Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (N5)

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby BoomFrog » Sat Jul 28, 2018 6:03 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
heuristically_alone wrote:For meta reasons I am leaning moody slightly scum. Not confident enough to vote though.
Why the reservation? moody clearly gave himself away and will be our D2 lynch.

A lie makes itself beautiful so it will be accepted.
The truth is ugly and cares not for opinions.
A man of lies could not produce such an ugly truth.
How fortunate for us all that Sabrar is town.
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Sabrar » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:00 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:Also pretty sure jimbob modslipped scum have daychat.
Oh, I see it now. Good catch.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby moody7277 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:17 pm UTC

heuristically_alone wrote:It's clear that I am making no assumption. Just taking note.


You put something in the form of a syllogism, I'm gonna want to pick it apart like one.

LaserGuy meta-gaming the mod is humourous, but also interesting how he's decided to back up heury.

D2 is probably in time to give the rest of town to make use of my flip. I just want people to keep track of the Sabrar-LG bloc that has all of a sudden crystallized.
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Tigerlion wrote:Well, I imagine as the game progresses, various people will be getting moody.


BoomFrog wrote:I still have no idea what town moody really looks like.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby heuristically_alone » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:28 pm UTC

If it isn't immediately apparent that Sabrar is scum, he is usually town. Also getting town feels from Laserguy. Would he point out a slip of day chat if he were scum?
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby bessie » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:30 pm UTC

I've been working on my reads for a couple hours. I'm going to break this up a little and just start posting because I'm getting distracted by trying to incorporate the ninjas, and becoming unfocused from the main goal. Post summaries first.

BoomFrog post summary
Spoiler:
Post 1
Establishes this game’s BoomGambit. Secondary win condition could possibly obstruct primary win condition. Three scum, one scum team. bessie is one of them.

Post 2
Believes mpolo’s claim.

Post 3
In-character masked reply to Sabrar.

Post 4
Poke at Sabrar.

Post 5
And another. As I suspected, this is all about me me me. :P

Post 6
The Teacher tries to guide the Student.

Post 7
Bessie now town.

Post 8
mpolo town too.

Post 9
Question (or more?) for moody.

Post 10
Knows Vicarin is not telling the whole truth.

Post 11
Acknowledges that the secondary win conditions are OPTIONAL and should not impede the primary goal.

Post 11
Sabrar town, moody scum.


heuristically_alone post summary
Spoiler:
Post 1
RVS Madge, cautious of Sabrar.

Post 2
Setup spec, no indies.

Post 3
Sees what bessie was trying to do, some reads (don’t agree with the reason for finding Mark town), unvotes.

Post 4
Not following the reasoning of this post, but ends with some very sensible advice for Vicarin.

Post 5
Hmmm.

Post 6
Volunteers to accept Madge’s present.

Post 7
Scum read on moody with no reasons given.

Post 8
Fishing for Sabrar’s reason?


LaserGuy post summary
Spoiler:
Post 1
Votes bessie for an invalid reason.

Post 2
heury and mpolo townie vibe.

Post 3
Rule clarification.

Post 4
Mark town.

Post 5
heury town cuz tone.

Post 6
Doesn’t see why his read of bessie is invalid (or just won’t acknowledge it).

Post 7
Questions Madge’s vote.

Post 8
Claims working knowledge of oracle (questionable, as he still hasn’t explained his misreading of bessie).
Sabrar reserved.

Post 9
Vote Madge.

Post 10
Official revote Madge. Scum have daychat.


Madge post summary
Spoiler:
Post 0
Confirm/game content.

Post 1
bessie’s town and I’m SDK!

Post 2
Vote Sabrar, asks Sabrar to provide the reasons she is voting for him.
Asks bessie to provide the reasons Madge is confident in bessie town statement.
Remainder of post is usual D1 Madge and scummy but NAI.

Post 3
I’m still SDK!

Post 4
Flips on bessie and fishes Sabrar. I think she’s playing SDK in Shakespeare III mafia, because this pretty much follows SDK’s template in that game.

Post 5
Yep. See comment Post #4…

Post 6
…except that she could be scum (note her point of view).


Mark_Cangila post summary
Spoiler:
Post 0
Confirm, RL information, non game content.

Post 1
BoomFrog analysis.

Post 2
Question for the mod (secondary win con).

Post 3
Got it.

Post 4
Setup speculation (conflicts with assumptions that can be gleaned from the signup post and OP).

Post 5
Questions Sabrar re BoomFrog.

Post 6
BoomOracle speculation (in response to bessie).

Post 7
No issues with bessie.

Post 8
Responses to bessie. Asks bessie a question that is as of now still unanswered.

Post 9
FoS wam for low content (possibly missed that wam gave advance notice that he would be away).

Post 10
Per bessie request, analyzes bessie-BoomOracle interaction.


Ninja'd by moody, will incorporate his latest post and continue in a few minutes. Note that I didn't check all the links to make sure they pointed to the right post.

Ninja'd again by heury. Will review.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby bessie » Sat Jul 28, 2018 7:43 pm UTC

moody7277 post summary
Spoiler:
Post 1
Sheeps Sabrar, duplicating his earlier error, RVS Vicarin.

Post 2
Question for mod.

Post 3
Pokes Madge.

Post 4
Baaaaa. This post has already been discussed by me.
viewtopic.php?p=4377321#p4377321
viewtopic.php?p=4377378#p4377378
Open question about it here.

Post 5
Covering for his mistake in Post #1 and quickly flips it by going on the offensive to Sabrar.

Post 6
Misunderstood my issue with Post #4.

Post 7
Noise.

Post 8
More noise.

Post 9
Reads list. I already responded.

Post 10
Defensive response to heury, warns of possible LaserGuy-Sabrar team.


mpolo post summary
Spoiler:
Post 1
I could be a miller, and there could be multiple anti-town factions depending on how I interpret my role pm.

Post 2
Claims secondary win condition. BoomOracle analysis.

Post 3
Setup spec. Like Mark, he did not read the signup sheet carefully, but unlike with Mark, Vicarin doesn’t seem too bothered by it.

Post 4
Setup.


Sabrar post summary
Spoiler:
Post 1
Claims secondary win con, setup spec (with error), RVS LaserGuy.

Post 2
Reply to bessie (note that later content implies this is one reason for his scum read of her). Suspicious question to BoomFrog re the current BoomGambit. I poked him about it here.

Post 3
Response to Mark re Post #2.

Post 4
Aknowledges error in Post #1. Made another error in this:
Sabrar wrote: BTW I made a mistake with my last setup-speculation, 7-1-1-1 adds up to 10 players only, meant to type 7-1-1-1-1. I find it interesting that noone noticed and corrected. It suggests to me that some players didn't really care about actual setup-numbers and just said that my numbers look okay to appear being helpful. I bet we find scum in {bessie, moody, Vicarin, wam}.
I never said your numbers look OK.

Post 5
Some replies. Characteristic Sabrar content.

Post 6
bessie could be scum.

Post 7
Current notes/reads. As others have attempted to do, he tries to give some sensible advice for Vicarin. Votes Vicarin, second choice is bessie.

Post 8
Bessie no RVS.

Post 9
Reply to BoomFrog, fishing expedition unsuccessful.

I think that Sabrar should have expected this answer from BoomFrog, see this.

Post 10
Hmm, no wonder he’s been so reserved.

Post 11
LaserGuy town.

Post 12
moody D2 lynch…

Post 13
…I’ll explain why later.

Post 14
Agrees with LaserGuy’s modread.


wam post summary
Spoiler:
Post 1
Setup, I already questioned him on this here, awaiting response.

Post 2
I’m back, and I’m town, anyone that suspects me is suspicious!


Back with some analysis in a bit.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby bessie » Sat Jul 28, 2018 9:02 pm UTC

Woof

Mark_Cangila – Newbie townie vibe. Hard to point to anything in particular.

BoomFrog – The BoomOracle is NAI; I can see BoomFrog playing the first few days without even reading his role pm, but reading the role pm was probably required, since some roles required pre-game choices. Regardless, I get a townie vibe.

mpolo – Needs some content besides setup spec.

Sabrar – Not sure. I switched him around on this list a few times, but for now I think I will leave him here. I expected a little more activity this weekend, but I think that perhaps he is still in his data gathering stage, and is at a slight standstill waiting for wam to catch up, and for some actual reads from mpolo. He’s already put out a couple strong scum and town reads, so he’s definitely not active lurking.

heuristically_alone – Getting a slight townie vibe, which is not the usual; I usually read him as scum. So I’m cautious about my gut read.

LaserGuy – Hmm. Not sure. I have some personal issues with LaserGuy’s style that have always bothered me, but I feel that after Alien Warfare I understand this a little better. I have difficulty seeing Post #10 from scum.

wam – Insufficient data for more than a gut feeling, putting him here for now.

Madge – SDK or scum? It can be difficult to tell the two apart. Aarrrrggghhh, scum reading Madge for me has become like something off the bessie D1 checklist (greet newbies, confirmation post analysis, setup spec, snark at Sabrar, scum read Madge, tunnel, etc). I need to carefully consider if I really suspect her or if I’m guilty of pre conceived bias.

moody7277 – Everything about moody’s content feels wrong to me. Leaning scum.

Vicarin – Indie/scum.

Grrr

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Sabrar » Sat Jul 28, 2018 9:21 pm UTC

bessie wrote:I expected a little more activity this weekend, but I think that perhaps he is still in his data gathering stage, and is at a slight standstill waiting for wam to catch up, and for some actual reads from mpolo.
Right, I have to find the balance between providing content and waiting on how others react to certain situations so that I may judge them.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Sat Jul 28, 2018 9:25 pm UTC

Votals:

Vicarin - 2 (Sabrar, bessie)
Sabrar - 1 (Madge)
Boomfrog - 1 (Vicarin)
Madge - 1 (LaserGuy)

Not Voting: BoomFrog, wam, Mark_Cangila, mpolo, moody7277, heuristically_alone

11 alive, 6 to lynch (as previously mentioned). Deadline in 3 days and 20.5 hours. Countdown timer.

Please remember to unvote if you switch your vote.
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Vicarin » Sun Jul 29, 2018 12:46 am UTC

@bessie: seeing as I reread the first few posts I made in NNYMafia and found 2 similar statements I think it's just a habit of mine. Unless you want to check my other games further, I'm not sure what the issue is.

If you're not following the voting syntax correctly, well, that seems to change pretty much every game. But I do expect you to be paying more attention than that.

Also, you can hold any disappointment in the mods for later. The way it works is that if wam is town, I need him to survive until the end of the game, and if he isn't, he needs to die first out of any non-town. Hence the slight time sensitivity of getting a good read. While I probably won't succeed in the wincon, I don't see any huge problem for us in general if I try to sort it out D1 beyond you jumping on me.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Vicarin » Sun Jul 29, 2018 12:57 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:Also pretty sure jimbob modslipped scum have daychat.
Oh, I see it now. Good catch.


?????

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby bessie » Sun Jul 29, 2018 1:22 am UTC

Vicarin wrote:@bessie: seeing as I reread the first few posts I made in NNYMafia and found 2 similar statements I think it's just a habit of mine. Unless you want to check my other games further, I'm not sure what the issue is.

Ok, I stand corrected.
Vicarin wrote: Usually the PRs would just keep quiet anyway if they don't get a hit, so I'm not sure how this plan actually benefits us much?
Also noted that you were fishing for opinions on using your power in that post.

Vicarin wrote:If you're not following the voting syntax correctly, well, that seems to change pretty much every game. But I do expect you to be paying more attention than that.
Me too. I totally glossed over it when I scrutinized the opening post a dozen different ways for mod confirmation that alignments were randomly distributed.

Vicarin wrote:Also, you can hold any disappointment in the mods for later. The way it works is that if wam is town, I need him to survive until the end of the game, and if he isn't, he needs to die first out of any non-town. Hence the slight time sensitivity of getting a good read. While I probably won't succeed in the wincon, I don't see any huge problem for us in general if I try to sort it out D1 beyond you jumping on me.
I am skeptical that this is a secondary win condition (or even the complete truth).


And if it is, I apologize in advance for this, but hahaha if wam is town Oh me yarm this is pretty cruel......

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby heuristically_alone » Sun Jul 29, 2018 1:37 am UTC

At this rate I highly doubt we are launching when first, unless he says something to do incriminate himself.
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Vicarin » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:22 am UTC

bessie wrote: I am skeptical that this is a secondary win condition (or even the complete truth).

And if it is, I apologize in advance for this, but hahaha if wam is town Oh me yarm this is pretty cruel......


You're always skeptical when I'm sharing information :cry:

And yeah, I'm not very optimistic about managing to fulfill it.

On that note, @wam: Got your initial reads at some point?

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby bessie » Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:33 am UTC

Vicarin wrote:On that note, @wam: Got your initial reads at some point?

So where are your reads? In your content all I see is some suspicion on BoomFrog for his choice of playstyle. You haven’t offered a read on anyone. You’ve only responded to a few questions and all your responses have been pretty much neutral.

If you’re town, shouldn’t you be um, like, SCUM HUNTING, not just trying to fulfill an OPTIONAL secondary win condition. Or are your opinions on everyone and everything else (except the setup) a big secret until wam shows up?

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby bessie » Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:35 am UTC

mpolo, it would be nice to see something besides setup spec / game mechanics from you too.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:12 am UTC

I've seen enough concerns with Vicarin to vote him.
Vote: Vicarin
Unless something in his playstyle changes massively, he's gonna remain my choic of lynch target.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby heuristically_alone » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:16 am UTC

I don't know, Vicarin is always fishing for information no matter the role. What is it that concerns you, Mark?
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:31 am UTC

His lack of confidence in most things. As bessie said, anything he says seems to end in a question mark. The only real content he has provided has been setup speculation.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Vicarin » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:48 am UTC

Eh, not much else going on at the moment I guess.

Reads:

heuristically_alone: Actually seems pretty good overall, but I'd like more content. I don't agree with all his reads, but hey, I can somewhat see where he's coming from I guess?

Sabrar: After the initial post, has reduced the amount of information in each post dramatically, compared to previous games. Claims to be hanging back at the moment to analyze what people have said later on today, I'd really like to see this.

BoomFrog: Still being really annoyingly obtuse with his phrasing, still has somewhat ok information? Still just want him to say stuff normally instead of using 20 words where 5 would suffice, and giving room to hide in the interpretation of his words. Will update when he stops with this silliness.

wam: way too little information. Ask again later.

moody7277: I don't really know what to make of his posts, actually. Lots of random comments, and he seems to do them whether town or scum in previous games.

Madge: After her remarkably good contributions in Meta Mafia, I was hoping that she'd be putting more out on D1. Here, it looks like she'd trying to hide being obtuse behind roleplaying as SDK, and has also straight up refused to speculate on the setup. Has commented on a few people being townie or scummy, but without reasons. Ugh.

LaserGuy: Been fairly quiet so far, used to having more information from him at this point. Could be him trying to shake up his meta some more. Not sure what to make of him at the moment.

bessie: Actually a remarkably large amount of content so far, more so than Sabrar right now I think (!!!). Getting the feeling that her attacks on me are most similar to those of Stellaris Mafia, which would make her scum again. Have to mull over what LaserGuy and I chatted over in Alien Warfare though, I think, seeing as our playstyles are just going to clash a lot in general.

Mark_Cangila: I still feel that people are giving him too much of a free pass, as a fair chunk of his content is not terribly useful as I explained before, and there's also time spent discussing what BoomFrog means with his statements (another reason for him to stop). I want him to provide more reads of people in general, seeing as the only one he has given is of wam, which was just relating to his lack of content.

mpolo: miller claims are always interesting. Not much information beyond that other than setup speculation (and a small Mark read), which included something that he got wrong (choosing red or black was impossible). Ask again later.

On that note @bessie, I did miss that too, but I'm going to claim it was because I didn't know that the signups wasn't an exhaustive list of ajah colours :P

Most scummy are Mark, bessie, Madge, most townie is h_a.

Ninjaed by Mark: If you're going to sheep on people, make sure you read everything they've posted carefully.

Mark_Cangila wrote:His lack of confidence in most things. As bessie said, anything he says seems to end in a question mark. The only real content he has provided has been setup speculation.


bessie wrote:
Vicarin wrote:@bessie: seeing as I reread the first few posts I made in NNYMafia and found 2 similar statements I think it's just a habit of mine. Unless you want to check my other games further, I'm not sure what the issue is.

Ok, I stand corrected.


Do you have any reasons for voting me that are your own?

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby LaserGuy » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:53 am UTC

moody7277 wrote:LaserGuy meta-gaming the mod is humourous, but also interesting how he's decided to back up heury.


What do you mean by this? How am I backing up heury?

D2 is probably in time to give the rest of town to make use of my flip. I just want people to keep track of the Sabrar-LG bloc that has all of a sudden crystallized.


How are we a bloc, exactly?

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby LaserGuy » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:58 am UTC

Vicarin wrote:LaserGuy: Been fairly quiet so far, used to having more information from him at this point. Could be him trying to shake up his meta some more. Not sure what to make of him at the moment.


You haven't asked me anything this game. What more information do you need to sort me?

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby bessie » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:06 am UTC

Vicarin wrote:bessie: Actually a remarkably large amount of content so far, more so than Sabrar right now I think (!!!).
There are reasons. For one, I have more time on weekends. My content will drop on weekdays since I don’t play at work, so I only post later at night, with the occasional morning post (I made a special effort and got up early so I would have time to post last Thursday morning). I’ll be at work at D1 deadline.

Vicarin wrote: Getting the feeling that her attacks on me are most similar to those of Stellaris Mafia, which would make her scum again.
Hmmm. Interesting. Can you give some examples, and compare the similar aspects of my gameplay in this game and in Stellaris, and how this differs from my town games? Because unless you can do that, you’re just name dropping.

Vicarin wrote:On that note @bessie, I did miss that too, but I'm going to claim it was because I didn't know that the signups wasn't an exhaustive list of ajah colours :P
I’m flavor blind too, only knew it from playing the previous game. mpolo and LaserGuy read the books, I think most of us haven't though.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby LaserGuy » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:07 am UTC

Also @Vic: Were you given a choice of three players as your person of interest for your secondary? If so, why did you choose wam?

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby LaserGuy » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:35 am UTC

Quick reads:

heuristically_alone: Town heury is charming. Scum heury is abraisive. This is Town heury.
Sabrar: Low content and aggression from him is interesting. Most of what I see looks okay, but keeping an eye on him for playing outside his meta. Leaning town.
BoomFrog: Roleplay is NAI for him. Most of what I see looks okay, though I'd like to see more of it. Leaning Town.
wam: Null for now.
moody7277: Kind of active lurky. Seems to be throwing a lot of shade at people without really backing it up. Leaning scum.
Madge: Apparently missed the part of SDK's meta where he actually is quite open, aggressive, and posts a lot of content as Town (well, as scum too). This feels like an excuse to active lurk. Scummy.
Vicarin: Reads are extremely surface level, mostly focusing on how much people have posted (or complaining about their lack of posting) rather than looking at what they've said. Very few firm conclusions about anyone. Agree with the comments from bessie that it feels he's been too focused on his secondary. Leaning scum.
bessie: Aside from her initial response to my early vote, most of her content seems okay. Moving her to Town lean.
Mark_Cangila: Feels open, genuine and relaxed. Comfortable Town read.
mpolo: Tone and openness in content generally point to Town here. Town lean.


Town
LaserGuy
heury
Mark
mpolo
Sabrar
BoomFrog
bessie

wam ------ neutral line

Vicarin
moody
Madge
Scum

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Sabrar » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:38 am UTC

I've ignored bessie for too long and she deserves more than just a few lines.

Major point against her (not the Gojoe post, tell was made public so won't be used in the future): not commenting on my mistake in setup-spec. She claims that it doesn't mean anything because "I never said your numbers look OK." however town!bessie always pays great attention to my content and would definitely say if she found something amiss. This will also tie into my second point in a bit.
bessie copied the different setup-specs under each other and had 7-2-1-1 right on top of 7-1-1-1, still not a peep to be heard. I think this either comes from the fact that she paid less attention to the actual numbers because she already had a pretty good idea, or from the second point I'm about to discuss.

Previously minor point against her that is upgraded to major seeing how it also appears in the first part: going into this game this was going to be the tell that I planned to use to read bessie D1. It basically boils down to the fact that town!bessie is always suspicious of me while scum!bessie knows that my gambit is coming from town so she tolerates it (best example is Secret Santa 2017 where nobody understood what I was doing and bessie didn't even try to figure out, except in scum-chat).
Therefore it was a huge red sign for her to dismiss the reveal of my secondary win-con, however the reasoning for it is absolutely valid and could theoretically be coming from town!her. But now that she's alluding to having noticed my error and not correcting it deliberately this point again comes into play.

Major townie points for Madge calling her town right off the bat. Unless they are scum-mates it just doesn't make sense. Plus Madge can probably read her better than average (SS 17 again).

Major townie points for having the same 2 players at the bottom of her list. Despite her claiming somewhat otherwise I don't think she would bus this hard this early (but might if it's true about day-chat).

And there is still something I want to wait with.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Vicarin » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:39 am UTC

LaserGuy wrote:
Vicarin wrote:LaserGuy: Been fairly quiet so far, used to having more information from him at this point. Could be him trying to shake up his meta some more. Not sure what to make of him at the moment.

You haven't asked me anything this game. What more information do you need to sort me?

Sure.

Have you got any current reads lists? Can you explain the modslip? What in particular made/makes you think Mark is town? Any guesses for setup spec?

LaserGuy wrote:Also @Vic: Were you given a choice of three players as your person of interest for your secondary? If so, why did you choose wam?


Pffff no, it was assigned randomly, I asked.

bessie wrote:
Vicarin wrote: Getting the feeling that her attacks on me are most similar to those of Stellaris Mafia, which would make her scum again.
Hmmm. Interesting. Can you give some examples, and compare the similar aspects of my gameplay in this game and in Stellaris, and how this differs from my town games? Because unless you can do that, you’re just name dropping.


Well, out of the completed games we've played together (NNYMafia, Stellaris, and Alien Warfare), you've correctly read me as town on D1 reasonably easily in the games where you were town, while in Stellaris you had no strong opinion and then eventually went hard on the attack on D2. Here, you're spending many posts just going after me in particular, and only doing light interaction with other people. Hence, strongly reminds me of Stellaris. Even in Alien Warfare where we ended up arguing a bunch D2 over what you interpreted as fishing, you were still interacting with a lot of other people at the same time.

Ninja'd by LaserGuy: Well, I guess that answers some stuff.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby mpolo » Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:21 am UTC

I've got to organize my thoughts more, but so as to at least get something out here:

Sabrar feels townie. I need to try to discern why he has this certainty about who our D2 lynch needs to be. I missed the so-called mod-slip, and have to look back at that as well.

LaserGuy brought up said mod-slip. This is not in scum's interest, so at least some town points there. Of course, it could be a gambit -- if that is the case, Sabrar is probably in on it.

BoomFrog's oracular posting style is harder to read, but is feeling more and more townie with time. If his secondary win condition is simply the oracular posting, I would agree that it is a tool that can cut two ways.

Bessie is looking pretty typical, which means I tend to lazily dump her in the town category. Sabrar has pointed out a couple of minor points against her, so I have to be careful of this.

Vicarin is fishing about wam for a secondary win condition. This is not necessarily a sign of being anti-town, particularly with the amount of randomization involved, but does make me wary.
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby moody7277 » Sun Jul 29, 2018 1:19 pm UTC

@LaserGuy: your comment on how you "caught" jimbob slipping about what kind of chat scum have came after my discussion with h_a about chat which is what makes it seem like you were backing him up. The other thing is that I am uncomfortable with the groupthink you and Sabrar developed all of a sudden when the only group right now is scum, whether they have day or N0 chat.

Looking back at jimbob's posts, the closest he comes to mentioning it is "no comment" when asked about it. Is it his lack of specifically saying "night chat only" that makes you think they have daychat?
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Tigerlion wrote:Well, I imagine as the game progresses, various people will be getting moody.


BoomFrog wrote:I still have no idea what town moody really looks like.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby wam » Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:17 pm UTC

Right so back getting up to speed.

Setup: Yep I completely missed the 7-1-1-1 as others have said I was rushed had a quick look at the game and went yeah that seems alright. Having thought it through more I get back to mafia is fundamentally meant to be an unkowning majority (town) against a knowing minority (mafia). Therefore I would be suprised if there wasn't at least 1 anti town faction with 2 or more players. However, I haven't played any previous WOT so I don't know how crazy Jimbob likes to go with the setups.

Reads:

Bessie:
So initial read was standard Day 1 bessie. Then there was the tunnel on vic. Reading through it I found myself agreeing with the case. Then I thought back to stellaris where we managed to get vic lynched on a similar fishing case when he was town. Having looked back at stellaris I feel the case is actually similar. So I'm putting bessie at neutral so far.

Boomfrog:
Too dangerous to live! On a more serious note, The oracle posting is something I can see Boom doing as either alingment. However it does allow him to conceal slips easier. And then I saw this

BoomFrog wrote:We seek a team of three with ill intent.
.


We don;t know the size of the scum team, see earlier setup speculation. This is a pretty bad slip to me.

Vote: Boomfrog

Huery:
REading through I like the posts, seems to be scum hunting. Nothing massive stands out to me though. Leaning town.

Laser:

A lot of short posts which seems like a style change but I'm not sure if it means anything. Not that many opinions but it is early day 1. Leaning town.

Madge

A lot of weirdness but I suppose that is down to the attempt at role playing SDK. Nothing that really jumps out either way to me. Neutral.

Mark:

Noticed the same thing about booms posts i did but didn't really follow up on it. Lots of posts compared to normal. I am getting a newbie town vibe as well. Only caveat to that is if as others have pointed out scum have day chat I could see some of the posts coming from coaching. - Leaning town.

Moody:

REads like standard moody posts to me. I am liking the content - Town.

Mpolo:

Possible Miller claim which weirdly doenst seem to have been disscussed at all. I treat all miller and the like claims with great suspicion but I don't think people gambit like that any more.

Sabrar:
If Sabrar was a scum PGO his claim about his secondary win condition is the exact thing I would expect. Countering that I think a scum PGO is very very unlikely. The rest of the content is standard Sabrar. I started to get annoyed at the D2 lynch comment then decided it wasn't worth it as its never got me anywhere before.

Vicarin:

As stated the fishing is suspicous but having puushed a mis lycnh based on it in stellaris I am suspicous of people pushing it as a lynch. The focus on me based on a secondary win condition is wierd. Neutral read at the moment.
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:53 pm UTC

What is a scum pgo?

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:01 pm UTC

I can see a few reasons for this line in BFs post:
BoomFrog wrote:We seek a team of three with ill intent

1. He is scum and slipped. I find this unlikely, considering writing as an oracle would require spending more time on them, allowing you to catch these mistakes.
2. He has some sort of oracle power which told hin this. I find this unlikely, as balancing it would be a pain in the ass, and how does Jimbob decide what info he gets. I doubt this one.
3. If you read the rest of his talking while in the Oracle voice, he says things as surety. This, for example:
BoomFrog wrote:How unfortunate for us all that Bessie is scum.

He says it as a statement of fact. I think that is what happened with the team of three statement. He is speculating that there are 3 members on the scum team.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby wam » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:05 pm UTC

Pgo is a paranoid gun owner. Role where anyone who targets them at night dies. I have seen variations where it is 1 of the players that target them.
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby wam » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:06 pm UTC

Mark I read it as a statement of fact. Will see what boom says.
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby LaserGuy » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:55 pm UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:As I am also quite busy during the following days, it would be helpful if everybody could send in their night actions as soon as possible after day end (or even before day end if they prefer).


Modslip is here for those asking about it. Implication is scum would be able to coordinate their night actions on this timeline. So either daychat or no chat (as WoT2 had) seems likely.

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby LaserGuy » Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:16 pm UTC

Moving wam into my scum pile. Some of those reads are very alarming

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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby wam » Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:21 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:Moving wam into my scum pile. Some of those reads are very alarming


Which ones?
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby BoomFrog » Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:52 pm UTC

Mark_Cangila wrote:3. If you read the rest of his talking while in the Oracle voice, he says things as surety. This, for example:
BoomFrog wrote:How unfortunate for us all that Bessie is scum.

He says it as a statement of fact. I think that is what happened with the team of three statement. He is speculating that there are 3 members on the scum team.

Mmm... *nods* Just so.

wam wrote:Mark I read it as a statement of fact. Will see what boom says.
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby wam » Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:55 pm UTC

wam wrote:Mark I read it as a statement of fact. Will see what boom says.
The acrobat does not drop his cup.
The surgeon will not struggle with a knot.
How can you think I am a master of deception and a failure at once?[/quote]

Even one who is master of their art can make a mistake worthy of the beginner .
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Re: Wheel of Time 3 - A Divided Sisterhood (D1)

Postby wam » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:11 pm UTC

Also this illustrates the issue I was flagging as if this was a scum boom mistake he can now hide it in the oracleness
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