignore them, but in general are not enough in themselves to earn my vote.
This here is my issue. I understand why you find those points scummy but you should realize that those are not alignment-indicative in Madge's case.

bessie wrote:You’re confusing attacking and voting.
I don't think I do. I believe calling someone scummy and attacking them are the same thing and are interchangeable. Voting does not enter into it.

bessie wrote:I remember being attacked for not voting scummy moody, even though scummy is his meta. Now I’m being attacked for going after scummy Madge, even though scummy is her meta?
I don't remember doing the first so fmpov is not relevant.

bessie wrote:Would you question me if moody was still in the game for scum reading his slot?
No.

bessie wrote:Do you think it’s valid for everyone in this game to count moody’s content in their reads and analysis?
Yes.

bessie wrote:Why do you always come back around to defending Madge?
I'm currently voting Madge and would be fine with her lynch. I'm not defending her, I'm questioning your motivation of attacking her in case she turns up Town.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby cemper93 » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:44 am UTC

vicarin wrote:If someone's meta is consistently unhelpful or random though, they're going to attract lynches no matter what side they're on simply because there's no way to tell whether something's a slip or just them being random. Which is the current problem we're having with PW. It's looking like unless a PR gets a definitive result on him, we're going to have no damn idea whether they're town or scum for the rest of the game.
Note that this is the same problem we have with bessie and BoomFrog, although in their cases bessie always reads town and BoomFrog always reads jester. I think that investigating any of these players would be wise, as you hint at.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:56 am UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:I don't see any value in asking a barrage of questions to people if I can't realistically follow up on any of them.


I'm confused. Why can't you follow up on questions you've asked of a range of people?


As I said, I will ask questions of people when I see something interesting or want clarification on their posts. I don't feel it is productive for me to go hunting for things to ask of people if their content just isn't that interesting to me at this moment, or if I'm following another thread that I feel is more likely to produce useful information. You've commented on me doing this before in other games, I think.

@LaserGuy - why are you consistently stating opinions on players but not explaining them until prodded?


It's helping me find scum.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Sabrar » Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:57 am UTC

If PW or cemper is scum the likelihood of the other being scum as well just increased by a large margin.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:05 am UTC

Hari Seldon wrote:My understanding for why Laser voted Cemper was because Cemper believed Boom's Woofing was alignment indicative—an entirely different reason than what Boom Woofed. It is interesting that neither LaserGuy nor Bessie has not attempted to clear this up.


This is incorrect on my part at least. I gave my reasoning for voting cemper here.

LaserGuy wrote:
BoomFrog wrote:@LaserGuy: Why do you not want to post a town to scum list?


While I was modding Secret Santa, I played a couple games over at Mafiascum (here and here), where reads/ordered lists are generally not a part of the site meta. Some people do them, but not a lot. It didn't seem to really have any detrimental effect on Town as long as people were still making their thoughts known. Part of the argument against them being that reads list allows scum to optimize their night kills by targeting universal townreads, or to more easily avoid protective roles by avoiding those sorts of players. Since we possibly have possibly two players that mafia need to dodge (doc/watcher), I can see the argument for this game that maybe such lists aren't necessarily universally helpful to Town. In any event, I'm happy to experiment and see how it works out.


If that is so, why did you post this:

LaserGuy wrote:I have Town on Vic and flicky right now. Town lean on PW, slight Town lean on BoomFrog.

Still liking Sabrar for scum. Thinking about or not enough content from others.
[/quote]

Sabrar was asking me for an ordered list and that was what I was responding to. I am still providing reads as I go.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:09 am UTC

EBWOP: Quotation fix.

Hari Seldon wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:
BoomFrog wrote:@LaserGuy: Why do you not want to post a town to scum list?


While I was modding Secret Santa, I played a couple games over at Mafiascum (here and here), where reads/ordered lists are generally not a part of the site meta. Some people do them, but not a lot. It didn't seem to really have any detrimental effect on Town as long as people were still making their thoughts known. Part of the argument against them being that reads list allows scum to optimize their night kills by targeting universal townreads, or to more easily avoid protective roles by avoiding those sorts of players. Since we possibly have possibly two players that mafia need to dodge (doc/watcher), I can see the argument for this game that maybe such lists aren't necessarily universally helpful to Town. In any event, I'm happy to experiment and see how it works out.


If that is so, why did you post this:

LaserGuy wrote:I have Town on Vic and flicky right now. Town lean on PW, slight Town lean on BoomFrog.

Still liking Sabrar for scum. Thinking about or not enough content from others.


Sabrar was asking me for an ordered list and that was what I was responding to. I am still providing reads as I go.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby somitomi » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:05 am UTC

bessie wrote:No, I’m raking you over the coals because the crux of my argument is on the when, and the how long is almost superfluous. But perhaps this is my fault for not making myself clear.

No I think this was clear enough and I didn't consider the distinction important in my responses. Part of me still thinks this level of misunderstanding didn't warrant the tone you used, but we all do things differently.
Peaceful Whale wrote:Is that an actual quote form me Somitori?
About the whole “game started and I went to bed thing”

No, I would've used quote tags if I wanted to quote you word for word.
Peaceful Whale wrote:In my mind, as they post they’ll be more likely to joke to relieve pressure or draw attention *towards* themselves. More often than not it’s a WIFOM joke. “Oh dang, scum again” everyone will discard as a joke. I feel like they’d be more likely to do something like this. However I could easily be wrong, it’s probable that all of our scum just gave a very simple “confirm”.

Okay, so is a joke confirmation scummy or not in the end?
Peaceful Whale wrote:Yep.
Scum, town, and then there’s me. As many people have (hopefully) realized, I don’t follow any of my own logic, meta, or really anything!

There are no indies in this game, so you're either town or mafia and I don't think remarks like this help convince anyone you're in the former group. It doesn't have to be right (truth be told, mine is more often wrong than right), but surely there's some sort of logic by which you evaluate what other players say and decide what you yourself say or point out.
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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Madge » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:10 am UTC

I'm seriously considering voting for nobody to die today. The arguments have me convinced (though I was admittedly already a fan before). But I'm really a fan of getting PR results whereas opponents to NL seem to be bigger fans of reads, so I think that covers a lot of the discrepancy.

Whoever criticised me for jumping in on discussion on claim strategy too late: it was literally my first post this game and I needed to talk about it in order to understand the arguments and the concept in general, so even if it was useless to other players, it was useful to me.

Sabrar/Vicarin was fun to watch in a "car crash" sort of way.


The reason I'm defending PW is the argument is STUPID. He slept 16 hours or played Portal or was working three jobs so he could afford to surprise all of us with plane tickets to his home town for an xkcdia meetup and live mafia game - WHO CARES. He didn't post and not posting for 16 hours is not scummy, and arguing back and forth over it is SO STUPID it boggles my mind. He could be the scummiest scummer who ever scummed and he could win the game as the leader of the mafia with his tactics and cunning, and the 16 hour thing would STILL BE A STUPID THING TO PIN HIM FOR. I don't know how clearer I can get. And I feel like I'm being terrible by talking about it so much but I swear Bessie spent HALF OF HER POST talking about it. WHY DO YOU CARE SO MUCH ABOUT HOW MUCH PEACEFUL WHALE SLEPT, BESSIE? Or, because I don't mean literally how do you care so much about how much he literally slept, I actually mean why is this sixteen hour delay so concerning to you? Is it because he wasn't $100% honest about what he did in those sixteen hours and we're taking lynch all liarsto an extreme?

@Bessie are you accusing PW of copying something you did in a game in May 2017? .... Like, do you really think he's studying old games? That's the sort of thing you'd do. Not what PW would do.

Ok I think I got that out of my system

Naughty list:
- Bessie
- Somitomi

Nice list:
- Sabrar (I wrote this in before he started defending me to bessie fwiw)
- cemper

No justification given; it's all gut reads, you should know by now that you're lucky I'm giving you a Naughty and Nice list. Call it the spirit of christmas staying with me for a few weeks too long!

I love you peaceful whale, don't let these horrible bullies tell you how to play! :lol:
I'm writing a supernatural romance novel, it updates the first weekend of every month. You can find it here.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby somitomi » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:45 am UTC

Madge wrote:The reason I'm defending PW is the argument is STUPID. He slept 16 hours or played Portal or was working three jobs so he could afford to surprise all of us with plane tickets to his home town for an xkcdia meetup and live mafia game - WHO CARES. He didn't post and not posting for 16 hours is not scummy, and arguing back and forth over it is SO STUPID it boggles my mind.

Although I think that debate was rather fruitless, the bottom line was that bessie's point is about when PW went to sleep, not how long he was asleep. I don't think it's a strong scum tell either way, but evidently this distinction is tremendously important to bessie.
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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby somitomi » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:57 am UTC

EBWOP:
Madge wrote:Naughty list:
- Bessie
- Somitomi

Nice list:
- Sabrar (I wrote this in before he started defending me to bessie fwiw)
- cemper

No justification given; it's all gut reads, you should know by now that you're lucky I'm giving you a Naughty and Nice list.

I'm new, so I can be concerned by this sounding like wine. Could you say something about people not on either list?
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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Sabrar » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:58 am UTC

I'd like to ask everyone to make a list of those players whose lynch today they wouldn't oppose. Mine is:

cemper
Madge
PW
somitomi

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Vicarin » Mon Jan 08, 2018 12:07 pm UTC

By an astounding coincidence, they're all on my list too. I've had doubts about somitomi and cemper for a while, PW just won't stop being crazy, and Madge has not improved on moody's lurking at all. Hari Seldon is almost there, and flicky1991 as well, but I'd definitely prefer one of the top 4.

Madge wrote:@Bessie are you accusing PW of copying something you did in a game in May 2017? .... Like, do you really think he's studying old games? That's the sort of thing you'd do. Not what PW would do.


Or maybe they had it suggested to them by a scum teammate and went about it in a transparent way? Can't just ignore the scum daychat, they must have had quite the long conversation by now.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Vicarin » Mon Jan 08, 2018 2:03 pm UTC

Oh yeah, on another note, we do still have a while before the deadline (bit over two days?), but we should be sorting out the lunch soon, as if we accidentally aim at a PR, there should be enough spare time for them to claim, and for any possible counterclaims to come through (different timezones make this take a while). And preferably spare time for a 2nd claim if we're really bad (probably could get an extension in that case). This is one of the reasons people should be getting moving on sorting out a vote/responding to sabrar above.

In addition, I don't think anyone thinks this is a good idea, but just in case, if you're vanilla town and up to be lynched, just say you're vanilla. A fake claim by town would be so ridiculously bad for town here, as you'd die anyway and out a PR in the process. Don't do it.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby somitomi » Mon Jan 08, 2018 3:04 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:I'd like to ask everyone to make a list of those players whose lynch today they wouldn't oppose.

LaserGuy, Madge, Peaceful Whale
bessie wrote:
somitomi wrote: The second I can see, but the first one is based on conjecture and I'm puzzled why you don't vote Peaceful Whale if you're so certain he's mafia.
Interesting, LaserGuy had the same question.

Actually, may I ask what conclusions you draw from this?
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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby cemper93 » Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:04 pm UTC

My lynch list is flicky, PW, bessie, BoomFrog. I've made my point on flicky, I hopefully don't need to make a point on PW, and bessie and BoomFrog I have read scum ever since this game started.

I would not like a Madge lynch because while I understand some concerns raised about her and she isn't in my town camp, I have no strong scum reads on her. Furthermore, she hasn't generated much content yet and therefore, we won't learn much from knowing her alignment.

My opinion on Sabrar has been steadily improving over the course of the game. I had him as scum before for becoming overly aggressive when under attack himself, but I understand his playstyle better now and being very aggressive just appears to be his meta. I'm fine with that.

I lean neutral or town on everybody else, and hence would not like them to be lynched. If it came to that, I would rather vote NL.

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby bessie » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:02 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:This here is my issue. I understand why you find those points scummy but you should realize that those are not alignment-indicative in Madge's case.
I said this in another game and its morning so I don’t have time to dig up a reference right now because I don't remember exactly where it was, but I’m not going to ignore scummy behavior from Madge and then attack other players for the same scummy behavior. I do realize Madge has scummy content as town. It doesn’t make her content not scummy.

Sabrar wrote:I don't think I do. I believe calling someone scummy and attacking them are the same thing and are interchangeable. Voting does not enter into it.
It does. I may attack Madge’s scummy behavior, but I will also take into consideration that it may be part of her meta when I am deciding on my vote.

Sabrar wrote:I don't remember doing the first so fmpov is not relevant.
You are probably correct. I may be thinking of BoomFrog in Crossover, no time to check now.

Sabrar wrote:I'm currently voting Madge and would be fine with her lynch. I'm not defending her, I'm questioning your motivation of attacking her in case she turns up Town.
Interesting that you are the one voting for Madge, but that you are setting me up to be suspicious in the event Madge flips town. But after Madge’s last post, I think it less likely that this will be an issue.

Madge wrote:The reason I'm defending PW is the argument is STUPID. He slept 16 hours or played Portal or was working three jobs so he could afford to surprise all of us with plane tickets to his home town for an xkcdia meetup and live mafia game - WHO CARES. He didn't post and not posting for 16 hours is not scummy, and arguing back and forth over it is SO STUPID it boggles my mind. He could be the scummiest scummer who ever scummed and he could win the game as the leader of the mafia with his tactics and cunning, and the 16 hour thing would STILL BE A STUPID THING TO PIN HIM FOR. I don't know how clearer I can get. And I feel like I'm being terrible by talking about it so much but I swear Bessie spent HALF OF HER POST talking about it. WHY DO YOU CARE SO MUCH ABOUT HOW MUCH PEACEFUL WHALE SLEPT, BESSIE? Or, because I don't mean literally how do you care so much about how much he literally slept, I actually mean why is this sixteen hour delay so concerning to you? Is it because he wasn't $100% honest about what he did in those sixteen hours and we're taking lynch all liarsto an extreme?

Have you even read my posts?

Peaceful Whale, by his own admission, lied about why he did not post until for what was him morning on RL day 2. He originally claimed he went to sleep before the game started. I have a theory that he actually went to sleep before he got a response in scum chat, and he messed up on his initial claim. There is also the interesting coincidence that Peaceful Whale’s down time correlated almost exactly with somitomi’s down time, and somitomi used a similar reason for not posting, that he forgot the game was about to start. This claim is interesting in itself, because the Gojoe thread exchange that took place after Suzaku announced the game was almost ready between Peaceful Whale and somitomi does not seem like it’s from two people who would forget about this game (reference my spoiler in this post for timestamps).

Madge wrote:@Bessie are you accusing PW of copying something you did in a game in May 2017? .... Like, do you really think he's studying old games? That's the sort of thing you'd do. Not what PW would do.
No. I’m accusing Peaceful Whale of copying my meta and doing something I did in Secret Santa 2017, and in other previous games.

Madge wrote:No justification given; it's all gut reads, you should know by now that you're lucky I'm giving you a Naughty and Nice list.
I will take Madge’s scummy meta in to account and not attack her for this completely-within-her-meta scummy remark. But the previous attacks on Madge in this post are valid.

Vicarin wrote: Or maybe they had it suggested to them by a scum teammate and went about it in a transparent way? Can't just ignore the scum daychat, they must have had quite the long conversation by now.
Vicarin, you’re new so I’ll explain this one a little better. I am accusing Peaceful Whale of copying my meta to appear townie. Note: I accused Peaceful Whale of copying my reads in Crossover (no time to dig up links right now because Crossover was long). I’m known for having a townie meta (as cemper keeps reminding everyone), for tunneling (as Peaceful Whale himself pointed out in this game), and for analyzing confirmation posts (which almost no one else does). For an example see Shakespeare, where Sabrar said he was eagerly awaiting my confirmation post analysis here.

somitomi wrote:Actually, may I ask what conclusions you draw from this?
That you and LaserGuy are fishing to see if I would easily swing my vote to Peaceful Whale, or if you’re going to have to work on me.

bessie – Labrador retriever
Vicarin – enthusiastic newbie town
BoomFrog – wise dog
Hari Seldon – observant non-newbie
jimbobmacdoodle – overwhelmed townie
flicky1991 – pretty bird
Sabrar – fluffy puppy
cemper93 – still thinking about him
LaserGuy- still thinking about him
Madge – inexperience challenged scum
Peaceful Whale - newbie scum
somitomi – newbie scum

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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:11 pm UTC

Meow...I’m not going to lie, I didn’t in the first place. In all my games, even when I’m town, I’ve been seen as pretty scummy. Only my noobyness got me through some of them. I’ve done stuff like this before. I sometimes find a reads list and copy it, but rearrange what I don’t agree with to fit my needs. I’ve kinda done the same thing here, but more extreme. I’ve been copying people like Bessie, she has already pointed out where. I’m sorry Bessie that your happened to be right about me. : cry : I don’t trust myself to be towny, so I try and follow people who I believe are town (pr at least doing a better job than I am).
This way I don’t screw up, get myself killed, or distract from actual scum. (I’ve mentioned how being towny is important for townies to do).
I’ll stop now, seeing as it’s not working at all, and try and be myself... even though no one likes it. :(
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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Peaceful Whale
Posts: 165
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Location: Northern Virginia

Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby Peaceful Whale » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:12 pm UTC

I’m going through again as I work on my reads list for Vicarin.
I’ll answer questions and stuff too.
(If we think we’ve caught breadcrumbs for a PR, should we say it, I don’t think so as it helps scum too much)
My meta for future reference
Spoiler:
cemper93 wrote:Your meta appears to be "just writes whatever is on his mind and doesn't remember what happened more than five hours ago"

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LaserGuy
Posts: 4576
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:33 pm UTC

Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:25 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:I'd like to ask everyone to make a list of those players whose lynch today they wouldn't oppose. Mine is:

cemper
Madge
PW
somitomi


PW, somitomi, flicky, jimbob. I'm also willing to No Lynch.

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LaserGuy
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Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:33 pm UTC

Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:28 pm UTC

Peaceful Whale wrote:In all my games, even when I’m town, I’ve been seen as pretty scummy.


*Squints at this*. Is this a slip?

Also, in bin Chicken you were overwhelmingly viewed as Town, IIRC.

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LaserGuy
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Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:28 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:
Peaceful Whale wrote:In all my games, even when I’m town, I’ve been seen as pretty scummy.


*Squints at this*. Is this a slip?

Also, in bin Chicken you were overwhelmingly viewed as Town, IIRC.


EBWOP: Not bin Chicken. Fridge.

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bessie
Posts: 20
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 8:27 am UTC
Location: California

Re: Newbie New Year Mafia - D1

Postby bessie » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:35 pm UTC

Madge wrote:I love you peaceful whale, don't let these horrible bullies tell you how to play! :lol:
I love you too, Peaceful Whale! Please don’t take anything I say as part of this game personally. Remember that I am my avatar!

Also, this is a newbie game. We will all do the best we can to help you so you can ask us anything related to general mafia gameplay and we will answer you truthfully, or Suzaku and wam will smite us from above. But it doesn’t mean you get a free pass. Please take it as a sign of respect that I am treating you not as a clueless newbie, but as I would treat any other player.


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